Gay Boy Scouts Employee: I Can’t Live a Lie Any Longer

I am a full-time paid professional employee of the Boy Scouts of America. I am also gay.

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David Manning / REUTERS

An Eagle Scout patch is pictured in Orlando, on May 30, 2012.

I am a full-time paid professional employee of the Boy Scouts of America. I am also gay.

I spend 14-hour days and 80-hour workweeks promoting the Scouting program and providing the best possible services to build and retain membership. I do this with honor because I am a product of the program. I am an Eagle Scout and a member of Scouting’s Honor Society. I’ve dedicated more than two decades of my life to the Boy Scouts of America – first as a Scout and now for over five years as an employee.

When I was a Scout, the program offered me many important life experiences and skills in areas including leadership, communication and conflict resolution. My many experiences and memories still impact my life now. These opportunities need to be made available to all youth, regardless of their sexual orientation.

There are dozens of other gay professionals like me in the Scouts. I have met them through Scouting training courses and programs for adult leaders and employees. We dedicate ourselves to Scouting and fully support the organization. Yet we live with apprehension, hiding our personal lives and not knowing if we could be outed and fired at any moment. We continually face awkward questions about our personal lives. While the Scouts claim to be a family organization, for us there are two options for having a family: hide the people we love or leave Scouting. Because of this ban, not only can my co-workers not know who I am, but many of my friends and neighbors also do not know. I live my life in silence as a result of the Scouts’ anti-gay policy. I constantly fear being fired.

As an employee, I have a unique commitment to the organization, but I also face losing my job every single day because of who I am. My hope is to make Scouting stronger so it may flourish in local communities. But in order for Scouting to continue as the premier youth-serving agency in this country, it must be inclusive of gay boys and adults. And I’ll tell you why.

The Boy Scouts of America is not, I believe, on a sustainable path as long as any portion of the ban on gay members continues. Strategic partnerships will be drastically reduced. I have personal experience working with many organizations that refused to be partners with my local Scouting council because of the ban on gay members. One instance stands out because the organization was a statewide conservation group, and the Boy Scouts have taught me to be respectful and responsible with our natural world. The conservation group refused to work with the Boy Scouts because the staff feared that their gay volunteers would be exposed to potential embarrassment by working with an organization that discriminates against gay people.

Scouting employees know it is now more difficult to accomplish our recruiting and partnership goals because of the discriminatory ban. Twenty-eight of 30 national youth-serving organizations, many of which are our strategic partners, are strongly opposed to the anti-gay policy, and corporations nationwide are questioning their financial commitment to the Boy Scouts or cutting ties altogether.

On Thursday, 1,400 Scouting volunteers from all across the country will meet in Dallas to vote on a proposal that could end the ban on gay youth. However, gay adult leaders and employees, like me, would remain banned from Scouting.

I have hoped for years that the time would come when the ban would be lifted. The Boy Scouts need to catch up with the American people’s view on equality. Boy Scout members span political parties and socioeconomic classes and live in locations as dense as New York City and as rural as Wyoming. A Washington Post–ABC News poll released just this month shows a majority of Americans believe that both gay youth and adults should be allowed to join the Boy Scouts of America.

The proposed resolution to allow openly gay youth is a good first step, but it cannot stop there. If the resolution to repeal the ban on gay Scouts is approved, dedicated gay adult volunteers and employees, like me, will still be kept in the closet, and I will have no choice but to resign. For too many years, I eschewed relationships, felt uncomfortable around co-workers and was forced to remain cloaked in secrecy. I cannot continue to live in the shadows. It is not healthy, nor is it ethical.

This week, the nation will know if the Boy Scouts of America is listening to equality opponents, who would ultimately destroy the organization, or if acceptance and understanding will prevail. I dream of the day the Boy Scouts of America becomes a fully inclusive youth organization. All boys should be able to benefit, as I have, from Scouting, regardless of their sexual orientation.

TIME has verified that the author, who prefers to remain anonymous, is an employee of the BSA.

PHOTOS: Boy Scouts of America Turns 100

564 comments
lazarus00000
lazarus00000

Ignorant religious fools are the main reason there is and has always been so much suffering throughout history. Homosexuality is NOT against the laws of nature which is a fact and proven many times. The only laws the Homosexuals have broken are the hateful laws of the Hebrew religion, which the romans adopted as they perverted the history of christ.

The reason is very simple...greed. lust, power, vanity, and the other deadly sins. The perversion of faith has corrupted humanity for so long that christians do not seem to realize they are Jews wearing the cloak of a christian, an early christian.

Read some history, I suggest an acclaimed author name "Geza Vermes" Google him, but read his many books, unless you are affraid your fragile faith will loose its power once the hate and superstition is removed.

The people who are to be feared for the sexual abusses of children in any setting are the masters of religions who use the fear to control the children's thought and behaviors in order to maintain the "Cloak of Silence".

Lazarus



 

z0mki
z0mki

Its hard to argue with people who believe in a magical ancient book to guide them through modern times.  Sharing the word of your "God" is great, just stop twisting the message.  Great article, props to @Time for publishing it

AlinCampan
AlinCampan

Wow Hamzamd77 why are you such a homophobic person, if you don't like gay people then get over it. There is no need for homophobia in this world, enough is enough.

hamzamd77
hamzamd77

this is completely wrong and he should be fired with the other boy scouts who are involved in going against the nature and the will of God.

valentine.godoflove
valentine.godoflove

If you are a man and desire to have sex with another man......you are a homosexual.......and if you are a female and want sex with another female ..........you are a lesbian......you are what you are.......

valentine, comedian, lol

SINROSSCO
SINROSSCO

I was a Boy Scout myself and as a senior it's been a long time.  I pulled out the Boy Scout Oath and there my friends lies the truth of the matter.  Obviously those in scouting although may proclaim to be Christian in word and going through the motions apparently don't comprehend their own oath.  To do my duty to God.  Interestingly under this paragraph it goes on to say you do your duty to God by following the WISDOM  (living a Godly life in an ungodly world) To keep myself morally straight.   The definition of homosexuality is defined in the Bible and certainly the book of Proverbs and Romans just to mention a few gives us our guidance/wisdom as to how we are to live our lives.  I think it is safe to say that the majority of organizations are established with a concept of a morale point of view.  As a Christian nation who believes there is a Supreme Being that morale foundation comes from the Bible.  Homosexuality is not a belief, it is a life style.  While we are a sinful nation there has been a long standing belief that  we choose to live under these laws.  Let's remember our laws as Christian's come from God; not man.  Our government nor any organization should be setting policy in reference to issues that really are between the individual and God.  If we want to speak on issues of separation of church and state I believe this is one that qualifies.  The decision that scouting has now made is a double stand.  Your good enough to join if your a child but not man enough as an adult.  While an adult is certainly capable of seeking God's wisdom, it is the responsibility of fathers and mothers to instill that same wisdom among their children.  If this was being done we wouldn't be speaking about this issue.  I think it is really a very simple question.  Before you join a faith based organization read it's rules and guidelines.  If you want to belong I think it is very simple to follow those guidelines.  I am a retired service member and I had to maintain certain standards.  If you didn't maintain those standards there were consequences.  How many children don't get in a college because of standards?  It should be the same with any organization.  We have become a country whereby a standard that the majority of this country had a belief in now has to roll over and play dead or give in to others just because they want to impose their ideology.   If they are so fundamentally different and feel excluded, why not form their own organization? 

oldiesmann
oldiesmann

It's sad that some people expect an organization to change because they don't agree with someone's lifestyle choice. The BSA is a private organization and is not required to accept anyone. This is really no different than any other job - if your lifestyle doesn't agree with the principles and values of the company/organization you work for, you need to find another job where your lifestyle choice won't be an issue.

porichkid
porichkid

so you were taught many new things such as bending over and grabbing your ankels ,well you must have been in good shape .

bloomin'onion
bloomin'onion

So he is betraying the Scout Oath to be Honest and Trustworthy, yet claims to be a victim. The hypocrisy is astounding. 

Man up, get a job where you can be who you want to be, and quit infecting the Scouts.

CraigAllen
CraigAllen

Which is worse and has more impact on the Scouting program, the head of a local Scouting Council who knowingly hides and protect pedophiles while exposing the boys to the predation...including in some cases by convicted criminals, or a Scouting professional who happens to be LGBT?  Personally, having seen both first hand while becoming an Eagle Scout, I'll take the second person every time.  At least they may be looking out for the welfare of the boys entrusted to their guidance.

Ignominious
Ignominious

The root of this lying BSA employee is that the BSA will lose money if they don't condone homosexual behavior.  Better to lose the money than compromise principles.  If they hold true then there will be plenty of support; if they cave then the membership will shrink and it will become as influential for good as the Girl Scouts.

MallardinWater
MallardinWater

We all have free will and we all use that free will however the situations in life warrant.  I can't seem to grasp how certain people want jobs in certain fields or companies but don't seem to want to adhere to corporate policy or guidelines.  Lifestyle choices really are just that- choices.  Either find work you love where there aren't any policies or rules or adhere to the policies in place.  It's really not that complicated but some people keep making it complicated for themselves and for others.  If I am a stripper at night but have a day job working for a very conservative organization that frowns on me dancing naked for learing men, I think I might choose to not make my night job a bone of contention at work, if i want to keep my job that is.  Not every corporation or business has conservative values and policies nor would they care less who you  mate with.  And then there are some companies, firms, etc. that do have conservative ideals and want those ideals embraced by the people they pay to represent their companies.  You see that is why I love America.  Because there are so many different views, values, ideals and choices we are allowed to make in life with no one forcing us to take a job where we aren't comfortable.  Problem though is all the people out there who think that it's not okay to have a separate set of values than theirs and demand that everyone conform to their way of thinking or else they get all ugly and noisy.  Live and let live.  It's not really difficult to just let others have conservative ideals so long as they are not forcing you to stay someplace where you aren;t comfortable.  But we all need to realize that everyone has a different comfort zone and it's okay to have convictions.  

nycmcmike
nycmcmike

Jesus mentions homosexuality as least twice in the Gospels.

1) Jesus met a gay man, via the Roman Centurion trying to heal his 'pais', a Greek term used to convey the younger male lover in a gay relationship, and said of him, "Never have I seen faith greater than this."  And, no, He did not end it with 'now go and sin no more'.  In fact, Jesus even wanted to go hang out with the guy and eat dinner with him over at the Centurion's house.

2) Jesus mentions gay men as born eunuchs in Matthew and again does not condemn them.  He was speaking of men who were not made to marry women.  "Born eunuchs" were used by kings back then to guard their harems because the kings knew those men had no interest in women.

3) There's some evidence when Jesus says "Whomever calls his brother a fool..." that the 2nd word Jesus condemns men for saying to another man is "Raca" which would be the equivilantof the f-word today. 

lazarus00000
lazarus00000

@hamzamd77

Ignorant religious fools are the main reason there is and has always been so much suffering throughout history. Homosexuality is NOT against the laws of nature which is a fact and proven many times. The only laws the Homosexuals have broken are the hateful laws of the Hebrew religion, which the romans adopted as they perverted the history of christ.

The reason is very simple...greed. lust, power, vanity, and the other deadly sins. The perversion of faith has coorupted humanity for so long that christians do not seem to realize they are Jews wearing the cloak of a christian, an early christian.

Read some history, I suggest an acclaime author name "Geza Vermes" Google him, but read his many books, unless you are affraid your fragile faith will loose its power once the hate and superstition is removed.

Lazarus

lazarus00000
lazarus00000

Sinrossco,

With respects sir, I too was a boy scout, but my scouting experience is a great deal different than most because I worked for my scouting experience.

I come from a broken home when broken homes were not that common. for a time my sister and myself had no homeom left us with a neighbor. I was three and my sister a year younger. My grandfather and Grandmother agreed to take us in after about a year. He was 72 yo at the time. I believe he worked to introduce me to the real world at a faster pace because he realized I already had a "stacked Deck" in my future. He began by teaching me independence and risk taking. When I wanted to climb a tree, he never said"don't do that", he said instead that "I would likely fall and get hurt." so up the tree I would go and down I would fall. The crying did not seem to have the desired effect so I learned to be responsible for my own actions.

He always encouraged me go beyond my fears and when we would go to church (three times a week), he would interpret the sermon to me, but he taught me to think for myself and to question the things I recognized as not fitting. He gave me a love of history and said that "only fools would refuse to learn from it."

I decided to join the Boy scouts at 11yo and he helped me get a job at the local grocery store to pay for my scouting. as it is pretty expensive.

I loved my scouting and my scout leader. He was a WW2 Ranger that climbed the cliffs at Normandy.  We had boys in our troop that I felt had unusually close relationships and always slept together, but they bothered no one else and everyone loved them. Scouting is about personal growth. The founders of the Country were not supportive of Religion or the ideas of religion. I put it to you, Religion and love of god are NOT the same things. Religion is a man made institution and if you will google "Thomas Paine" and the "Age of reason".  I believe the Boy Scouts embody the spirit of the founders not the preachers that want to influence the young with their dogma.

The term Morally straight has nothing whatsoever to do with religious (or Homosexuals), or false morals given by religion. As a matter of fact I have heard preachers say that good deeds do not count in the sceme of good morals (But send me  a 1000.00 dollar love offering and I will see to it god sends you  a blessing).

To me, morally straight is synomonous with Integrity, doing the right thing because it is the right thing to do. Always help your fellow man, give yourself to the misson of making the world a better place for everyone. Actions like helping an elderly person or givin up your week end to plant 10,000 trees in a forrest that was destroyed by fire... is living Morally straight.

I challenge you and everyone else to read the writings of Thomas Payne, because fellows like Adams, Jefferson, Franklin, Madison and so on read his workes anf was heavily influenced by him. All Americans should be required to read his works instead of the trash the current teachers are giving our children.

Lazarus

EmberMike
EmberMike

@oldiesmann The BSA is only partially private. They are still heavily involved in government and military, swapping support for recruitment opportunities with the branches of the armed forces. Until just this year they held the national Jamboree on government land, and they still do hold some events and gatherings on land that they pay little or no money to use, fees that ultimately we tax payers foot the bill for. President Obama is sill the honorary president of the BSA. Our government and the BSA have long-standing ties and connections, far outside the typical scope of a private organization.

You're right that a private organization should be able to do what they want. So if the BSA wants to keep this policy, they should be required to relinquish any and all benefits they receive from the public. 

richzip
richzip

@CraigAllen Very well said.  This is exactly where the arguments against thinks like gay marriage fall apart.  The self-righteous group uses the bible as a reason to deny gay marriage--but have no trouble at all with a divorced person getting remarried, when the very same bible considers that adultery.


CraigAllen
CraigAllen

@Ignominious Problem one is that you assume the writer is lying, while it is apparent there is no particular reason to assume that.  Time says they've confirmed the employment, so at least half the major issue is confirmed.  On the other hand, just which Scouting principle is being compromised?  The twelve points of the Scout Law don't speak to being Bigoted, or Racist, or anything like that.  

MattWhitwell
MattWhitwell

@MallardinWater"Lifestyle choices really are just that- choices" When did you choose to be heterosexual?  Oh, you didn't; it just happened?  When will people realize that this is not a choice... 

Ibrey
Ibrey

@nycmcmike That is quite a stretch. An eromenos can certainly be called a pais, but that is not the main meaning of the word; it's like taking an English text and assuming "baby" is most likely an affectionate term for one's lover.

gaylord
gaylord

@nycmcmike Dude, the Bible is not into gay stuff, even though those mediterranean societies would seem a lot "gayer"to the modern eye than ours today. Who cares? We live in a civil society that provides countermajoritarian protection to groups that might otherwise be oppressed. That's basically the measure of how well Western/Enlightenment ideals have succeeded. 

Ignominious
Ignominious

@nycmcmike 

Don't think I've ever seen such great effort to twist the truth.  Do you sleep better at night deceiving only yourself and those who want to justify themselves? 

SINROSSCO
SINROSSCO

@lazarus00000   Well my friend Lazarus.  For some of us it takes a long time to get a reality check.  I was one of those who had turned from my faith as a teen and came back to it in 2001 before 9/11.  I actually started reading the Bible that year and after 9/11 I really started to do some soul searching.  In watching a program this fellow had stated he had everything in life, a great family, nice house, car etc but he felt something was missing.  Well we all have a different point of view as to what the American dream should be.  For many it's a lot of money and material things.  For me I just wanted a comfortable life.  Of course, many will say what is comfortable to you?  Having a roof over my head and food on the table.  I also started to reading writings about our forefathers and one in particular comes to mind.  Original Intent by David Barton.  Faith was a daily thing in the conduct of our forefathers business.  While there were some, a handful that didn't follow Christianity, they supported it's ideals.  It appears to me by your comments you probably don't follow a faith either.  If you are a Christian than I think your idea that morally straight is not faith driven I have to disagree with you.  As far as Paine, you mention five that were influenced by him, so who do you think the remainder were influenced by?  I have been researching my family history and one of my ancestors was a founder in New Haven, CT.  Their  decision making was based first on consulting God through prayer insuring that they would do the right thing.  The Bible also teaches us that we are all temples of God and are directed to live a Godly life.  We are to seek God's wisdom, (living a Godly life in an ungodly world.  Another book you might want to take a look at is Answers from the Founding Fathers by Jerry Newcombe.  What are the false morals given in religion that you claim?  It is easy to point at preachers in general who have made the comments you have stated but who are these preachers; names?  I'm always open to a challenge.

MaxVeritas
MaxVeritas

@reikirobyn   

Without any reputable evidence, you, the entertainment culture, uneducated media, and sexual activists have seduced today's teenagers, in particular, to believe that people are born homosexual.

However, science has found no biological basis for homosexuality, bisexuality, or transsexuality.

Study after study has found the “LGBT” lifestyle to be unhealthy, with the highest rate of sexually-transmitted diseases, and higher cancer rates and earlier deaths.

While all people are worthy and valuable, the fact is people are not "born this way," as a popular song insists.


Why does it matter that people are not born 'gay'?

The fact that people are not born homosexual matters because the entire fiber of our society is impacted -- for good or for ill. We cannot change society's laws and make new laws based on a lie. That hurts everyone.

There is no "gay gene" -- so homosexuality is not biologically based. The only human genders are male (if you inherited a "Y" chromosome from your father) and female (if you did not inherit a "Y" chromosome from him) -- so homosexuality is not a new "gender."

Not being born "gay" means this is not a "civil rights" issue. People inherit unchangeable characteristics like their race and ethnicity, but homosexuality is not inherited. Science and biology confirm this, and thousands of former "gays and lesbians" who have changed their behavior also prove this fact. Therefore, homosexuality is not a civil right for marriage or anything else.

Ironically, the "LGBT" (lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender) "civil rights" laws have severely infringed upon the constitutional rights and religious freedom of those who disagree, punishing dissent.


nycmcmike
nycmcmike

@gaylord @nycmcmike Really?  That's odd because the most passionate love story between to people in the Bible just happens to be between two men.

"Your love is greater than that of any woman" as they held each other, wept and kissed.


Sounds pretty hot and heavy to me.  Even that though pales in comparison when David disrobes, gets fully nude in front of Jonathan and gives him his clothes as a sign of devotion.


David getting naked in front of Jonthan when they were alone in private would be just as sexually charged back then as it would be today.

nycmcmike
nycmcmike

@Ignominious @nycmcmike Tell you what, every piece I've given is a verifiable fact.  You're more than welcomed to try to dispute any of it but it's kinda impossible to dispute facts.

lazarus00000
lazarus00000

@SINROSSCO

Perhaps you also are in need of a reality check. Modern religions have survived by destroying all who oppose them, even other christians. Do you believe it is not so? Google the "Cathars" to see the total extermination of a pious faith based culture. The Jews also committed Genocide of the "Essenes" to remove a nonviolent people.

I could list attrocities perpetuated by the faithful of all surviving religions all day long because I was sent on  a mission from God. He asked me to deliver a message to all of you "paper-backed" fanatics. He said, "Stop using my name to justify the torture of humanity", and Abraham was one of the first fanatics to give humanity blind hatred and faith. That Altar has served to give mindless followers justification to torture, and murder humanity since he set his laws down for posterity.

Lazarus

MaxVeritas
MaxVeritas

@Ibrey   Where is this alleged convincing evidence? If what you are saying is true every form of media on the planet would be shouting about the so-called homosexual gene discovery, which you are forced to admit hasn't happened yet. As for me I know it's a matter of choice, one that has changed several times over the course of my life thus far.   

Life is based on truth vs error. Every person of sound mind makes dozens of choices every day which involve many things including sexual behaviors. The truth is there is nothing chiseled in stone (innate) concerning sexual behavior, we all decide when and where all our behaviors, sexual or otherwise, appropriately conform to our wants and or desires. Btw, have you noticed that those who ascribe to the so-called, born with so-called innate sexual orientation do so by selectively excluding other sexual behaviors out-of-hand, such as their near sexual mirror, same-sex incest,  which at best is irrational and exclusive, or to use the ad nauseam vernacular, discriminatory.
I will further add that when there are NO behavioral boundaries to look to, it all can become hedonistic which is the road many activist atheists, liberals and homosexuals are on. When one uses their own reasoning, common sense will tell you that sexual behavior is dynamic, NOT static, meaning it's fluid in nature and can change greatly over the course of a persons lifetime.
I now pray that God will open the minds, hearts and spirits for all concerning what is truth, and what is error, regarding the proper boundaries of life in all of it's facets. The result of which will be of benefit to society as a whole. To conclude, the greatest gift of all time is Truth, meaning Jesus Christ who will set you free from the Law of Sin and death, and that freedom will last for an eternity in His presence.
2 Cor 5:17-Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!                                                      
 Ephesians 4:24 and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness. 

.

Ibrey
Ibrey

@MaxVeritas There's actually some pretty convincing evidence that people don't choose to be gay any more than people choose to be left-handed. Twin studies have shown that when one twin is gay, it is much more likely in pairs of identical twins than fraternal twins that the other twin is also gay, suggesting genetic factors; and studies have repeatedly shown that a man is more likely to be gay the more sons his mother has had before him, establishing the influence of conditions in the womb.

gaylord
gaylord

@nycmcmike @gaylord Ok, I'll trust you. Suddenly, your Biblical exegesis seems relevant and interesting to think about.

nycmcmike
nycmcmike

@gaylord @nycmcmike Wow, that's a shocker.  Still think you're the one and only in the entire world where if you have an opinion about a certain topic then it must be fact.


Get.Over.It.

Trust me though, I already know any speech where you actually don't have to think for yourself would be more interesting for you.

nycmcmike
nycmcmike

@gaylord @nycmcmike Sorry, but I've already found success but thanks for your concern anyways. If you want to stick to, however, asinine comments like "if you just want to jerk off with your 'knowledge" at a desperate attempt to sound witty, albeit failing miserably, fine.

Of course, many Christians aren't going to listen. They don't care about the truth.   And you might want to figure out what's "provable".  Sure, David and Jonathan's relationship isn't one of them but proving the original text of the Bible doesn't condemn homosexuality is and that, my friend, is success.

gaylord
gaylord

@nycmcmike @gaylord Hey if you want to stick with this line of reasoning because you think you'll make some inroads, so be it. I doubt you'll find success. Religious claims, one way or another, are orthogonal to running a modern society. "Proving" the bible was down with gay stuff is just kind of a silly diversion. We live in a real, practical society that bears little resemblance to fables about King David. Plus, Christians aren't going to believe you anyway. If you just want to jerk off with your "knowledge", fine.

Ignominious
Ignominious

@nycmcmike @Ignominious  

The inevitable homosexual argument; "everyone is a closet homosexual".  I think it's some kind of self justification.

This is only one of many issues that I find important to argue the truth about.   On other issues I'm a "racist"; others a "redneck"; others a "add your favorite ad hominem attack here".

nycmcmike
nycmcmike

@Ignominious @nycmcmike Hey, notice for the 1,020th time tonight, you refuse to point out ANY fact and you playing dumb and acting as if you don't know what a fact is, although it may not be an act, doesn't help your case.


Now, yes, go to sleep and keep telling yourself you're not gay at all and that all well adjusted straight men naturally spend hours online trying to convince themselves they're not gay at all.

Ignominious
Ignominious

@nycmcmike @Ignominious  

You mean like Dave getting drunk and going to jail?

Take a couple of steps back and then tell me that even resembles presenting "facts" that can be argued.  Do any of your posts contain even one reference?

nycmcmike
nycmcmike

@Ignominious @nycmcmike Please, again for the 1,000th time, please point out ANY piece of fact I've presented and try to dispute it?


You just don't get it, do you?  I've presented verifiable facts and your avoidance of discussing ANY of them only proves you have no case.

Ignominious
Ignominious

@nycmcmike@Ignominious 

This is what you're doing:

1 Corinthians 3:18

18 Let no man deceive himself.

You are responding under the false impression that you can somehow deceive me with your twisting of the scriptures.   That is precisely what the Pharisees did when they attempted to entrap Jesus.  I'm no where close to being as insightful as Jesus yet I can clearly see your intent is not to promote the truth.

Do you believe in God?  Do you believe there is a devil?

Which side is your argument on?

Ignominious
Ignominious

@nycmcmike@Ignominious 

Romans Chapter 1

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet

 

Ignominious
Ignominious

@nycmcmike@Ignominious 

I clearly understand that you are trying to use scriptures to justify a behavior unacceptable to God.  You pretend to be knowledgeable yet deny the plain words in there.   I think the following verse is fitting:

1 Corinthians 3:18

18 Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.

nycmcmike
nycmcmike

@Ignominious @nycmcmike You've completely ignored what I just wrote about Cornithians and thus are completely ignoring facts.  Here, let me repost it: 


Paul wrote "male bed" and "soft" (as in morals or fabric).  He did NOT use any Greek term which might have conveyed homosexuality.  No one knows what Paul meant although we do know he was referencing the clobber passage in Leviticus (which, by the way, notice how he wrote 'bed' and the term translated to 'as with' in that Leviticus scripture means "bed" every other time it's used in Leviticus).  The terms are so vague it was condemning mastur bation instead of homosexuality less than 100 years ago
.



Ignominious
Ignominious

@nycmcmike@Ignominious

1 Corinthians 6:9

9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

nycmcmike
nycmcmike

@Ignominious @nycmcmike Kinda describe yourself perfectly, doesn't it?  Let's see, you've seen the verfiable facts but you ignore them and keep using God as your excuse to be a bigot.