Fear-Mongering and the Mentally Ill

Jared Loughner deserves no sympathy. The same cannot be said about the 2.4 million adult schizophrenics in America or the roughly 55 million other adults with mental illness. In the wake of mass killings there is always the danger of a fear-fueled backlash against the innocent—remember the Sikhs attacked after 9/11? Amid generalizations and misstatements of fact, there is now a danger of such a backlash against the 25% of American adults with diagnosable mental illness.

My friend Joe Klein has a column in this week’s magazine in which he asks, “Given the flood tide of massacres perpetrated by crazy people, have we made a grievous error in our policies regarding the confinement of the mentally ill?” Joe says of schizophrenics, “not all of them are violent, but a significant minority of them are.” In fact, according to Jeffrey Swanson of Duke University, who studies violence in the mentally ill, just 7% of schizophrenics commit a violent act, including shoving or pushing, in any given year. By comparison, says Swanson, 10% of males aged 18-24 commit such acts annually. “The best estimate we have (albeit from the 1980s) of the proportion of violence in the United States accounted for by mental illnesses is 3%–5%,” wrote Paul Appelbaum, director of Columbia University’s division of Law, Ethics and Psychiatry.

Joe then suggests that violent schizophrenics are homeless. “Such people,” he says, used to be confined to institutions, but by the 1960s the streets of most of America’s major cities were “teeming” with homeless people, many of them severely mentally ill. “Teeming” is an unattractive choice of words: having reported on discrimination against the Roma (better known as gypsies) in Eastern Europe, it conjures up in my mind the rhetoric of infestation used against ethnic groups there. But in any case, why are we talking about the homeless at all? Loughner wasn’t homeless. Neither was the killer at Virginia Tech. Joe doesn’t cite a single example of a massacre committed by these “teeming” masses of crazy homeless people, let alone enough to support the idea that there is a “flood tide” of them.

It is probably worth noting at this point that no one actually knows if Loughner is schizophrenic. There are lots of reports of drug abuse, which can produce delusions indistinguishable from those generated by schizophrenia, but there is no public psychiatric diagnosis. True, a research psychiatrist named E. Fuller Torrey of the independently-funded Stanley Medical Research Institute performed a Frist-like tele-diagnosis and declared “chances are 99% that he has schizophrenia.” But Torrey is a controversial figure. In a review of Torrey’s book, “The Insanity Offense,” for example, Appelbaum criticized Torrey’s “dubious use of data” and said that in one case he turned a “guess based on inadequate data” into a “’clear’ finding.”

Even if Torrey guessed right–he may well have–and Loughner is schizophrenic, one needs to be careful about the conclusions one draws from the events in Arizona. According to Torrey, who is the most outspoken proponent of the ideas Joe is espousing, deinstitutionalization is responsible for much of the violence among the mentally ill because they can’t always stay on their meds on their own. For a small number of deeply troubled people, that is undoubtedly true, and it is a national shame that our society doesn’t do a better job of protecting itself and helping them. I actually agree that for a small number of very dangerous people who are mentally ill, some form of compelled outpatient treatment or institutionalization is the answer.

But the language one uses matters and fear-mongering can not only harm the innocent, it can be dangerously counterproductive. It could even have played a role in Arizona. If society is going to identify and help those at risk of dangerous, violent schizophrenia, the best place to focus resources and attention is at colleges, which are semi-monitored environments with existing funding streams and (usually) health and mental health infrastructures. It is also where those most likely to begin to show signs of schizophrenia, which declares in the late teens and early 20s, spend their days. But fear-mongering makes the job of getting college kids help harder. Look at Pima Community College, which suspended Loughner rather than engaging him directly with an active, dedicated counselor. Says one professor friend of mine, “stigmatizing the mentally ill and exaggerating the risk of harm only scares faculty away from a difficult but necessary part of the job.”

 

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  • afguy

    Where has wordsmith Frank Luntz been throughout all of this?
    .
    Ater all, given his area of study, he would be the ideal guy to trot out to prove that overheated rhetoric has no part in all of this…
    .
    Except that he has been involved as a RW strategist to do exactly that – to select the right words to use so that the electorate will REACT in exactly the way they want them to.
    .
    He was all over Fox in the weeks leading up to the events in Tucson, demonstrating and polling in seminars how using the right negatively-charged words in a campaign can elicit a desired reaction against the other side.
    .
    Let’s bring him out to have this discussion about how language and tone had no role to play. If it doesn’t, he has no job and they’ve been wasting their money on him.
    .
    If it does, he’s exhibit A.

  • hippooath

    Mentally ill, the new Kitten.

  • newfreedomblog

    “But the language one uses matters and fear-mongering can not only harm the innocent, it can be dangerously counterproductive.”

    .
    You have made many posts, and many statements on “how language one uses matters and fear-mongering can not only har the innocent, it can be dangerous”.
    .
    Where do you have references or citations to these profound statements? Do you have links for all of this. As was pointed out to you before, simply because you say so, does not make it fact.
    .
    I do however congratulate you on being a champion for the mentally ill. Having worked now over 30 years in the mental health fields it is a long time coming for not on the media to recognize these deficits in our society, but that there has also been a project to loosen our rules and regulations so far as requiring for example someone to take their medicine.

  • http://shortplaysaboutrealpeople.wordpress.com Michael Maiello

    Careful about the “drug abuse” stuff. He used marijuana, pscilocybin mushrooms and LSD. There’s no way that marijuana “can produce delusions indistinguishable from those generated by schizophrenia…” and it would be incredibly rare with either mushrooms or LSD.

  • newfreedomblog

    This is not true.

  • http://shortplaysaboutrealpeople.wordpress.com Michael Maiello

    It’s entirely true.

  • newfreedomblog

    http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=8821
    .

    Substance abuse
    A number of drugs have been associated with the development of schizophrenia including: cannabis, cocaine and amphetamines.[3] Approximately 50% of people with schizophrenia excessively use drugs and/or alcohol.[31] While the role of cannabis may be causal other drugs may just be used as a way of coping with unpleasant states such as depression, anxiety, boredom and loneliness.[31][32]
    .
    Cannabis is associated with a dose-dependent increase in the risk of developing a psychotic disorders.[33] Frequent use has been found to double both the risk of psychosis and schizophrenia[32] Some research has however questioned the causality of this link.[34] Amphetamine, cocaine and to a lesser extent alcohol can result in psychosis that present very similarly to schizophrenia.[3] The same may occur due to alcohol to a somewhat lesser extent.[35]

    .
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia
    .
    Facts are sometimes hard to dispute. Are they not mr maiello

  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    Thank you for providing a thoughtful review of Joe’s post. I certainly felt a bit of discomfort over the original but I was unable to place my finger on the problem above and beyond Joe’s well known cavalier attitude towards civil liberties,

  • http://shortplaysaboutrealpeople.wordpress.com Michael Maiello

    There’s no causality there, NewFreedom.

  • shepherdwong

    Jared Loughner deserves no sympathy. The same cannot be said about the 2.4 million adult schizophrenics in America or the roughly 55 million other adults with mental illness.
    .
    This is politically correct claptrap. If schizophrenics deserve sympathy for their illness – they do – then so does Loughner. He’s lost his mind and will either lose his life or spend the rest of it in an institution. Schizophrenics, manic depressives, drug addicts, all sorts of mental illness will cause people to do harm to those around them, there’s no need or reason to apportion blame or make moral judgments about them.
    .
    The problem is, we won’t raise the taxes to pay for the sort of public mental health care apparatus that could help them before they harm others and/or themselves. That’s the “stigma” that keeps them on the streets until it’s too late (we’re still arguing whether health care is a “right”). From what I’ve read, I’m betting that Loughner’s parents would have loved to have had such a system to turn to for help as Jared’s behavior became more erratic and troubling. Same with the family of Seung-Hui Cho.
    .
    http://johnib.wordpress.com/2007/04/21/seung-hui-chos-parents-and-sister-grieve-in-isolation-share-darkness-with-victims-families/
    .
    .
    Says one professor friend of mine, “stigmatizing the mentally ill and exaggerating the risk of harm only scares faculty away from a difficult but necessary part of the job.”
    .
    I’d bet that it has more to do with fear of their own ability to intervene effectively, what the student may do and the advice of the lawyers hired by Human Resources.

  • shepherdwong

    There’s no causality there, NewFreedom.
    .
    None shown, anyway. Mentally disturbed people often self-medicate. So you could say that mental illness causes drug abuse much more reliably than “smoking marijuana causes mental illness”.

  • Ivy_B

    I’d bet that it has more to do with fear of their own ability to intervene effectively, what the student may do and the advice of the lawyers hired by Human Resources.

    .
    So true! I worked for a large university with a teaching hospital and over the years there were a couple of staff that clearly had problems. Not of the Loughner type, but very problematic. I couldn’t even find any way to suggest they consider counseling or that there was really counseling available for the situation.

  • Ivy_B

    Digby posted a very interesting chart and article about gun violence and the causes. There are some interesting statistics that show assumptions on this topic are not always true.

    http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2011/01/where-bullets-fly-and-why.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

  • newfreedomblog

    Again, I disagree from the basis of someone who has seen first hand that drugs can in fact induce schizophrenia, can mimic schizophrenia with long term use and abuse.
    .
    There are plenty of research studies which have been done to support this. While I will agree there have been some studies to dispute. Where I have the most problem with your comment is “There’s no way that marijuana “can produce delusions indistinguishable from those generated by schizophrenia…” That statement is false.

  • Ivy_B

    That link may not work because I took it from her twitter feed. This is from the blog.
    .
    Mental illness is included in the assumptions mentioned.

    http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2011/01/where-bullets-fly-and-why.html

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    I believe it is drugs and alcohol, plus the lack of treatment, in combination with serious mental illness, that shows up as a pattern in those few who are violent. Much of the violence is directed at the only people, unfortunately, who are trying to help them, their family.

    An ethical issue that will surely arise, if this public conversation continues, is what do those who commit these acts know about right and wrong? Are they so far removed from reality, they cannot be held responsible for the acts they perform, in reality? The answer to that may be found once we know the cause. If you happen to be one of those, whose extra pair of X and Y chromosomes gets crossed, or you inherit your illness from your parents, are you responsible for becoming a murderer, if no one ever diagnoses you, you are incorrectly diagnosed by your GP, or you refuse to take your medication because your illness causes you to think there is nothing wrong, and no one can force you to take it?

    Like many illnesses, early diagnoses and treatment are probably best. However, that may cost a few dollars. At this moment we know what the costs of doing nothing are. Maybe it is time to take the taboo out of the closet and approach the problem rationally?

  • shepherdwong

    There are some interesting statistics that show assumptions on this topic are not always true.
    .
    Certainly, the focus on mental illness is a complete sideshow. What a surprise, the data show gun violence is about difficult socio-economic conditions, gun fetishism and “conservative” politics. Whocoudaknown?

  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    Its easy to confuse cause and effect. Does drug use cause mental disorders or do mental disorders encourage drug use?

  • square1

    Jared Loughner deserves no sympathy.

    Whatever. Massimo Calabresi barely has a clue as to what motivated Loughner.

    The truth is that we do not know yet whether Loughner has a mental illness or how severe it was. And if he was mentally ill, what the symptoms were.

    I completely agree that the vast majority of schizophrenics are not violent. But those that are usually have an additional mental illness on top of the schizophrenia.

    IF Loughner suffered from paranoid delusions and voices that told him to act violently — and I am not saying that he did, but the possibility cannot be ruled out yet — then why would he not deserve some measure of sympathy?

    Does Calabresi walk around with voices in his head that he is able to resist through superior strength of character? Or is Calabresi, like most of us, simply lucky to not suffer from that affliction?

  • http://shortplaysaboutrealpeople.wordpress.com Michael Maiello

    newfreedom, the marijuana stuff has been so politicized that I’ve just got real trouble with most of these studies. Also with Calabresi’s use of the term “abuse” rather than “use.”

    I don’t mean to denigrate your personal experiences though.

  • shepherdwong

    Again, I disagree from the basis of someone who has seen first hand that drugs can in fact induce schizophrenia…
    .
    How do you know that the drug use “induce[d]” the schizophrenia? You can’t. You don’t.
    .
    .
    There are plenty of research studies which have been done to support this.
    .
    Then it shouldn’t be hard to produce one. You can’t. You’re full of sh!t.

  • shepherdwong

    Again, if we were to have a serious discussion about an event like this we would be discussing (roughly): difficult socio-economic conditions, gun fetishism and “conservative” politics. But, instead, we’re having a media-led discussion about mental illness, “civility” and whether or not the killing of a US Congresswoman was “political”.

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    My understanding is pot may speed up the time that someone, who is going to get schizophrenia eventually, may get it, in a small number of cases.

  • newfreedomblog

    Thank you mr maiello.
    .
    Marijuana in and of itself, not tainted with or intentionally spiked with other known additives I do believe would not cause long lasting delusions or schizophrenia. But, I personally would like to see more in depth studies to be done. Especially since we are seeing more relaxed laws and policies on marijuana use.
    .
    I do strongly believe use and in some cases abuse of marijuana has caused schizophrenia, most likely it has caused an underlying predisposition to schizophrenia to rear it’s ugly head. This I do not believe no matter how many studies done will ever be solved. At least not with the technology we now possess. It is very sad to see a newly diagnosed schizophrenic on their very first admission to a psychiatric ward. Not only are they terribly confused, disoriented and afraid, when they are eventually stabilized with medications to counter the psychosis, delusions, and hallucinations they are like they have awakened from a terrible nightmare. Many I have held and comforted like lost children, they sobbing and shaking uncontrollably.
    .
    I wish I could cite specific cases I have worked on, but due to healthcare confidentiality, I cannot.
    .
    So far as money is concerned, we have put millions and millions of dollars into research and care for mentally ill folks. The problem in my opinion is not throwing more money at the problem. The problem is how we have relaxed the laws, regulations and policies to treat especially someone in full blown psychosis and refuse to take their medicine. It is nearly impossible now-a-days to have someone committed even for a short 72 hour period to be stabilized on medications we know will help a chemically imbalanced brain. Not until they have committed an act which has caused either themselves harm, or harm to others can anyone be forcefully treated or given medications. This cannot continue or we shall have more shootings, more Jared Loughners and more people like Gabby Giffords fighting for their lives.
    .
    Hopefully it is not you the next time or one of your loved ones.

  • 3xfire3

    Massimo,
    .
    “But the language one uses matters and fear-mongering can not only harm the innocent, it can be dangerously counterproductive. It could even have played a role in Arizona.”
    .
    I believe this is your 3rd article on the swamp where you have tried to link supposedly violent or fear mongering language with the tragedy in Arizona.
    .
    In all 3 articles you have been unable to prove any linkage.
    .
    I sincerely hope this is your last attempt at this argument which has been dismissed by just about every sane person in a position of authority who has examined the facts.
    .
    At this point you’re continuing to stir the pot and somehow blame violent language is doing exactly what the President has encouraged us not to do and that is attempt to blame our fellow countrymen for this tragedy.
    .
    Just because you badly blew it on your first article isn’t being helped by your continued attempt to find redemption for the less than stellar journalism on the first article.

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    Agreed, but I’m not sure anyone is preventing it. I for one would be interested in an economic explanation for the behavior.

  • haroldamaio

    Fear-Mongering and “the” Mentally Ill

    Is not “the” mentally ill fear mongering?

    It is. As was “the” Jews, as was “the” Blacks, once. Both very effectively.

    Harold A. Maio
    khmaio@earthlink.net

  • haroldamaio

    “schizophrenics” is an irresponsible representation.

    Harold A. Maio

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    I complain when people take personal stories and count that as evidence for their case, so, let me make it clear that I am not saying that I am proving a point with this. I am just telling a couple of stories. Since I use my own name, I will not use the real name of the people I am speaking of on the off chance that somebody who reads this knows somebody who knew this guy (unlikely, but, who knows).

    I worked at a place for a few years and this one guy usually was fun in kind of silly, slightly immature way most of the time and did his job well. But then there were other times.

    Once I was discussing him with another coworker.

    “Freddy’s a good guy,” I said.

    “Yeah, ” Dave replied, “except for when the FBI puts a computer chip in his brain.”

    That was a reference to the times Freddy needed his medication readjusted. He first claimed that it was for a physical illness and then said they were anti-depressants, but, when they were out of balance, Freddy worked like he was sleep walking and, like telling our boss “If the FBI calls, tell them I am not here” and “I think the FBI put a computer chip in my head”

    Actually Freddy was very passive and out of it when his medication needed readjustment.

    When his medication was working, he was a little silly and immature to get a laugh since he was, obviously, a very lonely man, by then in his late 20s and early 30s and his behavior without medication was so strange that it pushed people away. It was unkind to laugh about it, but, we all knew he was a harmless, good man with a serious problem which usually responded well to medication.

    I had a neighbor who was built like a body builder. At 5′ 11″ his height was not intimidating but his build was. So, when Andy put his hand on your shoulder to tell you something that made no sense, you really didn’t want to be the guy to tell him that he was totally delusional

    Andy (not his real name, either) once took me aside and said, “Patrick, I can’t stand my upstairs neighbor. I know that at night he is pumping poison gas into my room.”

    No, he wasn’t saying his upstairs neighbor farts a lot.

    The coworker one was one of the most law abiding citizens you knew.

    The neighbor I did not know as well, but, I never heard anything in the rumor mill (and where I lived it was quite a rumor mill) of him committing any crimes even though he believed that people were trying to poison him and, if he wanted to beat the living fk out somebody, he could have hospitalized them.

    The most dangerous person I ever knew was neither one of them. It was a severe alcoholic who, eventually was killed in prison.

    So, even though I have not presented evidence of what severe mental illness versus substance abuse is statistically, you can see why I would find a drunk guy more of a threat than the guy talking to himself about aliens or something.

    Those are just my experiences.

  • allthingsinaname

    Sorry Rusty there is nothing in the report that can come to your conclusion. It is clear that people prone to mental illness will use drugs, that is all.

  • shepherdwong

    Agreed, but I’m not sure anyone is preventing it.
    .
    Well, since the media owns all the air, we’re going to have the discussion they want, rather than the one we might prefer.
    .
    .
    I for one would be interested in an economic explanation for the behavior.
    .
    Actually, you might be surprised. Safe to say, if he were the child of a hedge fund manager, things might have turned out differently. If nothing else, he could have gone into the family business and blended right in.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    newf, are you suggesting that words don’t have consequences? that words don’t have meaning? that it is impossible to incite hatred and bigotry even violence through the use of words?
    .
    I don’t think links or citations were needed in this post. Words do have consequences. I’ve heard Congresswoman Giffords say as much last Oct., when Palin’s “target map” first went on the internet. We don’t know that Palin or anybody else motivated Laughner to shoot Giffords, but the circumstantial evidence is there that said he did.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    Many mentally ill have co-occurring illness with drug and/or alcohol abuse. To claim the mental illness came about as a result of the substance abuse is a red herring. The fact that some addicts are not diagnosed with a mental illness does not prove that the mental illness is a result of the addiction.
    .
    From my experience with mental illness and addictions (granted not huge and I keep asking my supervisor for training in duel diagnosis treatment) it is a “chicken and the egg” situation. We can’t know for sure which came first. I do know people who claim their addictions resulted from self-medication and they tend to trace their first usage of substances to a low point in their lives.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    Interesting story and sadly I can’t produce a link because I heard this at a mental health conference during casual conversation and never bothered to look it up but supposedly cigarette smoking as well as pot smoking has been shown to help people with schizophrenia control their symptoms. Also, I’ve heard rumors that doctors have begun experimenting with the use of THC in kids with ADHD.

  • http://tisias.wordpress.com tisias

    ehh it’s a slippery slope. I think less of the problem is the actual institutionalization and more the getting parents and friends and mentors to recommend to state to help these people, and also aiding those who NEED (capitals for emphasis) post-institution treatment.
    Let us not forget how the gun was made available to Loughner, but that’s another series of articles where people will scream from both sidelines.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    newf, you posted only the part that you wanted us to read, the part that proved your POV, but it wasn’t the whole story. Here is the rest of it:
    .
    .
    Cannabis use has been assessed by several studies to be correlated with the development of anxiety, psychosis, and depression.[89][90] A 2007 meta-analysis estimated that cannabis use is statistically associated, in a dose-dependent manner, to an increased risk in the development of psychotic disorders, including schizophrenia.[91] No causal mechanism has been proven, however, and the meaning of the correlation and its direction is a subject of debate that has not been resolved in the scientific community. Some studies assess that the causality is more likely to involve a path from cannabis use to psychotic symptoms rather than a path from psychotic symptoms to cannabis use,[92] while other studies assess the opposite direction of the causality, or hold cannabis to only form parts of a “causal constellation”, while not inflicting mental health problems that would not have occurred in the absence of the cannabis use.[93][94]
    .
    .
    Must you be a partisan on all matters?

  • morristhewise

    Of course, authorities won`t release the photo`s of Jared posing with his gun in the nude, it would be on the front page of every magazine in the world, degrading America`s youth, displaying them as macho freaks who love glock`s and rough sex.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    shep: I do wonder sometimes why we have a “public mental health system”. According to the republicans health care is not right and mental health, no matter how you slice it, is a form of health care.
    .
    Mind you, I’m not arguing against bettering the public mental health system, I’m arguing for a complete public health system. Those who are arguing that we need to improve the mental health system so that the Laughners of the world are “locked up” and treated before their illness leads to murder and mayhem and also claim that health care is not a right are talking out of both sides of their mouths.

  • pintortwo

    this argument… has been dismissed by just about every sane person in a position of authority who has examined the facts.
    .
    I don’t know 3xfire3. We’ll probably never know exactly what went on in the shooter’s head- but I don’t think that is really important. The political climate is getting more toxic, more tense. Threats of violence against political figures are up. Threatening to blow up the NYT building (Coulter), strangle M Moore (Beck), and yes, put gun sights on politicians- is that healthy, or more important, safe? Language that de-humanizes individuals with opposing views, that suggests we need to remove them from the body politic (ie liberals are a cancer), or suggesting that certain groups want to take your liberties, or end the American way of life– can’t you see how this might lead to violence? especially among the mentally ill or those predisposed to act violently?
    .
    If Arizona promotes some real soul-searching, it could prove a turning point, and be a positive consequence of a tragic event. If it doesn’t, this atrocity may well be just the beginning.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    I knew a guy who used to run up and down street at night chasing aliens. A woman I know giggles all the time because the voices in her head tell her colorful jokes. My aunt’s voices tell her that if there is dirt, or even dust around that she will die…
    .
    .
    Most people with schizophrenia are not dangerous. But it seems we only have a national dialogue about mental illness when some delusional maniac comes out of the woodwork. It is good that we talk about it all, though I know it will change nothing.
    .
    .
    BTW, this week the mental health treatment agency I work for had to lay off 7 case workers. And next fiscal year will probably see further reductions in staff.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    Right, Harold.
    .
    The use of the word “schizophrenics” tends to dehumanize the people who suffer from an illness. I much perfer the use of phrases like “people with schizophrenia”
    .
    IMO it is unacceptable to view people as one dimensional. Schizophrenic, manic-depressive, diabetic, autistic child, “cancer patient”…All of these terms imply a willingness and a social acceptance that these patients are nothing more than the illness they have. I have bipolar disorder but I have never, nor will ever view myself as a mental health patient or as a manic depressive… those viewpoints are a means to becoming only a mental health patient. I have bipolar disorder, but I am a mother, a daughter, a sister, an aunt, a homeowner, an employee, a citizen, a tax payer and many other things… I AM NOT MY DISEASE.

  • carotexas1

    newfreedomblog this part of your post I agree with from personal experience.

    The problem is how we have relaxed the laws, regulations and policies to treat especially someone in full blown psychosis and refuse to take their medicine. It is nearly impossible now-a-days to have someone committed even for a short 72 hour period to be stabilized on medications we know will help a chemically imbalanced brain. Not until they have committed an act which has caused either themselves harm, or harm to others can anyone be forcefully treated or given medications. This cannot continue or we shall have more shootings, more Jared Loughners and more people like Gabby Giffords fighting for their lives.
    .

  • repzak

    Actually Guys, in this one case newfreedom is correct – if perhaps overstating things a bit. Pot has consequences for your physical and mental health – there is widespread international agreement that it can trigger latent schizophrenia at the very least, and there are also studies showing severe degradation of the brain from excessive long-term use of pot.

    I’m not saying that a joint now and than is a problem – at least for 99% of people, but it’s not risk free and claiming it to be so is disingenuous. It’s probably no worse than smoking on average though.

  • http://dorfage.wordpress.com wanderingspector

    Mr. Calabresi

    I wanted to express my appreciation for your blog entry here. I have been watching the discussion here with more than a bit of apprehension and wondering if someone would bring some compassion.

    For you see, I am mentally ill, but the medication that I am on keeps the illness at bay. I have put my life together now and have even managed to earn both a masters and a PhD. I have found gainful employment and married a wonderful, beautiful woman who knows about my condition but loves me all the same. My life is on track then for as long as the medication is effective. Unfortunately no one knows how long that will be or if, in fact, there is any time-limit at all.

    I appreciate your understanding and compassion for those of us who are working hard to overcome this type of illness. I have often told wife and friends that if I had a heart condition or some more socially acceptable illness that I might be seen as a good role model for trying so hard to overcome my illness. As it is, it too often seems to be my “dirty little secret” that must never be discussed.

  • apr2563

    Mr. Calabresi: Thank you for your thoughtful posting. Joe Klein often writes before he considers the deeper consequences of his postings.
    .
    When I was in college and living in a dorm, many years ago, a girl in the dorm tried to hang herself from her top bunk (which should have indicated her reasoning was a little flawed). The girl was brought to the dean of women and asked to leave the school. The reasoning was her actions were bad for the school’s reputation.
    .
    I felt awful that this was the way it was handled. It sent a terrible message to any other students who might be struggling with mental problems. It seems we haven’t evolved a better system to give help and guidance to those that present the need for assistance.
    .
    I don’t know what the answer is but there must be a method to offer a compassionate hand to those suffering from mental illness.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    This thread is probably dead by now, but I need to say this. I’m hearing a lot of talk about how we have to keep guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. I object to that. Though I don’t want a gun, why should my second amendment rights be impinged just because I have a mental illness. I’ve never committed a crime, but I’ve had psychotic episodes and have been a danger to myself in past and there is no guarantee that I will have a relapse, in fact 25 of living with the disorder suggests that I will, indeed relapse.
    .
    If the goal is to keep guns out of the hands of those few mentally ill persons who might have a tendency to commit a serious, deadly crime, how would that be achieved without denying guns to every person who has been treated for mental illness. At one time, in PA, a person who had spent time in a state hospital could not purchase a gun; though that law is still on the books, it has been rendered pretty much moot with the ongoing hospital closings.
    .
    This really isn’t about mental illness, anyway, since we don’t know for sure that Laughner was technically mentally ill. Unhinged? Certainly, but mentally ill? That is unknown. This is about guns and our fascination with them. It is about our lax gun laws that equate semi-automatic hand guns with extended magazine clips with the single shot muskets of the revolutionary war.
    .
    There is no excuse for these military-type weapons that are designed to kill a lot of people very quickly to be in the hands of ordinary citizens. There is less excuse for them to be sold legally.
    .
    The other night, Rachel Maddow made an excellent point that if the second amendment really is about the citizenry being able to take up arms against the government, then we should be able to purchase and have the all of the same type of weapons that the military would use against a citizen rebellion (i.e., anti-tank missiles, anti-aircraft missiles, even nuclear materials). Nobody will argue that such weapons fall under the purview of the second amendment, so why do deadly automatic weapons? If Laughner had had to cock the hammer for each shot fired, then far fewer people would have been shot last Saturday. And maybe somebody would have been able to take him down before he even paused to reload.

  • prophetspeaks

    Drugs DO cause mental illness. Here is the mechanism; they are openings for demonic oppression, which according to the bible, causes mental illness. These drugs include caffeine, nicotine, alcohol, pot, lsd, cocaine, etc and ALL PSYCH MEDS. This is why the anti-psychotics and anti-depressants frequently CAUSE violent behavior; the drug handbooks ADMIT that they often cause psychosis as a side effect. The truth is that psych meds do NOT cure or help mental illness; they cause it. All of the columbine like shootings were committed by people who WERE being treated with psych meds; this was the problem.

    The only ones benefitting from their use are the drug co’s. and the hospitals, who fraudulently bill insurance co’s for “Treatment” and who hold patients involuntarily for months and years just to get insurance money. Mental health parity laws are unfortunately just going to give them MORE financial incentive to do just this; it is unconstitutional, violating the anti-slavery amendment, since they use patients as unwilling medical experiment guinea pigs which is involuntary servitude, slavery.

    The biblical solution to mental illness is prayer in Jesus name; He cast out demons that caused mental illness, and gave his followers authority to do the same. It works, like it has for 2000 years.

    A lot of patients will TELL drs what is bothering them- demonic spirits, but because Psychiatry is premised on atheism, these explanations are regarded as delusions or hallucinations by a non-spiritual worldview. THAT is the problem.

    The dirty secret of psychiatry is that for 50 years they have been slandering christians as being “schizophrenic”. 90% of psych patients in hospitals are NOT psychotic at all; they are christians who testify to “hearing God or demons talk to them”. According to Christian theology, it is normal to hear voices; Jesus said “my sheep hear my voice” John 10:27. 90% of shrinks are atheists. This is the problem. Their 2nd question is always “do you hear voices” and anyone who says yes is thought to have “auditory hallucinations” a symptom of psychosis, and gets labeled schizophrenic. ANY CHRISTIAN would be called schizo by them, although most of them are unaware of what the criteria for the label actually IS! The correct answer to their question is, “EVERYONE hears voices, as thoughts in our heads. They come from the spiritual realm. “Inspiration” means “a spirit goes into it”. The bible (James ch 3, NT) says there is “wisdom from above and wisdom from below”.

    The NIMH claims 1in 4 people suffer from mental illness. THis is probably accurate, since drugs cause people to have demonic lying spirits around them, and coffee is so prevalent! we are a drug oriented society and that is the problem. Drug abuse is not separate from mental illness. But there are other causes as well; bad tv, videos, books, music, occult paraphernalia; and sin; they are all openings for demonic oppression. People need to simply assess their environment and remove what is an opening for it. it is caused by environment, not chemical imbalances or genetics.

    The mental health system is completely unconstitutional and needs to be dismantled to protect all of us; otherwise it is a tool to be used against any political dissident, like it was in Communist Russia and China. THe US is moving in that direction and has in reality been doing it for 50 years to Christians. It violates the first amendment for religious freedom because of its atheistic definitions and the laws that allow for forced commmitment and treatment. Such situations are extremely common and doctors and other “professionals” frequently LIE in court to claim someone is a “danger to themselves or others ” to justify holding and treating them.

    You can read my FREE explosive book WHich God had me write to expose atheistic psychiatry on my website. It talks about atheistic psychiatry & their toxic drugs, and how to heal mental & physical illness thru prayer in Jesus’ name; MANUAL FOR TRANSFORMATIONAL HEALING-GOD’S ANSWER TO PSYCHIATRY. 1PROPHETSPEAKS.COM

    All illnesses are caused by demonic spirits which have as “assignments” those diseases; they can be rebuked in Jesus name. I have done it; it works. I know from experience. The diseases are contagious because spirits can jump around thru contact. More than once I had a sprit of depress– jump on me from someone who had it; someone prayed and it left. This is evidence that it is caused by a spirit, not a chemical imbalance.

    The psych meds cause brain liver and kidney damage and other physical problems and all kinds of horrible side effects; this is why patients stop taking them when they are not forced to do so.

  • liberalmeltdown

    Let me get this straight… the left here believes that drugs have no effect on schizophrenia? Are you speaking from experience…I mean so far in your personal life?
    .
    I would say, are you freakin’ kiddin? I have seen so many people in my lifetime, in both close personal relationships and those out in the street whose lives are being destroyed by drug use. Their paranoia gets to the point of complete insanity. You know, those neighbors, ( or maybe it’s some of you here) that blocks out their windows with tinfoil…then you see little holes in it. HELLO.
    .
    How to tell when your neighbor is a meth addict.

  • prophetspeaks

    Psychiatry is ATHEISM masquerading as science. They CLAIM mental illness is caused by chemical imbalances; this is a BIG LIE to sell drugs. Drugs do not cure what is caused by drugs; they just add more to the problem. Einstein supposedly said no problem is solved on the same level as its cause. if one addresses physical illnesses and mental illness from the spiritual level, that is a level of higher authhority; it is treating causes and not symptoms. Mental health people admit they don’t cure mental illness; they only “manage symptoms’. This is because demons do not cast out demons, and their drugs are openings for demons as bad as the other drugs are. Psych meds are Worse than pot, in many cases. You can read about healing in my book at 1prophetspeaks.com

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    I imagine you are a little perturbed with the chemical imbalance theory because it probably presents a big problem to those who promote the idea there is such a thing as a soul or self that has an existence outside the body, even if it is inside the body, temporarily. Unlike you, science doesn’t pretend to have knowledge for which it has zero proof and for the moment, the cause of mental illness is still unknown. However, if I was going to pretend to have knowledge of God, so I could rake in millions from unsuspecting and ignorant people, I would secretly give those who are “demon possessed” drugs like seroquel, and my flock would believe I really was performing miracles, because they would see a person transformed.

  • Massimo Calabresi

    Great comments, great discussion. Thanks for the (generally) civil tone, on-point debates, and most of all for the personal testimonies which were brave and contribute valuable ground truth to the conversation. I learned a lot!

  • prophetspeaks

    wELL i GOOGLED THE QUESTION “WAS J. LOUGHNER HOSPITALIZED” AND FOUND THAT yes HE was 7 YEARS EARLIER AFTER DRINKING A LOT OF VODKa. The odds are very low that he was NOT drugged then; since pretty much everyone in hospitals IS drugged. What that means is that, demons went into him, and that is why he was crazy. He was not a Christian so he likely did NOT get deliverance prayer, which he needed, to counteract that. So yet another example of a mass shooter having a history of psych meds. They all do. Many people, having been on psych meds, get drawn to and addicted to other drugs, i.e. smoking, caffeine, whatever else. Addictions come in groups; being addicted to one is a nopening for others. This is because demons come in groups and inv ite others in to a person they inhabit. So many of these Jewish mental patients are in trouble because their families would not think to take them to a Christian church for prayer, and that is exactly what they need to be cured. THe problem is spiritual ignorance, by the Jews and anyone else, of the healing power of Christ. you can read more about His healing power at 1prophetspeaks.com

  • drzagar

    The title and theme of the article should have been “Fear Mongering and the Mental Health Providers” rather than the current focus. Central to Tuscon, Columbine, West Virginia, Northern Illinois, Erstad Germany and “going postal” in Oklahoma is the chance judgment by our professionals. Using human decision making is no better than 50% accurate. In fact mental health professionals tend to release “dangerous” and retain “harmless” in studies of their judgment and decision making. But the same is true of physicians, judges, presidents, executives, professors and any human being. The solution often bandied about is gun control but actually “More Guns Less Crimes” by John Lott answered that approach. There are two crucial solutions to the 600 workplace homicides and dozen college and dozen high school killings that yearly occur in the US. First actuarial assessment like Univeristy of Minnesota used at admission years ago, the Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory and my Safety Scale outlined in the December issue of Psychological Reports 2010. These tests are sensitive and specific in diagnosis and better than what is currently in use in over 90% of the country, human judgment. Second educating parents with mentally ill children and lowering the barriers to actuarial assessment and treatment (medication and cognitive skills training) will also lower the probability of these mass murders. What’s the cost? The MMPI2 for this young man costs $15. The medications less than $100. The direct and indirect cost of each homicide in 2006 US dollars is $3.95M. So barring a court order in a liability settlement, the Wild West will continue in America and the globe until we institute a more rationale approach which I outline in “Predicting and Preventing Homicide: A Cost Effective Empirical Approach from Infancy to Adulthood.” With these mass murders occurring more frequently and closer together, only time will tell.

  • hopefullysane

    Well, excuse me, prophetspeaks, but I equate overly-long posts, extensive use of all-caps, and hysterical immersion in irrational religious rhetoric as clear warning signals. Your extreme isolation from mainstream thinking is not the justification you imagine. Rather, it is a clear sign that you need counseling and possibly the medication you so fear. Seek help. You are seriously out-of-balance. Your nickname alone speaks volumes – a truly spiritual person does not have the arrogance of assuming he has all the answers. Seek help.

  • http://themindstorm.wordpress.com chrisahickey

    Wow, newfreedomblog, for someone who says they work in mental health care, your stats are so amazingly innacurate it’s almost funny. Please – let me know where you work so I’m sure NEVER to bring my son, as your words lead me to believe you don’t have a whole lot of respect for the persons you treat.

    Persons with schizophrenia can be violent during psychotic episodes, but only 3-7% of persons with schizophrenia commit violent crime, as opposed to 10% of the male population between 18-24.

    And please – they are PERSONS WITH SCHIZOPHRENIA. Not schizophrenics. Labeling people with their diagnosis is as stigmatizing as the false belief (that 87% of Americans hold, thanks to entertainment and articles (othe than this one) in Time this week) that persons with schizophrenia are dangerous.

  • mkassowitz

    The inevitable result of one of these tragedies is the renewed use of terms like “screening” and “prevention” coming from the psychiatric community or their PR outlets. What always seems to be missing from the reporting is the frightening statistic that these shooters and nuts were in the hands of psychiatry in one way or another BEFORE their crimes. This was certainly true at Virginia Tech and school and workplace shootings far too numerous to list here. Looks like the same may have been true of the Tuscon shooting with the revelation that the shooter had been hospitalized for heaving drinking in the past. Hard to imagine that he was not put on psychiatric drugs at that time, since that is the usual pattern of “treatment.” Could we please have media outlets stop listening to psychiatrists and their flacks as authorities? Or, are the advertising revenues from their BigPharma allies just too addicting?

  • http://classof1960.wordpress.com/ majormike1

    “In the wake of mass killings there is always the danger of a fear-fueled backlash against the innocent”

    We saw that as Paul Krugman and Time rushed to demonize Conservatives. As former White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel once said, “You never want a serious crisis to go to waste.”
    Blood still flowed as Democrats raved, “Sarah Palin pulled this trigger!” Then Democrats seized the opportunity this serious crisis presented: “It’s right-wing rhetoric, it’s Rush Limbaugh, it’s Fox News, &etc.” However, in a separate article, Time Magazine concludes: “In short, saying Sarah Palin or Glenn Beck caused Loughner’s actions is, to put it charitably, completely idiotic.”
    When right wingers are critical of the Left, do they incite others to violence even if the others aren’t right wingers, and even if they are unaware of what was said?
    How many innocents were gunned down when ultra-liberal Democrat Markos Moulitsas (aka Kos) said he put a “bull’s eye” on Gabrielle Giffords and other “Blue Dog” Democrats for selling out progressive principles? (following Democrat reasoning, 20) Or the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee website which featured targets on a map and still instructs Democrats to “Click on a red bullseye to view a Republican targeted for opposing economic recovery.” (following Democrat reasoning, it’s just a matter of time) Unlike Palin’s map, which targeted districts, the DCCC and Kos maps targeted INDIVIDUALS.
    Apparently Democrats get their exercise by jumping to conclusions.

  • wil2liv

    Bravo for your article!

    You are correct in stating that we do not yet know if Jared Loughner has paranoid schizophrenia; what we do know, however, is that mental illness has been put forth as one potential explanation for his actions. After a shooting like the one in Tucson, as you state correctly, there is often a fear-driven backlash against the millions of innocent people in this country with mental illness. You are further right to contextualize the plight of those with mental illness in this country as a larger human rights issue. Also, you are accurate about the tenuous correlation between violence and mental illness. I would just add this statement from the January 11 blog of Thomas R. Insel, Director of the National Institute of Mental Health: “Research has suggested that those with schizophrenia whose psychotic symptoms are controlled are no more violent than those without SMI [serious mental illness].”

    You mention colleges as playing a key role in preventing tragedies like this one in the future. I could not agree more. May I suggest as a potential resource a FREE speakers’ bureau called In Our Own Voice? In this program, developed by the National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) in 1994, two individuals in recovery from serious brain disorders like paranoid schizophrenia tell their stories. One such speaker is my friend Jay, who has paranoid schizophrenia. Jay first got sick in 1977 while at basic training; he began to think that his fellow trainees could read his mind and thought he saw what he took to be spirits exiting from their bodies and entering his. Instead of attacking others, Jay avoided everyone, including his family, because he was afraid people were trying to hurt him. As a result, he ended up homeless in Atlanta and dropped down to 98 pounds, looking, in his father’s words, “like death eating a cracker.” Luckily, Jay got treated fairly early on and is now largely stable. It is essential that college students not only have access to mental health services but also to stories like Jay’s. Without knowing what mental illness is and its warning signs, how can we expect young people to seek treatment, especially in the case of an illness that subsumes its victims so completely that they don’t even know they are sick? Jay himself says that had he known anything about schizophrenia, he might have recognized, at least initially, that he had a mental illness and he might have talked to someone, might have tried to get help. As it is, very few people know what serious mental illnesses like Schizophrenia and Bipolar look like, never mind that, according to the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration 2003-05 National Survey on Drug Use and Health Report, stigma is the third-highest reason people in need of mental health treatment do not seek it out. A program like In Our Own Voice (NAMI) can make large inroads in the fight against the very misinformation that underlies, and ultimately leads to, tragedies like Tucson.

  • samadler

    You lost me with “Jared Loughner deserves no sympathy.” If he’s mentally ill, then he’s as deserving of sympathy as those 2.4 million other schizophrenics your heart bleeds for–maybe moreso, because now he life in prison or execution.

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