An Angry Obama Lashes Out After Gun Control Defeat

Stoned faced and curt, the President used unusually pointed words to criticize the 45 Senators, including four Democrats, who successfully defeated the bill...

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Jacquelyn Martin / AP

President Barack Obama speaks in the Rose Garden of the White House on April 17, 2013, in Washington, D.C.

Calling the defeat of his gun control efforts “a pretty shameful day for Washington,” a defiant and angry President Barack Obama announced in the Rose Garden Wednesday that the fight would go on.

Stoned faced and curt, the President used unusually pointed words to criticize the 45 Senators, including four Democrats, who successfully defeated the bill, which would have expanded mandatory background checks to gun shows and online sales. Obama said the bill met his own test of worthwhile gun regulation, but “too many Senators failed theirs.” Vice President Joe Biden stood with a fixed grimace to his left, as families of victims from the Sandy Hook Elementary shooting and former Rep. Gabby Giffords stood nearby, fighting back tears. Dour-looking aides looked on from the colonnade.

“I’ve heard some say that blocking this step would be a victory. And my question is, a victory for who?” he continued. “All that happened today was the preservation of the loophole that lets dangerous criminals buy guns without a background check. That didn’t make our kids safer.”

His harsh words signaled the start of a next phase in the gun control debate, when advocates for more restrictions plan a more combative effort to pressure members of Congress, and denounce the National Rifle Association, in the run up to the 2014 midterm elections. “The gun lobby and its allies willfully lied about the bill,” Obama angrily said. “They claimed that it would create some sort of ‘big brother’ gun registry, even though the bill did the opposite. This legislation, in fact, outlawed any registry.”

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Obama’s condemnation was joined by others who promise to continue to push for new gun control measures. New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, who has promised to fund a multi-million dollar ad campaign against those who block new gun controls, said in a statement that the vote was a “damning indictment of the stranglehold that special interests have on Washington.” He blamed both parties for the defeat. “Democrats – who are so quick to blame Republicans for our broken gun laws – could not stand united,” he said in a statement. “And Republicans – who are so quick to blame Democrats for not being tough enough on crime – handed criminals a huge victory, by preserving their ability to buy guns illegally at gun shows and online and keeping the illegal trafficking market well-fed.”

“In 2014, our ever-expanding coalition of supporters will work to make sure that voters don’t forget,” Bloomberg added.

Giffords, who recently founded an outside group that aims to raise millions to advertise in the 2014 election around the gun issue, immediately sent a fundraising appeal to supporters. “It’s clear to me that if members of the U.S. Senate refuse to change the laws to reduce gun violence, then we need to change the members of the U.S. Senate,” she wrote in an email. Obama’s own activist group, Organizing for Action, also sent out statements calling for a response. “President Obama just called us to action to keep fighting to prevent gun violence,” said Jon Carson, the new group’s leader. “Let’s get to work.”

For Obama, the defeat was a long-time coming on an issue that while supported by the overwhelming majority of the public remains a touchstone for a vocal and well-organized minority. He invested more political capital in the gun control effort than any other issue in the first months of his second term, taking to the road, delivering press statements, and giving multiple interviews in support of the effort. In the White House’s mind, the Senate compromise deal, which was supported by four GOP senators, had given Republicans an opening to get in line with 90 percent of voters. Now Obama will return to the power of the bully pulpit and the campaign trail with an eye on the 2014 midterm elections.

“The real impact is going to have to come from the voters,” Obama said.

Mark Barden, the father of Sandy Hook Elementary shooting victim Daniel, age 7, spoke for the families in the Rose Garden and introduced President Obama. “We are not going away,” he said. “We will not be defeated. We are not defeated and we will not be defeated.”

Chris Cox, the chief lobbyist for the National Rifle Association, also released a statement after the Senate vote, calling the effort misguided. “Expanding background checks, at gun shows or elsewhere, will not reduce violent crime or keep our kids safe in their schools,” the statement said. “The NRA will continue to work with Republicans and Democrats who are committed to protecting our children in schools, prosecuting violent criminals to the fullest extent of the law, and fixing our broken mental health system.”

358 comments
imaplague
imaplague

George VreelandHill, all i need to say is that you are ignorant and unpatriotic. Those with sense will understand what i mean. Don't come running to me and all the "gun lovers" when it all goes down and you need someone to protect you. 


sincerely 

Jeremy Wade

GeorgeVreelandHill
GeorgeVreelandHill

Gun control is needed now!
The NRA and other gun lovers use the Second Amendment as proof of their right to bear arms.
The Second Amendment is outdated and is of no use in today's society.
In fact, the Second Amendment was written as a right to bear arms for colonists to protect themselves against other colonists, Indians and to form a militia in case the British invaded farms and other private lands.
To use it today as a law is very silly.
If that is all the NRA and their followers have to justify their use of guns, then they will soon lose the fight over gun control.
It is a matter of time.
Guns that are used to kill other people such as pistols, assault weapons and others must be banned.
They have no business being in people's hands.
Our right to be free from gun violence far outweighs any right to bear arms.
We have had enough of it all.
By the way, some people claim that if guns were banned, then only criminals would have guns.
BS.
Taking guns out of society means no guns for criminals to get a hold of.
In time, the weapons would thin out to almost nothing as they become less and less available to them.
The NRA does not want people to understand that.
By the way, the NRA needs it behind kicked.

George Vreeland Hill

timefelix
timefelix

In my opinion gun control should definitely be intensified! What happened in the last years alone is shocking. Of course it is hard to implement such a change, because, although there are many advocates of gun control, there will always be people who are against it, as guns are a part of their life and they believe to act in a good way by owning a gun to protect yourself.

But I think that if guns were not as available as they are in America, there would not be so much disaster in the first place! And if people are saying that the "right to own a weapon" is justified as it is in the constitution, is pathetic to me.

I find the saying: "Guns don't kill people, people kill people" reasonable, but if the people who kill people would not have such easy access to firearms, a lot of misery could be prevented.


All I can say is that I am genuinely for gun control, as the current situation in the United States is not tolerable to me.

pappawheelie
pappawheelie

Hey obama Congress has spoken!!! Take your toys and go home now!!!

pappawheelie
pappawheelie

Its the second Amendment for a reason!

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

KurtHanson
KurtHanson

background checks = more government beaurocratic (sic) jobs = MORE DEMOCRATIC PARTY VOTES. And Obama is sad this will not be the result. Everything else written in the article is irrelevant.

Call me cynical. But the press is clueless to the reality of the situation with our political process.

Tucci
Tucci

O.K. people, listen up. Let me throw out a few FACTS to confuse you and to shut up all you stupid people that are just making stuff up as you go(“it’s not 90% but more like 4%). I am not talking to the reasonable people who can 1) think for themselves, 2) seem to be intelligent, and 3) not blindly believe everything you are told, but actually ask questions and do your own research(sadly, this is a small group). This is for all you self-serving, self-righteous, sheep like, lock step, unintelligent idiots that want to just say stupid instead of at least doing a tiny bit of due diligence before shooting your mouths off. And don’t worry; I typed this out real slow for you dumber people who can’t understand fast talking city folks like me. Here we go!!!! :) continued

Tucci
Tucci

1) Obama is not king. Obama does not get to write his own laws. Yes, he does have some “executive authority”, but those are limited at best. Obama did not pass Obamacare, congress did. He just signed it. Read your constitution people. That’s how it works. Neither the Senate, the House of Representatives, nor the White House gets to write laws all on their own. There has to be some form of consensus. It was written by YOUR elected officials. Don’t like what they do, vote them out. Easy peasy. Quit sending the same people (some for over 30+ years) and (wait for it, wait for it) HOPE THINGS ARE GOING TO CHANGE!! Holy schamolly!!!!!!!!!  continued

Tucci
Tucci

2) This is not about abortion, slavery, or the evil empire. It is about expanding background checks at gun shows so convicted felons and sociopaths cannot get guns as easily as they can now. This was not about Obama’s ego. The man is passionate about something, and you people attack his very existence. Guess what folks, whether you like it or not, he is EVERYONE’S president. You don’t get to pick and choose. Either play by the rules, change the rules, or take a one way flight to Mother Russia (I hear the winters there are absolutely breathtaking!!). To quote that famous British philosopher, Mick Jagger, “you don’t always get what you want (sing it with me now!!). My god, stop whining. continueed

Tucci
Tucci

3) Stop with the stupidity and outright lies. Stop listening to Beck, Hannity, O’Reilly, Maddow, Matthews, Sharpton, N.R.A. and NOW. Start thinking for your selves. The poll mentioned by Obama about 92% of people support this concept of background checks, please see the 12th poll on http://www.gallup.com/poll/1645/guns.aspx . And while you are at it, take a peek a poo at the rest of the polls on this page. Also, the bill did not set up a national gun registry that the N.R.A. lied and said it did. Please refer to http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2013/apr/18/barack-obama/obama-says-bipartisan-background-check-plan-outlaw/ . continued

Tucci
Tucci

This nation has become a nation of TAKERS, not givers. Hell, we are even a debtor nation, not a creditor nation anymore(for you simpletons that means we borrow more then we lend). Let me quote another famous philosopher, John Kennedy, “ASK NOT WHAT YOUR COUNTRY CAN DO FOR YOU, BUT ASK, WHAT CAN YOU DO FOR YOUR COUNRTY”. Wise man, that, dare I say it, Democrat.

And just so you know where I am coming from, I am a conservative who did not vote for Obama. I am just a guy interested in the truth not getting trampled by a bunch of uninformed, self-serving, extremist idiots. Have a nice day. J

p.s. I dare anyone to prove me wrong. Show me FACTS people, not emotional, uneducated crap. If you are correct, I will be the first to admit it. Bring it people!

Patriot54
Patriot54

It is interesting how people will bring issues like abortion into a gun discussion. What many seem to forget is that the ten ammendments are the foundation this country was built on. The discussion on speech, guns, religion and other rights are mostly just opinion. The Supreme Court has upheld the second ammendment multiple times and yet the attacks keep coming. Abortion is not in the bill of rights. It is still a very emotional issue. Those who believe life begins at conception are just as right as those who do not believe that. I have my opinion but will not offer it out there except to say that for those who are pro life, to them their concerns about mass murder sanctioned by the government are very real and correct. To them. They should not suffer any more criticism for their belief than do the pro choice believers.

Patriot54
Patriot54

While the mentally ill problem is very real, one must be very very careful how such laws get enacted. There are medications out there that are prescribed for multiple conditions. The same medication can be described for menopause as for mental illness. Now suddenly, women in meopause become "mentally ill" and are a threat? That is a very slippery slope. Returning American soldiers are blocked from gun ownership because of "potential" PTSD. So we are saying, I am putting a gun in your hand, go out and risk your life for my freedom, when you get back you are to "damaged" to enjoy those same freedoms.

Patriot54
Patriot54

The people who want to further limit my gun rights would like to portray myself and others as uneducated backwoods sub humans. Obama makes comments like they "fall back on religion and guns" in as derogatory a manner as he can. Let's see.religion, isn't that another right under the first ten ammendments? I have been around for a loong time. I have owned firearms for over thirty years. I always pass the background checks. How am I a danger to anyone? Do we not get that "criminals" do not obey laws? Drugs have been illegal for decades, the drug problem has not gone away because criminals do not obey the laws. They will continue to get guns with or without the laws. The mentally ill, that is a different issue.

Patriot54
Patriot54

Here is another intersting fact. New York City is as you know just another city within New York State. They however, do not allow anyone from outside the city to carry handguns into the city. At the same time they insist and are allowed to carry upstate using their permits. The permits are New York State permits, not New York City. Does that make any sense? These are the types of actions that breed mistrust amongst us. Mistrust is why we cannot come together nationally on this issue. I for one do not believe that the anti-gun contingent will ever be satisfied until they disarm all Americans 100%. If my belief on that point is correct then I cannot allow them to methodically dismantle my right under the guise of "safety".

Patriot54
Patriot54

There is so much that can be gained from rational discussion. Has anyone tried to gather their own data on gun crimes? The FBI posts annual statistics availble to anyone. They report nationwide that 68% of homicides are commited with a handgun. In NY state there is a thorough background check and permit required. 26% are by knives and other weapons. 5% are rifles and shotguns. When you do the math, politicians should concentrate on restricting knives and "other" weapons as a priority over rifles and shotguns. Why don't they? My guess is that they do not see knives and bats as a threat to their authority and therefore dismiss it. Using the sad case of Sandy Hook and others to try to ram through their agenda is just shameful.

Patriot54
Patriot54

As for the Katrina story, does anyone believe the government collected "all" the guns? And now after Bostong, do we regiter pressure cookers? Remember Oklahoma City? You simply cannot protect against mass slayings without a totalitarion state. Even then it would not be enough. I prefer to live free as we do now, albeit already severely restricted, then to risk everything on a corrupt government controlled by rich corporations that care nothing for the masses.

Patriot54
Patriot54

You all should think about how policing works. These good people investigate and bring to justice the perpetrators as they did in Boston. They do not prevent even though they try most of the violence that happens. How many women's bodies were found strangled and knifed last year. The truth is that there are evil people out there and they will use whatever means they want to. As for the second ammendment, there is no debate, it is my right to excercise and not yours to take away. Everyone wanted a vote. They got one but did not like the outcome. Really? So they only want a vote if it goes their way I guess.

Patriot54
Patriot54

To those who use their first ammendment right to try and take my second ammendment right. How can you be so hypicritical? The ammendment only matters if you want to excercise your use of it? The second ammendment was put in place for two reasons alone. The first was to allow all citizens to protect themselves from any violence, which means their was the same potential threats to personal well being then as now. The second reason was to keep the citizens armed as a check to a government corruption descending into anything less than a free state. You already have politicans like Bloomberg attempting to limit what and how much you can eat or drink. Do any of us think it will stop there? As for portraying the NRA as a special interest group, absolutely, they represent the special interst of millions. Obama parades victims of gun violence in this relentless campaign of his. Even while I pray for some solace and peace to these victims I declare that I will not allow them to enable my family to be a victim.

trob6969
trob6969

...for all those who fear that background checks to buy guns would lead to gun confiscation from law abiding citizens, well guess what? If the the government chose to take your firearms they simply would, with or without a registry. For those of you that don't know, it ALREADY HAPPENED! After Hurricane Katrina the order to take away EVERYBODY'S guns went out in New Orleans and law enforcement went door-to-door and took them. They did this WITHOUT a registry. And the people who refused to give up their guns had them forcefully taken away.

sharon1111
sharon1111

He lectures as if he is our father and he knows best; yet I see no proof that he knows best about anything

sharon1111
sharon1111

90% ? where did that number come from? Every person that I have talked to didn't support it. So I guess I don't know any of the 90%.

collioure
collioure

I was hoping Sens. Manchin and Tommey had put something together that could lessen the frequency of these dreadful school shooting sprees, but all they did was draft a measure that would inconvenience lawful gun-owners and require more bureaucrats.

By default nutty Wayne LaPierre has put forward the only solution to protect our schoolchildren - armed guards. It underlines the fraud of the President's promises and the myth of effective gun control in the USA

RickThayer
RickThayer

Obama and Washington you talk out of both sides of your mouth. You say you want to save children from harms way with stiffer gun control but you murder millions of unborn children through abortion in your mandatory health care plan. Pull your head out of your butt we Americans are onto your ways of distorting our country and we are pissed.

SharonTomalavage
SharonTomalavage

what's wrong mikomiko does the truth hurt? You pro abortion terrorists love to kill the most vulnerable because they can't fight back. "The baby is an inconvenience, so kill it". How shameful !!! Once, a few years ago I talked with a pro Abortion advocate and during the course of our comversation, she admitted what the rest of you can't or won't--"yes, when push comes to shove, it's my right to do what I want with it, I shouldn't have my life screwed because of what's growing inside of me". How telling that she and this President (and others of your ilk) would say practically the very same thing. If you recall Obama mentioned why should his daughters be "punished" for a mistake they made"? yeah why? After all it's better to punish the no good baby -right??? You and others like you are a pitiful excuse for human beings. However, I think all life is valuable, even yours.

MichellesObamas
MichellesObamas

Is President Obama really concerned about the protection of citizens. I do not hear him clamoring from the rooftops to ban or have background checks on pressure cookers that were used in the "Boston Bombing." If he was really concerned about citizens he would tighten border patrols and limit immigration to the United States. Especially immigrants who hate us and wish to plant bombs to hurt us and commit other terrorist acts. 

MichellesObamas
MichellesObamas

Brady Law, in full Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act, an element of Pres. Bill Clinton’s 1993 crime bill. It called for a five-day waiting period for the purchase of a handgun and, after 1998, a background check of any individual purchasing a firearm from a federally licensed dealer. Before the measure became a law, it was popularly known as the Brady bill, named for James Brady, the White House press secretary who was seriously injured in the 1981 assassination attempt against Pres. Ronald Reagan. Brady, confined to a wheelchair and unable to resume his duties, campaigned hard for the bill, but it was fiercely opposed by the National Rifle Association (NRA), one of Washington’s most formidable interest groups. Even supporters of the Brady bill conceded that it was unlikely to have a major effect on crime, but they welcomed its passage as a step toward more limits on the easy availability of handguns in the United States. The waiting period aspect of the law went into effect on Feb. 28, 1994, and the background check provision came into force on Nov. 30, 1998, with the creation of the Federal Bureau of Investigation’s National Instant Criminal Background Check System database.

gigastrash
gigastrash

Why people should own a gun ? What is the point ?

I don't understand why some american insist that they should own gun in their homes ? Do you want to own gun for fun or self defense or what ?

Many countries in the world bans people from owning gun, and those countries have much lower crimes than USA

Tucci
Tucci

@KurtHanson I would respectfully disagree that this law would create more democratic party votes. Yes, it would increase bureaucracy, but the real culprit would be hand out programs that create an enormous new bureaucracy. Can you say ObamaCare? That is a law that will create tens of thousands of jobs, be a free give away to people, and bring MORE people to the government trough. And once there, they ain't leaving without a fight. That is the whole Democrat strategy. Give the people free stuff, and then claim the other guys want to take it away from you (even though you do not need/deserve it), and folks will vote Democrat every time. What is the battle cry of the Democratic Party? The Republicans are going to take away your social security benefits!! Lest we forget, the other side is just as bad. And the sad thing is, we keep putting back the same old crap year after year. As I said before, you people got what you paid for. 

starazor0
starazor0

@Tucci  I agree with your points, I too am a Republican. However, there was no need to insult us in the rural areas. In fact, we are the ones GIVING not TAKING in this nation. It's small communities that grow your food, and work in your plants. Yet, most of our tax dollars go to serve the masses in the suburban areas. We pay our taxes so sidewalks and streets are fixed every year elsewhere while we fix things ourselves. Most of us, just suck it up and move on. The only thing stupid about your argument is you don't even know who your target audience is.  I think your target audience is primarily the "fast talking city folk." Us non city folk don't have much time for talk. We're too busy getting things done. Some might say we're picking up the governments slack. But the responsibility  of building a community has already fallen onto the people. You "city folk" forgot that. And don't talk down to us  "non-city folk." We do more for this country than you think Tucci. So shut your mouth. 

JohnBarnes
JohnBarnes

@Tucci  

EVERY gun sold by EVERY gun dealer ALREADY has to go through a N.I.C.S. check, whether the sale takes place in a store or at a gun show.  There IS NO 'gun show loophole'.  It is a MYTH.  The only thing this would have accomplished is to ban ALL transfers between two private citizens.  No giving your father a pistol as a Christmas gift, no giving your son a hunting rifle or shotgun for his birthday, no loaning your rifle to your brother for an extended hunting trip, no leaving your collection to your heirs when you pass away.  All of these things would have been banned.  Every one of those would have been considered a 'transfer'.  Every one of them would have to be transferred to a gun dealer first, and then from the dealer to whoever it was supposed to go to.

KurtHanson
KurtHanson

@Tucci …, the problem is the 1.5 trillion in tax revenue every year. If you're a politician, how do you get just a sliver of that revenue to you and your friends, to those who helped you get elected, without going to jail in the process? Would there really be anything more important on your agenda than this? Never will  you hear an hour long "passionate" speech from Obama on the points for why he wants gun control as he saw it, or a speech on the merits or discredits of a major issue from any politician. The political frame of mind is the people are schmucks and just shove more laws  into the pipeline, and call it a day. 40,000 new laws were passed in State and Federal bodies in 2012. Is the world of daily lives of you or mine or anyone you know so complicated that there is this "need" to pass 40,000 new laws last year?

Excuse this impromptu tome for being all over the place. The Beast bit me recently. Still hurts.

Heian
Heian

Covering abortions through health care isn't "murdering children", considering abortions are not a) done against your will and b) done on actual children.

Seems like you need to "distort" quite a bit to make your flimsy point.

Tucci
Tucci

gigastrash, the genie is already out of the bottle. EVERYONE now has access to guns. The good guys AND the bad guys. There was a shooting in North Texas recently where an ARMED gunman attempted to rob a person. The victim was also armed and he was able to kill the attacker. Is that a good thing? I leave it up to you to decide. But what do you think would have happened to the victim if he was unarmed. Pull your head out of the sand, disarming good people will only leave the bad guys with guns, because somehow I don't think telling bad guys to turn in their guns will get much results. I'm cynical like that, I know.

trob6969
trob6969

Wise people own guns because we realize that despite how unlikely a violent attack might be, it still CAN happen anytime, anywhere and to anyone. And IF it does happen it could destroy you and/or your family. So why not be proactive and get a gun just in case?...I see it like wearing a seatbelt: I don't wear it expecting to get into a collision, I wear it in case I get into a collision.

MichellesObamas
MichellesObamas

@gigastrashTheSecond Amendment(Amendment II) to theUnited States Constitutionis the part of theUnited States Bill of Rightsthat protects the right to keep and bear arms. It was adopted on December 15, 1791, along with the rest of the Bill of Rights.

The right to bear arms predates the Bill of Rights; the Second Amendment was based partially on the right to bear arms in English common-law, and was influenced by the English Bill of Rights of 1689. This right was described by Blackstone as an auxiliary right, supporting the natural rights of self-defense, resistance to oppression, and the civic duty to act in concert in defense of the state. 

Tucci
Tucci

sstarazor0 Please accept my deepest apologies for the way my "city folks" comment came across. Please be assured, I have the UTMOST respect for the people who truly built this country, and "non-city folk" probably deserves the bulk of the credit for that.  I was being extremely sarcastic  because the stupidity some people had displayed on this comment section was beyond comprehension. Believe me when I say, it is folks like you that do make this country what it is, the greatest country in the history of mankind(warts and all). You are absolutely correct that the government has failed America miserably, and those of us who care about this country, our families, and our fellow man do have to pick up the slack. And you are also correct, it is our job in the first place. But both parties, in the bid to stay in power and be re-elected, versus doing their job,  have led the American public to the welfare trough at every opportunity and have enslaved a very large part of America. I just wish there were more givers in this country than takers. Again, you "non-city folk" are truly part of the solution, not part of the problem. Again, please accept my apologies, as that comment and pretty much all the derogatory comments were made in deep frustration, although some did need to be said. I was just so frustrated by the sheer ignorance of people who just hear something and think it is gospel, with no checking the facts for themselves. They make accusations and claims that have absolutely no basis in truth. They were my target audience, not you. I simply used a poor wording to make my point. May GOD bless you and your family, and thank you for caring enough to call me on this. I seek that the truth be known, and if I am wrong, I will be the absolute first to admit it.  Thank you.

starazor0
starazor0

@Tucci "...responsibility of building a community has always fallen onto the people." is what that should say. Not already. 

Tucci
Tucci

@JohnBarnes @Tucci@JohnBarnes @Tucci   JohnBarnes. I do not know what an N.I.C.S. check is. Is it a background check of the buyer to make sure he is not a convicted felon? Please show me your documentation proving your explanation. I have provided documentation proving my explanations. I anxiously await your reply.

Tucci
Tucci

@KurtHanson @Tucci You are absolutely correct!! Congress should be a part time job. They have too much time on their hands. They feel the need to justify their pathetic existence, so they come up with things to do. Does congress really need to be involved with steroid abuse in baseball? Their mantra is "We're from the government, and we're here to help. You are too stupid to take care of yourselves, so we will take care of you. You are too stupid to spend your own hard earned cash yourself, so we are going to take it from you, and spend as we see fit”. Again, because so many are there 20, 30, and even 40 + years, they have lost ALL touch with reality. Do you think a bazillionaire like John Kerry, or a senator like John McCain, who does not even know how many houses he owns, really has a grasp of a working family's day to day struggles?

Tucci
Tucci

Now, here is the contradiction we have all been waiting for. This discussion is supposed to be about a law to expand background checks on individuals who want to purchase guns at gun shows, in an effort to keep sociopaths and convicted felons from buying guns. How the hell does the abortion debate have ANYTHING to do with that? Why, because people are petty and if they cannot present a reasonable argument with facts, they turn to other issues completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand.The ole magician’s misdirection. "Obama wants background checks, but he allows abortions". Are you people that ignorant? Do you think Obama alone can change either one by himself? Every president since George Washington I am sure has had an agenda, but they did not just get to make it law. There is a process.One issue at a time people. Let's fix gun laws by itself. Let's address the abortion debate by itself. Quit throwing everything all at once. And besides, read my other posts. It ain't Obama people. IT IS CONGRESS!! THEY voted it down.

Tucci
Tucci

Heian. I am about to unfortunately contradict myself, but what the hell. Here goes. First of all, you say an abortion is not done against your will. Do you think being murdered (yes, I said murdered) by an abortion doctor may just be against the baby's will? And what would you call the living being inside their mother's womb before they actually poke their little head out of the birth canal, a tumor?

trob6969
trob6969

Well, if everybody thought like us there would be A LOT less victims of violent crime...all one has to do is 'Google' or 'YouTube' "concealed pistol carrier stops crime" to realize the positive affect that an armed law abiding civillian can have in a violent crime scenario.

gigastrash
gigastrash

@trob6969

How many people have used guns for self defense ? Not many


Many of those guns shooting that we hear from the news are commited by people who legally bought guns

For example, a 17 year old teenager shot his parent because they didn't allow him to play halo 3. The gun was legally owned by his father

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2008/12/boy_killed_mom_and_shot_dad_ov.html

 Another example, Adam Lanza took his mother legal gun, and then killed her, and then killed children at school. and then he commited suicide. There also countless of similar school and college shooting like this.

 It is very rare to hear someone who successfully used gun for self defense. But we hear a huge number of people dying from legally owned guns.

There are many people who suffer from depression or have psychological problems, when a gun is in front of those people a tragedy might happen.



Tucci
Tucci

trob6969, I so wish there were more people like you!! :)

Tucci
Tucci

@JohnBarnes @Tucci  So what your saying is a private citizen can sell guns at a gun show and basically sell to whoever he wants? I understand "cause to believe" clause, but seriously, do you think that is going to happen? Is there a limit on how many or what types of guns a private citizen can sell? I understand the government cannot monitor every single transaction, and in some cases should not, but again, I have no problem with the bad guys having as difficult a time of buying guns as possible.  With freedom comes responsibility. The second amendment is not carte blanche to do what ever you want with firearms. I wholeheartedly support the second amendment, but just like every thing else, there needs to be SENSIBLE limitations in place.

JohnBarnes
JohnBarnes

@Tucci@JohnBarnes 

Of course private citizens sell guns at gun shows, just like they do through classified advertisements in local news papers, just like they do on notice boards in stores, just like they do in any other face-to-face transaction between two private citizens.
Of course, under 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30, if the seller has any reasonable cause to believe that the buyer is a prohibited person (ie. convicted felons among others) then the sale is prohibited.

Tucci
Tucci

@JohnBarnes @Tucci JohnBarnes Thank you, with all sincerity, for enlightening me with that information. I would however, ask, are ALL sellers at a private gun show Federal Firearms Licensees? My thinking is that is where the debate begins. Can a convicted felon purchase a gun from a non  Federal Firearms Licensees seller at a private gun show, if there is such a seller. I appreciate your taking the time to respond to my query, as I truly want to know the truth. Thank you.

Tucci
Tucci

(continued from previous post)  

You people are like Mitch McConnell. His self-professed job was not to advance the agenda of the American people, to help bring about prosperity to all, to secure our boarders and help bring freedom around the world. His ONLY self-professed agenda was to defeat Obama. Is that who you want representing you. God forbid the Senate, the House, and the White House should WORK TOGETHER and come to a (wait for it, wait for it) a COMPROMISE!!!!If you want this, send people to Washington that will vote your way, not how lobbyist and special interest groups want them to vote.You are getting what you paid for people. Vote out the bums, and then you may get your way. But guess what, if you don't get your way, then maybe you are in the MINORITY. I know it kills you people to think that you might just not be right. And hey, I may even be wrong. Show me the facts, and if I am wrong, I will be the first to admit it. This ain’t about massaging my ego. This is about getting people to think for themselves and to realize just how insanely stupid some of you sound like. In fact, before you post something on here, do me a favor. Go into the bathroom, look in the mirror and read your statement you want to post out loud. If you can keep from absolutely busting a gut from laughter, then go ahead and post it. Bring it people.

trob6969
trob6969

Are you kidding?! There are MANY cases of armed people not only defending themselves but also complete strangers...and of course there are incidents of guns being involved in negligent deaths and suicides just as automobiles are, but do we demonize cars, trucks, vans and mini vans for human irresponsibility? NO! So why guns?...think about it.