In the Arena

Still More Benghazi

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Seems to me that Andrew Sullivan has nailed the import of the latest email revelations. But there is one point to note for future reference.

I’m not so sure that Nuland’s reference to her “buildings (sic) leadership” means Hillary Clinton. There is a cloud of highly defensive–sometimes to the point of weirdly paranoid–advisers who have always surrounded Clinton. (Think Sid Blumenthal, back in the day). It’s part of the DNA of Hillaryland. In my experience, this over-protectiveness often works to Clinton’s disadvantage. And it will be a real detriment to her presidential campaign, should she choose to launch one.

I’m not sure that Clinton herself forced the talking points massage; but “Hillary Clinton”–the bubble that surrounded the Secretary–may well have.

One other point: the amount of time spent on these talking points was obscene, and not at all unusual in the current Administration, or others in the recent past. The amount of time our leaders spend in spinning rather than governing or leading drives me absolutely nuts.

46 comments
LonniNorton
LonniNorton

Benghasi has always had legs but the Dems and MSM kept cutting them off at the knees until they couldn't anymore.

mrxexon
mrxexon

This is tribal warfare. It's got nothing to do with the subject. Any excuse to exploit a weakness. Kinda like a computer virus.

The GOP is the tribe that is attempting to blow on embers the average American could care less about. Seriously. We got bigger problems right now and don't need to get diverted by this soap opera and it's cheesy sponsors. The GOP is going to throw a lot of coal into this hot air balloon they've launched. And even as the trees get closer, they still say "more coal!!!"

Idiots. And judging by the idiots who voted them into office, I'm not sure which one to be more shamed of.

x



FredESmit
FredESmit

 911 and 13 Benghazi style attacks occurred while Busch Lite spent 720 days on vacation reading "Billy the Goat "

13 attacks and 4000 killed on 911 (the consulate and the CIA compound) are absolutely not unprecedented even though they're being treated that way by Republicans who are deliberately ignoring anything that happened prior to Inauguration Day, January 20, 2009. January 22, 2002. Calcutta, India. Gunmen associated with Harkat-ul-Jihad al-Islami attack the U.S. Consulate. Five people are killed. June 14, 2002. Karachi, Pakistan. Suicide bomber connected with al Qaeda attacks the U.S. Consulate, killing 12 and injuring 51. October 12, 2002. Denpasar, Indonesia. U.S. diplomatic offices bombed as part of a string of "Bali Bombings." No fatalities. February 28, 2003. Islamabad, Pakistan. Several gunmen fire upon the U.S. Embassy. Two people are killed. May 12, 2003. Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. Armed al Qaeda terrorists storm the diplomatic compound, killing 36 people including nine Americans. The assailants committed suicide by detonating a truck bomb. July 30, 2004. Tashkent, Uzbekistan. A suicide bomber from the Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan attacks the U.S. Embassy, killing two people. December 6, 2004. Jeddah, Saudi Arabia. Al Qaeda terrorists storm the U.S. Consulate and occupy the perimeter wall. Nine people are killed. March 2, 2006. Karachi, Pakistan again. Suicide bomber attacks the U.S. Consulate killing four people, including U.S. diplomat David Foy who was directly targeted by the attackers. (I wonder if Lindsey Graham or Fox News would even recognize the name "David Foy." This is the third Karachi terrorist attack in four years on what's considered American soil.) September 12, 2006. Damascus, Syria. Four armed gunmen shouting "Allahu akbar" storm the U.S. Embassy using grenades, automatic weapons, a car bomb and a truck bomb. Four people are killed, 13 are wounded. January 12, 2007. Athens, Greece. Members of a Greek terrorist group called the Revolutionary Struggle fire a rocket-propelled grenade at the U.S. Embassy. No fatalities. March 18, 2008. Sana'a, Yemen. Members of the al-Qaeda-linked Islamic Jihad of Yemen fire a mortar at the U.S. Embassy. The shot misses the embassy, but hits nearby school killing two. July 9, 2008. Istanbul, Turkey. Four armed terrorists attack the U.S. Consulate. Six people are killed. September 17, 2008. Sana'a, Yemen. Terrorists dressed as military officials attack the U.S. Embassy with an arsenal of weapons including RPGs and detonate two car bombs. Sixteen people are killed, including an American student and her husband (they had been married for three weeks when the attack occurred). This is the second attack on this embassy in seven months. A few observations about this timeline. My initial list was quoted from an article on the Daily Kos which actually contained several errors and only 11 attacks (the above timeline contains all 13 attacks). Also, my list above doesn't include the numerous and fatal attacks on the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad during the Iraq war -- a war that was vocally supported by Lindsey Graham, John McCain and Fox News

LenMorris
LenMorris

The talking points, lying to the American People, to the victim's families are one thing.. Failing to prepare security properly is another. And let's not forget the cowardly treason for Obama not sending help. And firing an Admiral and a General for attempting to disobey orders and go get them....All because it was an election year.

kuffirpork
kuffirpork

I still don't know how you half wits voted for this guy, Benghazi was BEFORE the election FFS.

jmac
jmac

Sunday Morning Talk Show:     " 'Let's not blow things out of proportion,'  says Issa, improv comedian."   (Linkins)


PaulG
PaulG

The stink started almost immediately yet the liberal media is only now noticing ? That's the story too...a conscious effort to look at Obama's serial incompetence thru rose coloured glasses while firmly pinching the nostrils. Jay Carney is not even a convincing liar yet the guardians of truth were too cowardly or corrupt to ask a few tough questions. Here's one: while brave Americans fought and died at the hands of terrorists WHERE was the Commander in Chief ? What did he do ? We already know the answer is real bad because the White House never let's a crisis go to waste but they sure did on Benghazi. Where are the posed photos of concerned leaders ? Making critical decisions for the safety of the country ? Missing in action...the old dog that didn't bark. Hell, they had the whole day to look Presidential. I would bet the farm that there is a big steaming pile on that issue.

carolerae
carolerae

I'm sure they were really hard to do.  They all had to cover and lie for what was really going on in Bengahzi.  It was a Covert CIA Operation.  The government never acknowledges CIA activity and that's all there was in Bengahzi.............CIA Activity!  Of course you news jerks act like you don't know anything about that.  Maybe you should read the WaPost.  That's where I found out!

PaulG
PaulG

The stink started almost immediately yet the liberal media is only now noticing ?

RedHotRash
RedHotRash

something in washington stinks.....BO

charlestbriggs
charlestbriggs

Benghazi-gate is so simple that even the libtards are beginning to understand it.

Obama & Clinton lied! Americans died! (and it was all preventable)

jmac
jmac

Someone from the Obama administration used talking points  on  Sunday political talk shows and it's ballooned into a major news story.  

And it's Hillary's fault.  Good God Almighty.  I hope the woman doesn't run.  We don't deserve her.   We DESERVED CHENEY BUSH and I hope we get them again so talking points can be handed out to Fox News and each reporter can report those talking points ALL DAY LONG so we can invade a country preemptively  based on false information  and then we can read about it in the NY Times as  Libby whispers into Judith MIller's ear.  

Hillary Clinton is way too good for the United State of America.  We don't deserve her.    


LonniNorton
LonniNorton

If the Obama Administration had just told the truth from the get-go, they wouldn't be in the position they are in.  In fact, if Obama had put the whole weight of the Office of the Presidency behind an "I mean business" rescue, he would have been hailed as a hero instead of spending all of his time doing damage control.  Same with Hillary. Dumb, dumb move on their part.  

Jetstar99999
Jetstar99999

POLITICALLY DRIVEN 1.Massive national security leaks 2. leaving SEALS to die 3. rigged talking points 4.politicizing IRS in swing state Ohio - all part of a broad array of probable high crimes and misdemeanors designed to WIN AN ELECTION AT ANY COST

The national security leaks were devastating, and included the Drone kill list, Joint Israeli-USA Iranian nuke hacking program, Operational details of Bin Laden raid, and many other critical secrets and programs, so many that even Senator Diane Feinstein (D-CA) on July 24, 2012 took notice saying " I think the White House has to understand that some of this is coming from their ranks." However apparently now, Ms Feinstein, like the President, has no further interest in finding out the source of these leaks

Many programs in fact were left in shambles, field operatives exposed or even killed, and Pakistani Dr Afridi (who helped established DNA evidence in the Bin Laden raid) tortured and given a 33 year prison sentence - all for political reasons. Note left wing reporter Judith Miller, known for her White House sources, very oddly last summer was all over town putting out the convenient explanation "well if the President first declassified a program, then it was leaked, its not a crime." Sources at the NY Times among other entities said they multiple times offered the White House (go or no go) "story callbacks" on these leaks, yet the White House each time said they had no objections. All of these leaks just coincidentally making Obama look like the strong Commander and Chief, such theme itself becoming THE central theme of the Democratic National Convention mere days before the Benghazi attack.

Even though there is no way one could have known ahead of the time the length of the Libya firefight, we are now being told that nobody could have been saved. Why are the mid level theater commander not being allowed to testify?

There is absolutely no doubt that UN Ambassador Susan Rice understood the words she spoke were at best highly misleading, and no doubt she knowingly allowed her high office to be used to lend credibility and authority to assist in presenting a false premise, the purpose of which was to extend the cover up and win an election mere weeks away. Conscious ignorance (willful blindness) will not protect her.


AlanMacDonald
AlanMacDonald


This "Benghazi, Benghazi, Benghazi" chant and agitation will not go away until the Empire succeeds in going from a covert Empire (hiding behind its puppet dual-Vichy facade) to "coming-out" as a unifying, and bipartisan force of overt Empire --- that will make not only the 'trains run on time' but appear to make the country run better than the squabbling parties that it will replace with a unitary government (which the people will first applaud, and only later fear, too late, when the tyranny really starts).

Regarding the minor incident that occurred in Benghazi, it is becoming very clear that the Secret Global Empire, the disguised corporate, financial, militarist, media, legal, and political Global EMPIRE, which had 'captured' and now fully "Occupies" our former country (and other power structures; U.K., Germany, Israel, France, NATO, IMF, Exxon, B of A, Boeing, et al.), by hiding behind the facade of its
'bought and owned', modernized, and sophisticated, TWO-Party 'Vichy' sham of faux-democratic and totally illegitimate government -- just as surely as the earlier Nazi EMPIRE tried less successfully to hide behind its cruder and first generation, single-party Vichy phony government in 'captured' and Occupied France c. 1940 -- has decided that the time has finally
come to expose and destroy the credibility of both of the Empire's previously smooth-working soft-totalitarian (or "inverted totalitarian") [Sheldon Wolin] Vichy parties, and to move quite quickly now and to devolve into a rougher version of overt totalitarianism.

The Empire's probable reasoning in using the Benghazi episode as a catalyst for its disposal of the multi-Vichy party facade of democracy is of no more consequence than its using of the miraculous discovery of the three Cleveland abducted women to cover-up the Israel sector of the Empire's expansion of the Middle East war in bombing Syria - namely,
that the episode has the potential to spark and maintain emotional debate among deluded Americans sufficient to distract almost all
attention away from the real event being initiated, which in the case of the SGE's Israeli bombing of Syria is to create full scale war in the Middle East and Central Asia, and in the case of the Congressional battle between Republican and Democrat Vichy tag-teams is to tar both
parties as being below useless - and thus pave public support for a new unified government that will be more efficient and unified (which the SGE requires to grasp direct control).

The particular episode used by the Empire's media sector to accomplish a goal is not important in its own right, but only to engender the necessary public fear, anger, conflict, emotion, and disgust (in the case of both parties, Congress, and the Presidential
administration fighting over Benghazi to accomplish the SGE's goal).

Best to all in non-violently confronting and surviving the SGE,

Alan MacDonald

Sanford, Maine



PaulDirks
PaulDirks

The amount of time our leaders spend in spinning rather than governing or leading drives me absolutely nuts.

Do you ever listen to Jake Tapper or read Michael Scherer play word Games? I hate to tell you Joe, but you're the problem.

RichardDBailey
RichardDBailey

It seems to me that the problem in these matters usually comes down to when the "narrative" is in conflict with the truth. But in our hyper-partisan, media-mad world the narrative has become more important than the truth. The narrative sells. The narrative polls well. The narrative gets 'Likes' on Facebook and followers on Twitter. The narrative then gets picked up by a media addicted to self promotion and hooked by the "arc of a story"that has traction and momentum.  

The narrative then becomes the truth in the eyes of the public and THAT is what matters. THAT is the endgame for that particular story or event. 

Welcome to the brave new "post-syllogistic" world of mass media communications. 




DavidBell
DavidBell

The tragedy in Benghazi was that four good people lost their lives in support of the Obama administration's position that bin Laden was dead and al Qaida was on the run.  They ignored CIA warnings to the contrary because the election was nigh.  They even ignored the fact that the British evacuated their  Benghazi facilities in the face of increasing threats.  Worse, they really believe their own hype.

pafaye
pafaye

Joe Klein, Your quote....."The amount of time our leaders spend in spinning rather than governing or leading drives me absolutely nuts"

Drives YOU nuts along with every thinking person in America!

mantisdragon91
mantisdragon91

I guess they need to keep this circus going as long as possible. Anything to keep the public from realizing that their austerity idiocy is hampering what could have been a much more robust recovery.

TyPollard
TyPollard

Are they paranoid-ly protective? Maybe so. It's not like there is anybody looking for anything to get them in the most dishonest ways.

Paul,nnto
Paul,nnto

Sully-"As does the pattern of the Clintonistas’ giving their enemies a sword to plunge into them"

JK-"(defensiveness) part of the DNA of Hillaryland."

Now I understand, she brings all this nonsense on herself. 

"the amount of time spent on these talking points was obscene" It's as if they were concerned that pundits and republicans would parse them to death.


kbanginmotown
kbanginmotown

@PaulDirks Good call and great link, Paul. The White House press corps is *miffed*, and, therefore, the American Public gets to listen to the ensuing temper tantrum. Unbelievable. Can we get a Sixth Estate, please? The Fifth is broken...

In related news, Joe's "IRS-Mess" post got linked by Drudge (who still pictures HRC on his front page, not that she's the *real* target of B'zi, y' know) , and garnered 1800+ locust droppings...er...comments as of 10PM EDT. I'm sure the High Sheriffs must be SO pleased.... 

jmac
jmac

@PaulG  The liberal media is now reporting on this because of the drum beat of Republicans in congress insisting on repeated hearings.

If you can't figure out where the stink will settle, you missed an impeachment and a preemptive war that eventually American's understood - without the stink of Congressional partisanship and a drum beat of idiocracy.  

jmac
jmac

The Downing Street memo got little coverage in America while our press eats up Benghazi.   Is that "malformed content" or can I at least mention that?  One meeting moved to a basement by the Republicans because it wasn't "official".   Barely covered in the U.S. while Benghazi gets numerous hearings (not moved to a basement) and massive press coverage.  

Shame on us.  

jmac
jmac

@LonniNorton“It is not reasonable nor feasible to tether U.S. forces at the ready to respond to protect every high-risk post in the world,” Mike Mullen, the retired admiral and former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who served as vice chairman of the independent review, said Wednesday."  

You want to protect diplomats in Africa?  Do you want CIA agents in Africa protected?   Call your congressman and get him to shell out the money.   Maybe we can cut education even further and have more money for missions in Africa, or we can tax the poor and middle class even more.   


bobell
bobell

@Jetstar99999 I wonder if you remember when D!ck Cheney defended himself against accusations of leaking classified material by successfully claiming the right of the White House to declassify anything it wants.  That's one of many things I wonder about.  I do a lot of wondering these days..

mantisdragon91
mantisdragon91

@Jetstar99999 So exactly how many places will you post the same cut and paste propaganda with no citation of what right wing conspiracy site it originates from?

kbanginmotown
kbanginmotown

@PaulDirks To say nothing about the recent pressers by President Obama and Jay Carney in which they fielded dozens of questions about golfing with Republicans, 2nd-term "juice", and B'zi!B'zi!B'zi! and exactly one (1) question about jobs.

To paraphrase Joe: 

The amount of time our "journalists" spend in word-parsing rather than reporting or researching drives me absolutely nuts. 

shepherdwong
shepherdwong

@PaulDirks This from a pundit who got his fame and riches from transcribing a political campaign. Though I have to agree, it seems to have driven him 'round the bend.

TyPollard
TyPollard

@PaulDirks  And now a post about the IRS in which Joe has conclude he know the details without the benefit of anything except his gut. This all reflects on Democrats and Obama because perfection is the standard for Democrats.I have no defense for mistakes made but to extrapolate these examples as systematic is maddeningly lazy.

buffalo.barnes102
buffalo.barnes102

@DavidBell How are these "four good people" so vastly more important than four grunts in Afghanistan? Where is your mock outrage over them? All four of them placed themselves in harms's way and paid the price. As we used to say in the Marine Corps: "If you can't take it then why did you join?" To say that Obama, personally, had anything to do with the death of these four people is ridiculous. Yet on and on it goes. Time and money wasted on alligator tears and Monday morning quarter-backing as Rome burns. Bah!

swagger
swagger

@DavidBell" They ignored CIA warnings to the contrary because the election was nigh."  so it was a political strategy to set themselves up for a disaster by not sending more security or closing the facility in order to win the election?  or, they won the election by murdering 4 americans?  call me slow but i don't get it.



mantisdragon91
mantisdragon91

@DavidBell They ignored CIA warnings? It was the CIA that the Ambassador was meeting when the attack occurred.

reallife
reallife

@TyPollard@PaulDirks"because perfection is the standard for Democrats"

hahahahahaha   ooohooooooo  hahahahahaha LOL  

 a good laugh is always good - thanks 

aaaaaahahaha

candidate for funniest post of the day

 

 

 

DavidBell
DavidBell

@swagger @DavidBell No, it was not intentional to have four people killed.   It was a foreseeable aftereffect of failing to heed warnings of our own intelligence people, and those of our allies.  The arrogance of believing that their hype was true, when all evidence pointed elsewhere.  I don't think they did it on purpose.  They are not insane, just incredibly incompetent.

Paul,nnto
Paul,nnto

@TyPollard @Paul,nnto I just get a kick out of these two ostensibly criticizing republicans but tellingly lay the blame on Clinton which in turn excuses these two from their same behavior. 

So very clever. 

AAC
AAC

@mantisdragon91 @DavidBell @swagger 

The CIA's presence that day means nothing.  At that point, it was too late to do anything to protect them.

Were there, in fact, warnings beforehand?

PerryWhite1
PerryWhite1

@DavidBell @swagger You mean like the 13 attacks on our embassies during the Bush Administration, resulting in 53 deaths? You mean like Republicans cutting $331 million from the State department's security budget earlier in 2012? That kind of incompetent?


Or how about just ideologically-driven drivel, like your posts?

mantisdragon91
mantisdragon91

@DavidBell @swagger Our own intelligence people are the ones who asked for the meeting in Benghazi that day and coordinated the security. So I ask again seeing as the meeting was requested and guarded by the CIA how can you claim that this was the result of the administration's failure to heed the warnings of the intelligence community?