Ophthalmologist Senator Fights Nanny State Imposition of Non-Blind Pilots

Yep, that’s a good bit of irony right there. You’ve got to love buffoons like Rand Paul with their “the Federal government is the problem so let me run for Federal office so I can perpetuate it” platitudes. It’s a classic.

Don’t forget: Rand is a self-accredited opthamologist. This bill could take money out of his pocket!

This is another example of traditional conservatism being opposed by both parties’ establishment.
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“There are a lot of states that already have laws, and I think the states ought to take care of it.” ..is a classic conservative theme and the “it” at the end could refer to abortion, gay marriage, gun restrictions, health issues, etc.

He’s a Tea Party candidate. Ideology trumps reality for those riding in that clown car. He probably thinks firemen are overreach of government influence over the rights of individual fires.

Yeah, screw states rights, that’s what those evil founding fathers wanted. States Rights needs to be yanked right out that stupid constitution of ours.

Rand Paul should have taken note of the Democratic way of doing things and just voted yes without even reading it.

Damn Neocons!

Don’t worry about safety, the next step will be a mandate that all commercial air carriers have polarized, laser-proof glass in the cockpit windows. The resulting rush to comply will stimulate the economy and create jobs. It’s all part of the master plan.

You do understand that planes fly from state to state, right? That they don’t just stay within a states borders when they take off? And that means that it’s not just a state thing, right?
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Because otherwise, your username would be hilariously ironic.

Momento: A challange for you – Name one thing that YOU THINK should not be controlled by the federal government.

That’s right, because lasers respect political boundaries like state borders before they ever consider the laws of physics.

Mori-the-moron speaks and all libtards listen intently.

If aviation had anything to do with the states he might have a point. However beyond nominal control of local airports which still fall under Federal authority they do not. Rand does not have a valid point.

I dunno. It’s a view of governance. It’s not obviously insane to think that states are better at/more appropriate for enforcing a law like this.
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Rand Paul is obviously an absurd character with poorly considered beliefs– he believed the Government should provide him with a high standard of living as an ophthalmologist,* but kinda-sorta thinks that the Government shouldn’t be involved in enforcing civil rights,** and wants to federalize the abortion issue with a constitutional amendment– but this view about federal criminalization of this issue is one that you can agree or disagree with.
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* – http://www.frumforum.com/rand-pauls-personal-special-interest
** – http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2010/05/the-proud-ignorance-of-rand-paul/56995/

Laser pointers are like guns, so banning their use in these situations would be like banning guns ….

Man…. I hope I didn’t hurt momento…. he may be down for the count trying to answer that question!!

It’s not that hard. Anything confined to the borders of the state: Alcohol sales, hunting licenses, state funded tax initiatives, etc etc. The list is very long.
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Y’see, I’m not locked into a rigid dogmatic ideology. I can evaluate an issue on its merits and act appropriately. The rubes in the Tea Party are ideologues. They don’t care if an issue is truly local or federal. All federal government is bad, ergo the states should do everything. Full stop. It doesn’t matter if a tax increase would actually hurt or help, all taxes are bad. Full stop. This is how they treat every issue. Fully against or fully for, no middle ground.
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This is why Rand voted the way he did. He didn’t vote on the bill for its merits. He’s an ideologue. So, all government regulation is bad, and he’ll vote against all government regulation. What’s actually getting regulated is irrelevant to him in the end.

Welll, hello Rusty! Sobered up enough to type. Good for you.
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The true irony or your comment, of course, is your lock step belief in everything Glenn Beck tells you. You’ve already bought his ‘George Soros Super Villain’ bit. You’re all over the Caliphate crap. You’ve vilified a 78-year old professor. You think Obama might be the anti-Christ. Where ever Glenn Beck goes, you’ll go goose-stepping after him. I bet you even have a basement full of gold collectible coins and non-hybrid survival seeds.
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But yeah, ok. All liberals listen to little old me. Well, in that case…
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ATTENTION MY LIBERAL MINIONS! PLEASE SEND ME COOKIES. AND A GLASS OF MILK! AND I COULD USE A BACKRUB!

Because every American has the God-given and constitutionally enshrined right to laser weaponry and to use those lasers at airplanes they feel threatened by. This is about personal safety, you liberal Nazis. Those airplanes are big and loud and moving fast, so Americans need protection. In fact, we need to mandate the purchase of lasers by every single American!
http://www.sunstateactivist.org/

Historically, they’ve been awful eager to promote Constitutional amendments banning a couple of the things you’ve listed above. I often wonder if the ‘states rights’ rhetoric is more of their Plan B for when attempts to legislate at a federal level fail.

M0mentom0ri,
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rdw can probably go you one better. He can probably give you the “mother of all hand-jobs” to boot…
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One proviso, though… you’re gonna have to convince him that you’re Dave Petraeus.
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And remember to sleep on your back after that… he doesn’t seem to have full control of events when that name “comes” (ha!) up…

I’m guessing you didn’t intend that seriously, but still. Nobody is banning laser pointers. Just a use of laser pointers that could kill people. There are plenty of laws restricting the use of guns. You’d be hard pressed to find someone who thinks we should legalize using guns to murder people.
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So no, banning their use is absolutely nothing like banning guns.

Momento, adding to your answer, most professional licenses are states-only, not fed, like doctors (earl, where’s yours?), engineers, architects, even lawyers. No national licenses here, so clearly these are state’s rights issues.

Next thing you know, they’ll outlaw sharks with frickin’ laser beams attached to their heads.

As I said, decon, the list is long.
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I just hope I didn’t hurt americanwithabrain…. he may be down for the count trying to wrap his head around such complexity.

…most professional licenses are states-only, not fed…
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Pilot’s certificates are issued by the FAA, Radio operator licenses by the FCC. Very generally, if it crosses state lines, it’s Federal.
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…so clearly these are state’s rights issues.
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No, not really.

Is that really to much to ask?

Rand Paul just doesn’t want to offend the Sky Buddha!

Decon, schedule an appointment with my office and you will see my degree’s (3) and my medical and society certification (5) posted clearly on the wall.
No, I will not treat you free gratis and no, I am not certified in Psychiatry, only surgery….you might keep that in mind before scheduling your appointment.

The proper way to determine policy is to imagine hypotheticals, figure out how you want them to play out, and then create policies that will result in the desired.
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For example, let’s say a plane is flying from L.A. to New York. Before it crosses out of NJ airspace, someone shines a laser into the pilot’s eyes.
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How does Rand Paul imagine this plays out? Who does he want to investigate? If the suspect is caught in NJ, does he want NJ police and D.A.s trying gather evidence from out of state witnesses and federal agencies in support of a prosecution.
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Ideologues like Paul clearly don’t think at all about the real-world consequences of their positions.

Welcome Ladies and Gentlemen to the earljr SLAPDOWN. Go earl go!!
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It’s not that hard. Anything confined to the borders of the state:
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And hopefully the borders of New Jersey are big enough to contain mori-the-morons super ego.

We may have differing opinions about what should be federal and what should be state, but at least we understand there isn’t a singular solution and are willing to discuss where the resources are best applied for the maximum benefit.
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My point about Rand and the Tea Partiers is that they know of no such distinction. Look at our brainy friend who started this thread. He was convinced – convinced, I tell you! – that I wouldn’t be willing to suggest that something is best handled at a state level. An ideologue like him is incapable of a nuanced position, and by projection, believes that those who disagree with him are similarly inflexible in their positions. The reverse is also true. Since the Tea Party demands complete fealty to the Tea Party platform – without deviation – they assume that other people are equally monolithic in their beliefs. The idea of a pro-gun liberal, or a Christian progressive is anathema to their world view. And that which they don’t understand, they attack. Or they watch with glee while the Beck’s and Limbaugh’s do the heavy hate lifting for them.
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And that’s why Rusty regales us every day with George Soros’ latest nefarious plots, and that’s why Freeper is convinced the world’s scientists have banded together to perpetrate the greatest fraud in human history as part of some sort of New World Order master plan, and that’s why they think all adherents of Islam are out to get us regardless of ethnic or sect differences. Etc, etc. To the right-wing fanatics amongst us, all of these groups are of a single mind and working towards a unified goal. Just like they are.

“Welcome Ladies and Gentlemen to the earljr SLAPDOWN. Go earl go!!”
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Yes, congrats earl, I’m a broken man. Someone call my therapist.
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“And hopefully the borders of New Jersey are big enough to contain mori-the-morons super ego.”
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I live in Atlanta. I grew up in Philly. Neither of which are in New Jersey. Or ancient Babylon, for that matter. Don’t drink and do geography, Rusty, you’re embarrassing yourself. Again.

We do have sea bass….

Rand Paul has the right idea. If we don’t put a stop pretty soon the federal government will be legislating the clean water i drink… Oh never mind.

But this isn’t even a state’s right issue. The federal government has domain over the national airspace (NAS). Full stop. Those much revered (but little understood) founding fathers lived in a time when the sky was the domain of the birds, but I’m sure they would agree that for NATIONAL SECURITY purposes (the thing conservatives cite when they want to do things like torture brown people) there should be a unified way of governing the air that ALL states share. Kind of like how they decided to control the coastal areas of the United States.

Dear Leader, your cookies are on the way!!

Back rubs are extra.

This is one of those dividing lines not between Conservative and Liberal or Democrat and Republican but, instead, between reasonable and unreasonable.

For brain’s question, what things would I not want to have under federal control:

Public schools (but with some state and federal assistance to the poorer communities with only basic requirements for the funding)

Local and state police I want local, not federal

Fire departments I want to see remain under local control since mayors have a massive advantage of knowing more about where to place fire stations than anybody at a state or federal level.

Department of public works (local road maintenance – possibly known by other names in other communities).

Real Estate, Legal, Medical and teaching certification needs to be done by the state.

Really I don’t think I, reasonably typical of the range one calls “liberal” that I want to change the status quo either back to where it was 150 years ago nor towards significantly more federal control.

This and taxes are where the totally impractical ideologues like Ron Paul have a toggle switch answer set to “no”.

For serious conservatives as well as liberals, it is not a toggle switch answer.

momemtomori, I also live in Atlanta and you paint the Tea Party with a broad and inaccurate brush.
We have a very large and motivated group of citizens from ALL walks of life who are very concerned about our country. The massive debt and irresponsible politicians who are no longer responsive to the concerns and will of our citizenry.
We helped elect a very diverse and equally motivated group of public minded people to office last November and yes, they WILL have an impact on government policy now and in the future. I think Mr. Obama is cognizant of this fact and as a result, positioned himself further to the center.
Most Tea Party criticism seems to emit from the far left and I guess this should not be surprising. America has sent a very clear message that governing from the left is NO LONGER acceptable.

Earl,
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We all are very unimpressed with your license in message therapy from the University of Phoenix no matter how much you brag about it.
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Obviously you aren’t a doctor but see intelligent, well educated mainstream Americans here and make self aggrandizing statements to try and prove a point.
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In reality we all know that you are in your late teens to very early 20s and have a know-it-all attitude from growing up watching Fox with your parents.
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Please be honest if you with to have any respect from anybody.
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Right now you’re like a wanabe proctologist: the butt of every joke.

As usual, fatpatrick pollutes every topic with his unsolicited, inane commentary.
Even a surgeon can recognize a personality disorder and Mr. Sartor, you definitely fit in this category.
Save your junior high school insults for someone who actually cares what you think.

“you paint the Tea Party with a broad and inaccurate brush”
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How so?
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earl, I’m not arguing that the Tea Party is just a homogenous group of disgruntled old white males. I concur with you the the group is somewhat diverse across age, gender, and race.
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My point is that the Tea Party is of a single monolithic ideology. Taxes are bad. Government is bad. Anything not Tea Party is socialist. Violating these principles means expulsion from the group. The Tea Party tosses the insult ‘RINO’ as often as Rusty calls anyone to the left of Attila the Hun a ‘libtard’. If you don’t think the Tea Party has a purity test, then you haven’t been paying attention. So to return to your original statement, in what way have I misrepresented the stated positions of the Tea Party? Are they not anti-tax, anti-federal government, and ideologically pure?
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Another point: look at your own words. “America has sent a very clear message that governing from the left is NO LONGER acceptable.”
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Really? No one in America believes in anything from the left? There’s no support for Social Security? There’s broad support for killing off Medicaid? Every Tea Party candidate that ran won?
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No. ‘America’ did not send a message. A portion of America that leans to the right sent a message. A good portion of the country wants governing from the left and they are just as American as you are. And some of them actually got their candidates elected, too. My problem with the Tea Party is they think in unrealistic absolutes. All government is bad. All taxes are bad. All liberal ideas are stupid and they hate America, etc, etc, day after day.
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Glenn Beck has said progressives can only be stopped by shooting them in the head. Everything the Tea Party has done and said amounts to “We are never going to work with you”. If I’m wrong about that, then work with me to find a way to live together. But if you agree with Beck and Limbaugh – that I’m evil and bent on destroying America – then we got nothing to talk about. In the end, its your call. I’m ok either way.

“This is one of those dividing lines not between Conservative and Liberal or Democrat and Republican but, instead, between reasonable and unreasonable”
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So you want hand-held lasers under federal control? This is so they can be registered (for a fee), get a license (for a fee) to operate, require annual inspections (for a fee) and then tax both the sale and use.

We can then have the Department of Hand-held Laser Technology housed it in the Dept of Homeland Security. They can then open a research lab to test lasers. The EPA can test whether they contribute to global warming then users can trade carbon credits.
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Just think of all the additional imaginary jobs just from this one piece of “reasonable” legislation.

Good lord, Freepling, that’s paranoid even for you.
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No one is talking about the ATF breaking down your door and stealing your cat toy laser pointer. They’re saying that attempting to crash a plane by blinding a pilot with a laser pointer should probably be against the law.
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Or are you such a hard core right-winger that you think people should have the ‘freedom’ to crash planes?

Wow! It worked!
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nom nom nom
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ATTENTION LIBERALS! I NOW NEED A HOVERCRAFT!
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(hey, if it worked the first time….)

Tee hee hee! You’re so FUNNY, freepee! And STUPID!

Rev Jim that is what I have been saying about you for months

Obviously you aren’t a doctor but see intelligent, well educated mainstream Americans here and make self aggrandizing statements to try and prove a point.

Why is it that the left believes that if you make pointing laser a “federal” crime those willing to crash a plane who shriek in horror and immediately change their ways?
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And yet argue against capital punishment because it is not a deterrent.
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“conversetts” Name one regulation or federal law that has not expanded out in to an infrastructure to support the very being of the law or regulation and you may find out that the stupid one is you!

Momentomori, If you agree that our debt load cannot be sustained and must be addressed, then we have mutual accord. If your agree that our government has been ignoring the will of the people, then we are definitely walking the same path.
There is much to be corrected, momentomori and it behooves us all to get behind this effort. The Tea Party may have its faults, but it provides the engine to bring about this change. I started interacting with our local chapter with some trepidation but was quickly won over by their dedication to better government. Again, people from all walks of life, black, white and brown. (yes, even in Atlanta)
Anyone underestimating the power of concerned citizens, should only look to Nov.2nd for confirmation of our combined clout. As Mr. Obama succinctly stated, “we got a shellacking”.
We intend on staying the course until our country regains fiscal sanity and starts adhering to the will of its citizenry.

“”you paint the Tea Party with a broad and inaccurate brush”
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How so?”
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By the every fact you asked this question shows that you have earned the title MoronMom
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“My point is that the Tea Party is of a single monolithic ideology. Taxes are bad. Government is bad. Anything not Tea Party is socialist”
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And this proves you are an idiot on the scale of Rev JIm

or smoking or salt intake or sugar in drinks

Momento, you’ve stooped to the childish “say everything he says back to him”?

That’s sad. You were doing pretty good debating, but that’s a new low for you.

Patrick: Rest assured, I was not asking YOU a question about anything. There are liberal people that post here that, while taking jabs, are civil and make their point well. You are not one of them.

We have an interesting contrast here between earl and Freepy.
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earl is sticking to his guns, but presenting his point of view and willing to talk about solutions. I can live with that. While I’m not sure earl and I would agree on the remedies, there is likely some common ground we could reach or some compromises we could make.
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Freepy copy/pasted what I wrote, then said it was proof I was an idiot and offered no substantive rebuttal or even an admission or denial. Later in this same thread, he suggests the liberal nanny state wants to kick in his door and take his laser pointer. Because that’s what the government always does. I can’t think of a better example of the ideological rigidity of a Tea Party member when it comes to their opinion of the government than Freepy’s Federal Bureau of Forcible Laser Pointer Recovery. Thanks, Freepy. You make it easy.
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earl, I’ll buy ya a beer some time and we’ll see if there anything we can agree on. Manuel’s in Little Five Points has a good vibe and a decent burger.
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Freepy, let me know if the black helicopters ever stop following you around.

Earl,
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You certainly do make blanket statements.
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“…If you agree that our debt load cannot be sustained and must be addressed, then we have mutual accord…”
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Not necessarily.
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Any thinking person knows that Revenue minus expenditures equals debt.
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If you exclusively look backwards in time for the US, as the Tea Party does, and does so with rose colored glasses, you will say that spending is the problem.
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If you read and study history and discover how terrible life was back then for 80% to 90% of the public with only 40% getting high school diplomas, 60% having running water, 50% with electricity and, maybe 15% with telephones in their home and a lifespan of about 55, you do not wish to return to those times.
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If you are not wrapped up in the American flag like a mummy to the extent that you can not see other countries, you will see that other countries provide far, far more – not less – to their people very successfully and manage not to have deficits approaching ours since they, also, have taxes higher than ours.
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So, if you fear the harm it will do, you will notice that the US does not have a significantly higher growth rater (sometimes lower) than Canada, England, France, Germany – far lower than Ireland’s 1990s growth….
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So, that same concern would make you chose to believe in the opposite of the Tea Party: Increase government domestic expenditures on many things by, say, 20% and raise taxes by 20%.
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So, your original statement is completely off.

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“If your agree that our government has been ignoring the will of the people, then we are definitely walking the same path.”
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On the wrong path?
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Yes, I, among others, say that shutting down the public option, not doing enough to restore the Glass Stegal act…. in many ways on the wrong path.
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Earl, you make a moronic mistake in, apparently, believing that there are only two paths.
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You complain that Obama is not far to the right like you and we complain that he is not a liberal.
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That does not mean that we agree.
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Now, anybody who has ever dated a nursing student knows that one can not diagnose a person by looking at their text for high blood pressure, diabetes, obesity or impotence.
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Since you have, you either don’t mind using your diplomas like toilet paper by mocking your own profession or you are not in medicine at all.
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Having relatives who are psychologists, I can tell you that you, also, can not, as you had with me, diagnose a person for hyperactivity via their text only.
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(Morbid obesity and hyperactivity almost never coexist in the same person since people with adhd are characteristically energetic and, therefore, burn up calories.)
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So, stop playing doctor and just attempt to use facts to debate, Earl.
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And, no, I am not impotent, but I do not get erections from looking at men.

“Momento, you’ve stooped to the childish “say everything he says back to him”?
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That’s sad. You were doing pretty good debating, but that’s a new low for you.”
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Because…
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“Man…. I hope I didn’t hurt momento…. he may be down for the count trying to answer that question!!”
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…is an asinine comment and deserves an asinine response. Blame it on growing up in Philly, but I give as I get. Insult me, and I’m more than willing to insult you back.
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Speaking of which, calling yourself ‘americanwithabrain’ is pretty much begging me to point and laugh at you. I mean seriously… who calls themselves that?

“There are liberal people that post here that, while taking jabs, are civil and make their point well. You are not one of them.”
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Yeah, I bet you’d rather be facing off with Earl,
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“Now, for the laugh of the day ” I have no trouble getting women’s phone numbers”…. RIGHT……and pigs can fly, too. Obese, myopic, bald and ugly…..I’m sure the ONLY women you get, fatpatrick, are the times square hookers you buy with your unemployment checks and I would imagine they work very hard to suppress their gag reflexes when they agree to give you a quickie. What a disappointment you must have been to your parents….you have FAILURE written all over your ugly mug. Now go back to being unproductive because you do it so well. I am done with your astonishing stupidity.”
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Compared to this mental patient, you should thank me for not being too rude.

“Why is it that the left believes that if you make pointing laser a “federal” crime those willing to crash a plane who shriek in horror and immediately change their ways?
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Why do nine out of ten people who call themselves “conservative” and are, by a more fair measurement, a part of the far, far right of the Republican Party fill their posts with “left believes that” and other mind-reading statements?
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Obviously criminal laws on federal, state and local levels are both crime deterrents and make enforcement possible as well.
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Just like making meth illegal doesn’t mean that most of the Red States don’t have a huge meth problem. It means that law enforcement can take action.
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I don’t know what the far, far right think, but I presume that they don’t. They just take marching orders from Glenn Beck to join organizations funded by the Koch brothers.

Did you know earljr is a doctor? He’s a doctor ! A doctor!!

You know, thinking of doctors and how they behave off the job, my landlord is a pediatrician.
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I’d met him a few times and lived here a few months before I found out that he was a doctor.
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Like many doctors and most pediatricians, he is one of the most polite people I ever met.

I wish people would get off this “states rights” kick. The states don’t have as many rights as most people think. They never have. For Cripes sake we fought a war to force some states to remain a part of the USofA. How much more proof do people need to know the central government controls most everything.

The federal government’s powers are limited under the Constitution but it uses taxes and “grants” to the states to keep them under control. If anyone really wants a limited federal government, then limit the right of the federal government to use money to control the states in areas like education, law enforcement, etc. The federal government keeps state and local governments weak by crowding them out of the tax base and then uses taxes that should be going to state and local governments in the first place as carrots dangling over their heads — if they don’t beg the feds for the carrots, they are not doing their jobs. It is a real waste of effort and creates massive inefficiencies in government, particularly a bloated federal bureaucracy.

Yes, momentomori, I know Manuel’s well. As a matter of fact, the Grady crowd meet there on a fairly regular basis and I agree….the burgers are pretty doggone good.
Stay dry and safe during this unpredictable winter season we are having. I am finishing up an eighteen hour day here (weekends at Grady can be rather hectic) and look forward to getting home.