Morning Must Reads: Deal

Time magazine: “After the weekend, a deal extending all the Bush tax cuts temporarily (1-3 years) in exchange ….”

Earth to Time magazine: There were NO “Bush tax cuts”. Bush only PARTIALLY repealed the massive, redistributionist, marxist, Clinton tax increases. Obamao and the rest of the Democrat party (especially its media arm, i.e., the Washington/New York/American press corps) now want to reimpose the Clinton tax increases.

“500 words” –
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Obama has just been screwed by his brethren in Congress…
…again …literally.

Right textee… heaven help those poor misguided souls who want to return to the misery and poverty of the horrible Clinton economy….

Wiki-leaks more from the Terrorist, Julian Assange. Now he has exposed some of our most vulnerable sites around the world. Call it a blueprint for Terrorists to attack various places in the world to bring down the United States of America.
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I am sure there are many liberals on this very site who will call this man some kind of hero. That he is protected by the Constitution and is protected within the Constitution by the 1st Amendment, Freedom of Speech. Assange is nothing short of a terrorist, and should be treated as an enemy combatant.
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A list of those sites are listed in his most recent release found here http://213.251.145.96/cable/2009/02/09STATE15113.html#par15
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But, is this all just part of the “plan”. A plan which certain elements in the world and right here in our own country have been planning for a long time?
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With the likes of Van Jones and the Labor Unions calling for people to take to the streets advocating violence. To Claire McCaskill calling for people to pick up their pitchforks in a class warfare if the Bush tax cuts are extended to those making above $250,000 per year. To the most recent, two of the leaders of the Socialist Party, USA released the following statement;
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“The latest Wikileaks revelations should be a call to action for all Americans. It is time to tear down the empire that has been created in their name. Two tasks are first and foremost. We need to create a vibrant movement to end the wars being waged in Afghanistan, Iraq and Pakistan. No more occupations, no more military surges and no more drone attacks. Simultaneously, we must demand that the prison facility at Guantanamo Bay be closed immediately. Achieving such demands will open a political space to more directly challenge the centre of the military industrial complex by calling for an immediate reduction of the military budget by 50% and the closing of all US military bases abroad.
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As democratic socialists, we imagine another society, where the great wealth this world produces is put to use to meet human needs. Such a world would not need the secret cloak that covers the operations of the US empire. It would, instead, be based on notions that seem very distant from our current reality – democracy, free association and self-determination. We think that democratic socialism holds the potential to live up to these lofty ideals. Let the Wikileaks disclosures provide the motivation for you to join in this struggle.”

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Ask yourself. How far off is this statement from what we have seen liberals and those who have infested the Democrat party have been calling for over the past decade?

Alas deconstructiva, he appointed Geitner to do the deal negotiating. Just keeping the players straight.

In my opinion, Krugman got it exactly right and I agree — Let’s Not Make a Deal. I read Nate’s analysis the other day and it’s fine as far as bargaining position, but I think they shouldn’t have been bargaining.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/06/opinion/06krugman.html?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=a212

Is Van Jones predicting a Civil War in this recent speech he made?
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A “recipe for a battleground”.
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Excellent link, Ivy, thanks. I’m amazed that if the R’s really wanted to take care of the budget / debt (as TP’s claim they want) they’d fight to make the cuts expire …but they don’t. Of course that would contradict their raison d’etre.

Krugman – “But while raising taxes when unemployment is high is a bad thing, there are worse things. And a cold, hard look at the consequences of giving in to the G.O.P. now suggests that saying no, and letting the Bush tax cuts expire on schedule, is the lesser of two evils.”

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Cutting ones nose off to spite the face. Yes, isn’t Mr Krugman the clueless libtard who doesn’t have a clue about economics let alone public policy. We can only hope Obama doesn’t listen to this crackpot and hold out.
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But, for me, I say go for it. Don’t extend the tax cuts for anyone. Let them expire. THEN wait for the eventual fall of this very weak and lack-luster recovery. Let two full years of un-equaled spending by Democrats go wasted, and the unemployment rate shoots up to Depression levels of the 1930′s at over 20%. I am with you Paul. Please plead your case to your dweebs on the left. Better yet, call Van Jones. Maybe you can take this out to the streets demanding rich folks pay, make it into a class warfare.
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To the sane and rational. Spending is and has been the problem. Democrats in control of Washington have overspent, and the result has been a big fat goose egg. Nothing to show for all the trillions they have spent over the past 2 years.
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QE2 with Bernake spending over 600 billion hasn’t even cooled yet, and already he is calling for QE3. Imagine that!! How low will your dollars be? How much money will you lose over the next year as the incompetent leaders in Washington and New York decide our futures?

For our serene and easily placated friend rusty –
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-abrams/reagan-and-clinton-raised_b_714155.html

http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/files/2010/12/US_TAXGDP1210.gif

From newfree’s quote:
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Two tasks are first and foremost. We need to create a vibrant movement to end the wars being waged in Afghanistan, Iraq and Pakistan. No more occupations, no more military surges and no more drone attacks. Simultaneously, we must demand that the prison facility at Guantanamo Bay be closed immediately. Achieving such demands will open a political space to more directly challenge the centre of the military industrial complex by calling for an immediate reduction of the military budget by 50% and the closing of all US military bases abroad.
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Thing is, this is exactly what actual conservatives, including the Libertarian Party, are calling for.
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Newfree, if you want to be a conservative, if you want further the Teaparty movement, focus on the dominant sources of wasteful government spending and “big” government– the policies of what has come to be know as the “military-industrial-complex”.
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Join your Libertarian brothers and sisters (the originators of the TP movement) in denouncing Big Government and wasteful spending by demanding that our new Congressional representatives slash the defense budget, end our occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan, normalize relations with Iran, stop providing military aid to foreign nations, respect International and Constitutional Law, end indefinite detention and repeal the Patriot Act.

Why aren’t liberals talking about the new study released by the San Francisco Federal Reserve On the net job impact of the stimulus? Oh yeah it was an expensive failure!
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Jobs created/saved were temporary AND at the cost of over $400,000 per job. The net impact by August 2010 was ZERO (except for the increase in the deficit) AND federal spending to state Medicaid programs appears to have decreases state and local employment.

This paper analyzes the fiscal stimulus spending provided by the 2009 American
Recovery and Reinvestment Act and contrasts what happened to what would have happened.
The ARRA or “Recovery Act” was enacted into law in February 2009 amidst a great deal of
economic and political debate. At the time, it was estimated to cost $787 billion over ten years.
More recent estimates put the cost at $814 billion1, of which about two-thirds comes from
increased federal government spending and one third is reduced tax revenues.2 Proponents saw
the stimulus package as a vital lifeline for an economy heading toward a second Great
Depression. They pointed to projections from the White House and others suggesting that the
stimulus package would “create or save” around 3.5 million jobs in its first two years.
Opponents claimed the massive cost of the ARRA would unduly swell the federal deficit while
having minimal or even negative impacts on employment and economic growth.
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The estimated jobs multiplier for total nonfarm employment is large and
statistically significant for ARRA spending (as measured by announced funds) through March
2010, but falls considerably and is statistically insignificant beyond March. The implied number
of jobs created or saved by the spending is about 2.0 million as of March, but drops to near zero
as of August.

http://www.frbsf.org/publications/economics/papers/2010/wp10-17bk.pdf

‘That include ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, TIME, ESPN1-2-3, MTV, NICK, USA, Reuters, Sports Illustrated, Martha Stewart Living, and all other media that doesn’t rhyme with Hocks Ruse?

Second little gem I discovered this weekend is from the American Institute for Economic Research (http://www.aier.org/- subscription required). They also put a harsh to the liberal mantra of tax cuts cause deficts.
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In the 3 years after 2001 & 2003 when the tax law changes were passed and phased in, tax revenues increased dramatically. (And this is the best part) Taxes paid by millionaire households DOUBLED.
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From 2003-2007 federal revenues from all income groups increased more than $700 billion.
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Amount of capital gains and tax revenue from capital gains doubled between 2002-2006.
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The liberals desperate irrational grab at higher taxes is just another failed excuse to raise spending under the guise of trying to balance the budget.

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Not raising taxes is a loss of potential revenue and not a new expense.

From the Libertarian Party platform (link):
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3.1 National Defense
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We support the maintenance of a sufficient military to defend the United States against aggression. The United States should both avoid entangling alliances and abandon its attempts to act as policeman for the world. We oppose any form of compulsory national service.
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3.2 Internal Security and Individual Rights
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The defense of the country requires that we have adequate intelligence to detect and to counter threats to domestic security. This requirement must not take priority over maintaining the civil liberties of our citizens. The Constitution and Bill of Rights shall not be suspended even during time of war. Intelligence agencies that legitimately seek to preserve the security of the nation must be subject to oversight and transparency. We oppose the government’s use of secret classifications to keep from the public information that it should have, especially that which shows that the government has violated the law.
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3.3 International Affairs
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American foreign policy should seek an America at peace with the world. Our foreign policy should emphasize defense against attack from abroad and enhance the likelihood of peace by avoiding foreign entanglements. We would end the current U.S. government policy of foreign intervention, including military and economic aid. We recognize the right of all people to resist tyranny and defend themselves and their rights. We condemn the use of force, and especially the use of terrorism, against the innocent, regardless of whether such acts are committed by governments or by political or revolutionary groups.
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They are conservatives, not people that “play one on TV”.

Liberals must be tormented and in great angst with the Wikileaks document dump. The see all of the “evil” of the US and it’s use of power worldwide. But another dirty secrets that liberals have been denying is the real thrust behind global warming– wealth re-distribution. It shows how the US tried to bribe, threaten and coerce others to by into the sham.

Just another instance of liberals having no shame.

Hidden behind the save-the-world rhetoric of the global climate change negotiations lies the mucky realpolitik: money and threats buy political support; spying and cyberwarfare are used to seek out leverage.
The US diplomatic cables reveal how the US seeks dirt on nations opposed to its approach to tackling global warming; how financial and other aid is used by countries to gain political backing; how distrust, broken promises and creative accounting dog negotiations; and how the US mounted a secret global diplomatic offensive to overwhelm opposition to the controversial “Copenhagen accord”, the unofficial document that emerged from the ruins of the Copenhagen climate change summit in 2009.
Negotiating a climate treaty is a high-stakes game, not just because of the danger warming poses to civilisation but also because re-engineering the global economy to a low-carbon model will see the flow of billions of dollars redirected.
Seeking negotiating chips, the US state department sent a secret cable on 31 July 2009 seeking human intelligence from UN diplomats across a range of issues, including climate change. The request originated with the CIA. As well as countries’ negotiating positions for Copenhagen, diplomats were asked to provide evidence of UN environmental “treaty circumvention” and deals between nations.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/dec/03/wikileaks-us-manipulated-climate-accord

Thank you, proudly named NewFreedomBlog! In Vino Veritas!
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The nattering little libtards on this site lack our keen common sense insight! While its obvious to us that the UN’s Agenda 21 is the genesis of all of this, those unable to see the portends will lag behind us Real Americans who know the real truth. Julian Assange is in league with other foreigners (like the evil mastermind George Soros) to dominate our media and politics! If it wasn’t for proud Billionaire-Americans like Rupert Murdoch, we’d never know that Agenda 21 was happening!
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The liberals think that Agenda 21 (aka “The Plan”) is about ‘sustainable building’ or ‘social justice’ or some other treehuggy nonsense, but its not, is it NewFreedom?
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It is nothing short of a Marxist scheme to redistribute wealth to those that don’t deserve it on a worldwide basis!
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And we know who don’t deserve it, don’t we NewFreedom? We see them everyday in their welfare-paid cadillacs with their loud music and strange smelling children. What did they ever do to make America the Exceptional?
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But it’s worst than that NewFreedom! I think there’s a bigger element of The Plan. I’ve read some books NewFreedom. I’ve done the research on the apocalypse. The Illuminati used a golden apple as a symbol. Now we have Van Jones and liberals calling themselves ‘ACORN’. I don’t think this is a coincidence NewFreedom! I think there may be a more diabolical force at the root of The Plan.
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NewFreedom, have you ever considered that Obama might be the anti-Christ as predicted in The Bible? Scary thought, eh?!?

AS throws out facts, Tex – did you bother reading the graph? Guess not.

‘tormented’! ‘angst’! ‘shameless’!
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Even ‘evil’!!!!
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My Free friend in the Keystone State is reading the writing on the wall too!.
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Liberalism is not just wrong! It’s demonic!
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Turn away from the slippery slope of helping your fellow man! When The Bible says it’s easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to pass through the gates of Heaven”, He was issuing a challenge! ONLY the rich got a chance to get in! See? Its right there: “Easier”! So what if you got to puree the camel first, it’ll fit!
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Good forth and make money and keep as much as possible! It’s God’s will! Charity (or ‘wealth redistribution’) is the devil’s work!

“The nattering little libtards on this site lack our keen common sense insight!”
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Thank God. I have enough problems as it is without dealing with mental illness.

“Krugman the clueless libtard who doesn’t have a clue”
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Ha! Well stated Newly Free Blogger! In Vino Veritas!
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That’ll wipe that smug look off of Dr Krugman’s face! No one like someone who keeps rubbing our noses in how right they always are!

Well crap, therealistamerican discovered our Agenda 21. There goes that idea; it was meant to be kept secret since world domination is tougher to achieve openly these days. The military’s Area 51 is nothing compared to Agenda 21. With friends like these, who needs WikiLeaks?

Thank you free. I’d like to re-print a comment of mine from the other day:
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The single biggest expenditure (of the stimulus), 35% of the package, was tax-cuts. There was modest spending on food stamps and unemployment benefits, while the majority of the rest of it went to the states. It enabled states to pay contractors for work already done and construction already planned (“shovel-ready”)- it kept them in business for a little longer. There was almost no involvement in new initiatives (ie, modernizing the electrical grid, solar panels on every Fed building, etc) to create jobs and increase demand. There were no (Keynesian) ditches, as it were. It was a reminder that the same old thing still doesn’t work so well.

I’m coming out of the closet…to reveal to everyone that I’m a Republican. But wait until I’m re-elected first.

“Turn away from the slippery slope of helping your fellow man!”

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It is easier for a crazy man to come on TIME.com purporting to be a conservative, while we know he is just another libtarded nutjob.
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IQ53 is that you?

You weren’t fooling Real Americans with your shenanigans!
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“Agenda 21 is a comprehensive plan of action to be taken globally, nationally and locally by organizations of the United Nations System, Governments, and Major Groups in every area in which human impacts on the environment.”
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http://www.un.org/esa/dsd/agenda21/
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Here’s tip for the future megalomaniac liberfascists. Next time you have a master plan for world domination, don’t publish it on the internet. Real Americans have recently discovered that the internet is not just a tool for corrupting the spirit of American Youth, but in actuality a communication network used by leftists for plotting revolution!
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I’ve been watching a cat play a piano on something called ‘Youtube’ for several hours in attempt to parse the code hidden there.
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Be warned leftist conspirators! I will publish my findings shortly!

It is easier for a crazy man to come on TIME.com purporting to be a conservative, while we know he is just another libtarded nutjob.

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…or redstate…
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http://www.redstate.com/moe_lane/2010/02/27/obama-administration-kills-23k-space-related-jobs-in-florida/#comment-30902

There were stimulus spending for alternative energy but it was also a bust. You cannot get growth from technology that is still developing. The tax credits helps companies and a narrow group with no long term benefit.
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Let’s not forget the “tax cuts” were targeted tax credits new home buying and cash for clunkers. Created no new demand but did cost a ton of money. Every time the government tries to tell us how to better spend money, it will be a colossal waste of time and money

TAXES: A $400 to $800 credit for many taxpayers

A key element of the stimulus bill would provide most Americans with a tax credit of $400, or $800 for married couples. The tax credit would phase out for single taxpayers with adjusted gross incomes of $75,000 to $90,000 and married couples with AGI of $150,000 to $190,000.

The tax credit would increase the average taxpayer’s paycheck by about $8 a week, prompting some to question whether it will do much to stimulate consumer spending. But for a single worker, the credit is the equivalent of a $500 salary increase, after taxes, says Clint Stretch, managing principal for tax policy at Deloitte Tax. “In this economy, if you walked into your boss’ office and demanded a $500 raise, you’d probably get laughed at,” he says.

Retirees who receive Social Security benefits and individuals on disability would receive a $250 tax credit, says Tom Ochsenschlager, vice president of taxation for the American Institute of Certified Public Accountants. Because these individuals typically don’t have withholding, they’ll likely receive a check, he says.

Other tax provisions in the stimulus package:

•An expanded earned income tax credit and child tax credit for low-income families.

•A higher education tax credit. Parents of college students would be eligible to claim a tax credit of up to $2,500. The credit is more generous than the existing Hope Scholarship Tax Credit, which maxes out at $1,800 and is available only for the first two years of college, says Amy McAnarney, executive director of H&R Block’s Tax Institute. The tax credit, which would be available in 2009 and 2010, phases out for single taxpayers with AGI of $80,000 to $90,000 and married taxpayers with AGI of $160,000 to $180,000.

•A stopgap measure designed to prevent the alternative minimum tax from hitting more than 24 million households in 2009. The AMT was designed to prevent extremely wealthy taxpayers from using loopholes and deductions to avoid taxes. But because it was never indexed to inflation, it has expanded to encompass more upper-middle and some middle-class taxpayers. About 4 million owed the AMT last year.

By Sandra Block

ENERGY: Weatherizing homes will save money

The agreed-upon stimulus plan provides about $50 billion aimed at ushering in a clean-energy future and includes money or tax credits for Americans to weatherize their homes and buy hybrid cars.

It also commits dollars to upgrading the electricity grid and underwriting renewable energy projects.

“This is going to be an extraordinary boost to our challenge of preparing for global warming legislation and re-energizing the American economy,” says Tom “Smitty” Smith, director of Public Citizen’s Texas office.

While many analysts cheered provisions to weatherize homes as both an instant way to create jobs and put money in consumers’ pockets, some say other initiatives are insufficient and won’t deliver a quick economic boost.

The bill sets aside $5 billion to weatherize more than 1 million modest-income homes, saving families an average $350 a year. It devotes $6.3 billion to improve federally backed and public housing projects with new insulation, windows and furnaces. Higher-income households can make similar improvements and get expanded tax credits.

For every dollar spent, such programs produce about $3 in electricity savings, Smith says.

Spending $11 billion to upgrade the nationwide transmission grid to get renewable energy from rural areas to cities and digitize the electric grid to prevent outages is more controversial.

“It’s just too little,” says Joel Kurtzman, senior fellow at the Milken Institute, an economic think tank. He says it will cost about $100 billion.

Kenneth Medlock, energy fellow at Rice University’s Baker Institute, says grid improvements will take years and won’t spawn jobs immediately.

Providing a tax credit of up to $7,500 for families that buy plug-in hybrids to spur a new generation of cars “will help the environment and help Detroit,” Kurtzman says.

But automakers won’t have plug-in hybrids and battery-power electrics in showrooms until next year at the earliest.

“To roll that into a stimulus is almost misleading,” Medlock says.

“It is easier for a crazy man to come on TIME.com purporting to be a conservative, while we know he is just another libtarded nutjob.”
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Newly Free Weblogger! I believe someone has hacked your account is attempting to sow dissent in our ranks!
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I’ve read your sage common sense wisdom for several weeks both here and at other places and know you to be a true Real American, and not an over educated liberal bed wetter! Surely we agree that Geroge Soros and the UN’s Agenda 21 are an attack on Exceptional American Sovereignty and one of the greatest threats America faces today! There’s no need for subterfuge! We won in November and it’s time for Real Americans to let their voices be heard!
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Are you with me NEW FREEDOM BLOG!?!

“I’ve been watching a cat play a piano on something called ‘Youtube’ for several hours in attempt to parse the code hidden there.”
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I would suggest masturbation instead. It’s exercise. It’s fun and there’s a really neat payoff at the end.

We need TRA’s help in interpreting this video since the MSM reporters (including here) won’t do so…

What’s funny is that this entire paper is about how the spending portion of the stimulus package created or saved about 2 million jobs, which Republicans claim is literally impossible.
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The part that appears not to have created jobs was the money to states for Medicaid. The author’s hypothesis for this: Because this spending came with “strings,” it caused the states to divert additional state funds, which otherwise would have gone to … (wait for it) … creating more jobs.

Can anyone mail me Agenda 21? I only have up to Agenda 19. I think I was late with my cabal dues…
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The cat knows…

I’m so demoralized. Nothing the republicans have said or done has crushed me like Obama totally rolling over on the tax cute issue.
As a democrat one of the most prized examples of my party has been the “Deficit Reduction Act” passed by Bill Clinton in 1993. I was in my late teens and it was the first time I had felt safe as an adult. I told myself the day it passed.. “we are going to be alright.” I felt the tension in my body start to ease that day. Sure enough, our economy recovered and we stopped the bleeding of trillions of dollars in deficit spending Reagan had started and HW Bush was unable to stop.. although he did try.. but was punished by his own party for it.
I felt proud to be a democrat. That defined a part of my identity. See, democrats stop the borrow and spend policies of the right. Democrats suck it up and pay for our spending. Democrats are responsible and compassionate. Democrats are good.

What is Obama? He sure is not paying for his spending. He just borrow and spends just like a republican.. but worse. He spends on all their additions and spends on all of the democrats additions and borrows from China to do it.

He thinks that is changing the way Washington works??? The hell it does. He is the worst of both worlds.

For the first time in my adult life I don’t know what my party stands for anymore.

I sure don’t want to stand for what Obama represents to me know. I feel ashamed of him. I feel afraid.

Rusty:

I have no doubt that liberalism is a mental disorder

“Bush only PARTIALLY repealed the massive, redistributionist, marxist, Clinton tax increases.”
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Did you inadvertently delete the mention of the Reagan and H.W. Bush massive, redistributionist, marxist tax increases? Of course, the question is facetious, as we all know that you are all about selective right wing propagandizing. Did you also happen to note the improved state of the economy following those tax increases? Of course, again, no, facts don’t matter when propagandizing.

Unfortunately, sacre dh (French code for ‘Holy Dirty Hippy’?), that is not an option available to me. It is a waste of future Real Americans.

I just want everyone in swampland to know that Obama does not represent my economic principals as a democrat. I don’t know what he is. He sure is not my idea of a democrat. Democrats are responsible stewards of the economy. Democrats passed the reduction deficit act under Clinton and it totally worked.
Republicans borrow from China and give the money to the rich and sink us in massive deficits.
But now Obama is just like a republican for his entire 4 year term.. but worse.

He does not speak for me.

I regret backing him. I picked the wrong horse. I should have supported Hillary. I feel such deep regret.

At $400,000 per job. It would have been cheaper to send those 2 million people checks for some amount that would have been re-cycled in to the economy.

But then according to liberal lore they would not have spent it properly unlike the government spending $400,000/job.

You’re not alone. The corrupting influence of corporatism / third way / whatever has been a disaster for Main Street and real people. Stuart has posted third way links before showing this; if you’re reading would you repost some here for lila? Thanks.

“Unfortunately, sacre dh (French code for ‘Holy Dirty Hippy’?), that is not an option available to me. It is a waste of future Real Americans.”
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Unfortunately, my screen name origins aren’t nearly as interesting. I prefer your explanation. Before the 2008 elections a right wing friend kept e-mailing me anti-Obama stuff and claimed that Obama supporters thought he was the Messiah. I supported Hillary before Barack and am a life-long atheist. Just to ruffle his feathers I signed all of my e-mails to him as Sacred Hussein. I just shortened it a little.
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“Real Americans” (as defined by their sacred cow, Sarah Palin) seem like jerk-offs anyway, so I think it’s OK to waste them. Tissue anyone?

Rusty:
I have no doubt that liberalism is a mental disorder
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Ha! I have no doubts that you are right, Pensylvania Freeman!
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Only the pathologically deluded can not see that the person stting in the oval office is a William Ayers trained, Reverand Wright indoctrinated, Ivy League deluded, Chicago thug lifer, Prentender in Chief! You’d have to have a mental disorder not to see him for a Maoist, Marxist, Muslim Fifth columnist of the highest socialist order!
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Poor deluded libtards! It takes Real Americans like NewFreedom and FreeinPa and FreeEarl and TexteeFree and myself, The Realest American, to show the The Truth!
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Let’s Roll!

Granted, Rusty, conservative argument often amounts to nothing more than empty name calling, but even by your standards, is it not a little silly to lead with the economic argument that Krugman “doesn’t have a clue about economics”? One the one hand, we have a Nobel laureate, on the other, we have guy who doesn’t seem to have job.

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More importantly, it is not as though Krugman is any sort of outlier. Although he is certainly more forceful than many of his economic brethren his views are more or less fully shared by all the other Nobel laureates who hold forth on the current economic situation, including Robert Solow, Tom Schelling and Joseph Stiglitz. There is more or less a consensus on the idea that the most ineffective way of stimulating the economy at this time is to give the wealthiest Americans a tax break, not because wealthy Americans are bad in any way, but simply because they will not spend it as quickly, if at all, relative to the less well off. Put another way, unemployment is still up because demand is down and demand is down because 98% of all Americans are either barely staying afloat or gradually going under. Helping the other 2%, however desirable that might be in other times, simply is not a priority right now.

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Not only is this a pretty legitimate economic stance, but I am not aware of a leading, internationally respected economist who seriously argues otherwise. We are seeing relatively conservative, yet objective economists (like Ben Bernanke) look ar the data and being pursuaded that action is required, only to be attacked by those for whom the evidence is immaterial to their self-serving preconceptions.

I suported Hillary and yet I do not think the actual outcome would have been that much different. Although I, too, wish, Obama would call the Republicans’ bluff and throw a harsh light on the extent to which they are willing to throw everyone ese over the side on behalf of heir more well heeled constituents, the fundamental problem Obama has is more the fecklessness of certain blue state Senators than his own willingness to confront. The Democrats in the Senate simply cannot assemble the needed supermajorities and the days when a President could strong arm people has long passed. The answer is simply to beat the Republicans whenever adn wherever we have the chance, not wring our hands about the President.

I was a Hillary supporter until the end. However, I’m not sure how different things would have been with her. She is certainly a DLC, Third Wayer. One difference I think would have been is that Hillary is not so convinced that negotation by giving up what you want first is the best way.
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But, we’ve got to dance with the one that brung us for a while longer.
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pelhamite is right we need to elect better Democrat Senators, but we didn’t do a very good job this time.

Sacred, Decon, all of you guys, I can’t believe you people!
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First, I get turned down to be a part of the Zionist conspiracy because I am not Jewish.
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Second, I get turned down to be a part of the Papist conspiracy because I am no longer a practicing Catholic.
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Now I find out that while I was offline honoring a bet and you were bringing members into the Illuminati I wasn’t invited!
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I was only offline for a month! You could have, at least, sent secret coded messages in junk email or put it in the New York Times crossword puzzle backwards and in Latin so I could have found out how to join.
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Damn!
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Do I have to join the Masons to be a part of the conspiracy these days?

“In Vino Veritas!”
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In wine there is truth?
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So, you’re drunk before noon?
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That would help explain a great deal.

“At $400,000 per job.”
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You’re including tax breaks – which failed (Obama trying to be a Republican, which the Republicans do much better) – and money still not spent by the states and cities (following the Republican mantra of local government is always better than state government and state government is always better than the federal government – rather than, as they were, extra hoops to jump through with another level of government to debate, have hearings and negotiate with).
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You’ve been doing an excellent job of proving the point that Obama tried too hard to please Republicans.

“Not raising taxes is a loss of potential revenue and not a new expense.”
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Really?
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And what happened to those gains from 2007 through 2010?
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If the increase in tax payments by the wealthiest was a long term effect and not a part of the housing bubble, that money should still be pouring in.

“And what happened to those gains from 2007 through 2010?
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If the increase in tax payments by the wealthiest was a long term effect and not a part of the housing bubble, that money should still be pouring in.”
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I guess if you can’t quote something from a econ text or wikipedia it escape you.
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Just to review. The tax code taxes income not wealth. We had a recession so incomes went down. Liberals are still the masters of trend line analysis where all economics occurs in a vacuum.

“I was a Hillary supporter until the end”
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And it seems we have come to the end.
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Forget about the idea of ever seeing Hillary Rodham Clinton become president. In fact, after her current job as secretary of state, Clinton says she may never seek public office again

http://www.aolnews.com/surge-desk/article/hillary-clinton-quitting-politics-after-secretary-of-state-gig/19745463

Thank all for your understanding. At least I’m not alone. I think Hillary would have not buckled and rolled over on the tax cuts running out for the rich. I think she would have stood up for her base and fought for our image.
We are not Hitler. We are not communist. She would have not meekly stood by and let the other side slander us the way Obama has.

Obama does not care about his image and he does not care about ours. Maybe such things seem below him.. but they matter. Obama does not defend his base. He does not defend those that dug in their own pockets to support him. I feel Obama has left me high and dry while I have fought for him. I defended him on the health care issue. Even though he never really defended himself or his democratic congress or senate, or his own supporters while they were called baby killers and grandma killers.

However, the days of me defending him are over. We are about to sink in the worst deficit spending spiral of any president and I 100% don’t stand by him for it.

He is not a democrat in terms of economic policy. Not by any stretch.

As a Democrat and a Liberal, I wish Obama, Reid and Pelosi would just let the tax cuts expire. No votes to extend the cuts to the wealthiest 1% of the population, we simply can’t afford those cuts. And we can’t afford it when companies like Walmart, General Electric, Microsoft and others pay absolutely ZERO in income taxes.
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Nobody likes to pay taxes. But paying them is something we all must do because this is our country. And it is a cost of doing business–just like paying payroll, electric and gas bills.
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If tax cuts stimulate the economy and Bush’s rates had been in effect for the past 10 years, then why did the economy tank? Further, if high taxes cause harm to the economy, then why did we have serious growth in the 1950′s and ’60′s as well as during Clinton’s terms?
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Why does the CBO and every economist out there agree that tax cuts are the worst option for stimulating the economy? The only people I hear yelling that cuts are good for the economy are the millionaire Republican office holders and their mouth pieces (Beck, Hannity, Rush, and their followers).

Let’s use logic, Freakinpa.
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If taxes on the wealthy suppress investment and job creation, then the job creation from the Bush tax cuts would cause more jobs to exist now as a long term benefit.
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Since savings by the wealthy is extremely rarely used for direct investment such as starting or expanding a business, this money went into the housing bubble via mortgage backed securities and buying stock in companies like Countrywide.
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When the bubble burst, most of that money vanished.
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At low tide I could tell a fool like you that standing on your head for twelve hours will make the ocean come to you and, for twelve hours it would appear to be true. After 12 hours as the tide begins to ebb, you will discover that you have been duped.
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All incomes went up during the bubble, so, tax revenues went up, too. Once the bubble burst and those savings by the wealthy get washed away as the value of their investments and home disappear, so do the revenues.

Let’s use logic, Freakinpa.
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You lost him there, patrick. Have to keep it simple for him.

Greenwald looks at the ambiquous moral standards of the Wikileak critics.
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http://www.salon.com/news/wikileaks/index.html?story=/opinion/greenwald/2010/12/01/wikileaks

ambiquous?
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ambiquous, ambiguous + ubiquitous?
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Spelling -5 points.
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95% A minus.
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Patrick, I make plenty of grammatical and spelling errors. However, I meant ambiguous: meaning open to more than one interpretation.

lila: Somehow I knew you were a Puma.