Re: 2012 and the TARP Bailout

One would think with the relentless attacks the lame stream media has for anyone who counts themselves as part of the conservative movement, that conservatives would be dropping in the polls recently.
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However, that hasn’t been the case.
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Does it ever get frustrating for you Adam?

Already documented today that if it weren’t for TARP our economy would’ve crashed AND burned instead of the former.
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Chrysler sales up 60% in September, GM down 6% – either wouldn’t exist if it weren’t for the bailout.
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But it’s best to talk against it because it’ll get you elected. Meh.

Interesting that McCain was duped. If he had fiscal conservative values, maybe he wouldn’t have been so easily duped. It’s what you get from a moderate. He doesn’t know what he believes.

If you recall, he was even with Obama until the meltdown, and he ran back to Washington to “fix” the problem. Not that I want McCain. I think in many ways he would have been even worse than BO.

Paulsen is a snake. Former Goldman Sachs CEO makes sure that GS comes out smelling like a rose.

Washinton continues to FUBAR the economy.

But, let’s have more and bigger government. Yeah, that’ll work.

Of course they would exist. They would have gone through bankruptcy like any other company that had unsustainable unfunded liabilities.

What wouldn’t exist is the UAW, and Obama couldn’t allow that. The unfunded pensions and high benefit costs are still there. So, it is only a matter of time before they go under.

The UAW took pension and benefits packages in lieu of pay increases and now it’s their fault?
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Last I checked, there are two (2) signatures at the bottom of contracts….

It’s so easy to demagogue a terrible event that never occurred (9/11 notwithstanding).

McCain’s NO moderate…
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He’s whatever he needs to be to help the McCain Party™. A “self-pragmatist” if you will…

Time for a philosophical rally on the national mall. Time to take back our philosophy. Never mind economic realities. It will be totally philosophical (with some prayer included), not political.

He’s the original Kitten Killer too!

Gee, formerly….ask and your wish comes true. Sunday, 10.2.10, ALL the libtards in the country are descending on Washington for a rally on the Mall near the Lincoln Memorial.
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Let’s just call it a Glenn Beck-like rally for Libtards.
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Are you going?

I will be there in spirit, rusty. I avoid actual attendance where large crowds gather.

Thune said he became a critic of TARP because of “how it was used.” He didn’t say he was against it, period. He still has wiggle room to play it both ways, depending on how the political winds are blowing and who his audience is, at any one time.

Thune has shown himself to be a typical politician. Going which ever way the wind blows. Our politicians continue to try and weasel out of any thing they vote for.

TARP was not pleasant, but to stop the financial meltdown, what would anyone else had done. Oh, let all those banks fail and take the rest of us down with them?

Unfortunately, the relaxation of banking regulations over the past 30 years contributed to the financial crisis. I know Conservatives like to point to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, but they were about 20% of the problem, what about the other 80%.

Oh, the banks say the Government made me do it. Do what? The risky loans were made to make a profit, not because the government forced you to make bad loans. A number of thes programs have been in place since the late 1970s and it would take this long for the bubble to crash, if Government requirements to loan to risky customers were the blame.

It is time to restore commonsense reguations to the banking industry. A number of these regulations were orginally passed in the 1930s and I don’t remember them hampering economic growth in the 1950s & 1960s. A little restoration of commonsense would do this country a lot of good.

“Of course they would exist. They would have gone through bankruptcy like any other company that had unsustainable unfunded liabilities.”
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Does not having the faintest idea of what you’re talking about ever prevent you from proving it?

In a submission to Congress, General Motors said that without government support “the company will default in the near term, very likely precipitating a total collapse of the domestic industry and its extensive supply chain, with a ripple effect that will have severe, long-term consequences to the U.S. economy.”
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While it’s not uncommon for a company to file for bankruptcy, reorganize its businesses and then return to financial stability, the companies and some analysts have argued that such a scenario wouldn’t prove true for the automakers. The companies, said Rebecca Lindland, an analyst with IHS Global Insight in Lexington, Mass., would likely have to file for Chapter 7 bankruptcy protection, which requires a company’s liquidation rather than restructuring.
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“Part of the reason that we don’t see that recovery is really viable is that people have consistently said they would not buy a car from a bankrupt company,” Lindland said.
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In its submission to Congress, GM said that market research showed more than 30 percent of consumers who had considered buying GM cars but ultimately decided to buy another brand cited the possibility of GM bankruptcy as their top reason.
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Experts say that some consumers would worry that a bankrupt automaker wouldn’t be able to honor its warranties or that parts needed for repairs wouldn’t be available.

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/Economy/story?id=6443946&page=2

No, Rusty, Republicants seem to be unable to remember so far back in time to the last year of Bush’s folly and that TARP was a Bush innovation which lacked any rules for what banks must do with the money. Our friends, the Brits, were so much smarter in that they required that it go out in loans and not become invested funds to build up the bank’s balance sheet.

There seems to be a lot amnesia about 2007 and 2008 on your part.

“Let’s just call it a Glenn Beck-like rally for Libtards.”
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So there will be people who work for a living, people of color and…no scooters?
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http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/17390/210904

2.4, Oh, I see. You believe GM. That means you know what you’re talking about.

They are still too big to fail…um, I mean succeed.

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2010/04/gm-more-troubles-coming-down-the-road/38603/

Make no mistake, these companies are still on life support. The CBO expects that the lion’s share of the government’s losses on TARP will come, not from anything the Bush administration did, but from the Obama administration’s decision to bail out the automakers and to a lesser extent, its bailout of homeowners. It seems that a big chunk of our cost may come from picking up the gold plated pensions . . . “Cadillac Plans”, if you will . . . of the automakers. And lest you think I’m picking on unions over management, it was management that used the UAW as a prop to extract these gargantuan sums from the pockets of innocent taxpayers.

The Republican defense:

I was for it before I was against it before I was for it before I was against it before I was for it…….

“the company will default in the near term, very likely precipitating a total collapse of the domestic industry and its extensive supply chain, with a ripple effect that will have severe, long-term consequences to the U.S.’s BIG UNIONS”</blockquote.
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There fixed it for ya, now it makes perfect sense.

“So there will be people who work for a living, people of color and…no scooters?”

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No, just a bunch of tired old hippies from the 1960′s, who are trying to keep up with the younger stoners of the current generation to see who can out do who in toking on some dope.

He’s the original Kitten Killer too!

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As opposed to you, the original a$$wipe in the swamp?

Mr.Thune,

Voting for TARP doesn’t mean you had to like it. It means performing the unpleasant task of saving people who didn’t deserve saving (reckless investment bankers) in order to save the people who did (like me). The alternative to TARP was financial collapse on a global scale. I sympathize with your discomfort in having to do it, but I’d be more sympathetic if you explained to your constituents why you felt you had no choice.

What I don’t have sympathy for is people like you complaining about TARP (justifiably) and then standing in the way of needed regulatory reform that prevents the same situation from repeating itself. I know you feel pressure from Tea Partiers who can’t see the burning forest for the burning trees, but come on.

nice article

Woodworking Plans

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/.a/6a00d83451c45669e20133f4c12391970b-popup
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2009 Tax Receipt for income of $34,140.
Interesting break down of how tax distribution.

And some of the comments in this thread is proof that it doesn’t matter how well things turn out with TARP in the end. Since it didn’t conform to the conservative/tea bagger philosophy, it’s bad. It would have been preferable for our banking system to collapse, taking untold numbers of homeowners and businesses with it, not to mention what it would have done to the rest of the world’s banking system. It would have been preferable that the US auto industry to implode taking god knows how many jobs and ruining god know how many families with it because the free market is always right. The fringe conservatives that McCain/Palin fertilized in the waning days of their campaign are married to their science fiction viewpoint to the point of self mutilation rather than admit that in some instances the general welfare of our country trumps free market economics even though the US is about as purely free market capitalist as China is pure communist (i.e. not very).
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As an aside, I’m I the only one that finds it ironic that the only kind of Darwinism tea baggers believe in is economic?

Some of the Republican senators who opposed helping GM have large Asian auto assembly plants in their states. Of course the other auto makers didn’t want GM to fail because it would have taken much of the supply chain down with it and that means their suppliers as well. Didn’t stop people like McConnell from talking out of both sides of his mouth.

TARP was probably the smartest decision Bush made. The private sector screwed it up, by handing out bonuses like nothing had happened. Unfortunately, TARP was only enough to stop the bleeding from the previous Republican economy. They haven’t figured out how to create new growth yet, and it will take something like 5 years, and 300,000 new jobs per month, just to regain the jobs already lost. Meanwhile, the latest thinking is to implement a program of massive, tea-party austerity, the policy you are supposed to implement, when the economy is booming, and it is the right time to balance the books.

Ivy, I particularly enjoyed watching Richard Shelby’s outrage at assistance to assisting GM, he of Toyota largesse.

Gosh, Ivy. I do proof read but still let errors get through on my comments. At my age, I always pause a moment and think, “is it dementia”. Oh well, I guess I’ll keep commenting until my mind is completely gone.
Awkward: assistance to assisting

“I do proof read but still let errors get through on my comments. At my age, I always pause a moment and think, “is it dementia”. Oh well, I guess I’ll keep commenting until my mind is completely gone.
Awkward: assistance to assisting”
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LOL but, I don’t not remember why.

http://crooksandliars.com/nicole-belle/heres-your-enthusiasm-gap-one-nation-
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More people at One Nation rally than Beck’s ego forum.
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O/T

More proof that liberalism is a mental disorder. The attendance at der Fuehrer’s rally was microscopic compared to Beck’s. Media is even using some Beck rally photos to misrepresent.

Rally paid for by your tax dollars and union dues.

They also are great proponents of Social Darwinism, though they’d deny that title.
They’d probably call it Lafferism.

“Media is even using some Beck rally photos to misrepresent.”

What media? What photos? What text to misrepresent?
Proof, please.

“Rally paid for by your tax dollars and union dues.”
- and participants

Beck’s rally was paid for by our tax dollars and Fox News & the Koch brothers and various “Tea Party” businesses.
- and participants

Here ya go herby. I think even dimwit liberals can see the difference.
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http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2600633/posts?page=54
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I used to belong to a union. In fact, it is one of the most powerful in the US. They liked my money. I liked the new cars they drove around that I paid for. I drove a 12 year old vehicle. Hey, they love to tell you how to vote and give you a beer: Here you go dumbass, here’s a bud, now go vote for democrats.
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They basically did nothing for me. I paid them thousands of dollars in union dues. When I needed them, I got screwed. That’s how I feel about unions. I could go on and on, but what’s the point? I’m not Patrick.
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I’ve been there done that.

One more thing, I live in California. The state and federal government spend, spend, spend here, and have spent billions and billions here, for social programs and all those liberal and progressive issues that you all love so much.
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Our area has the highest rate of unemployment in the country over 14%. Real rate is around 20%
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You aren’t working for us.
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Get the message? F off.

Didn’t Thune run on the promise that he, not Daschle, could save Ellsworth AFB from being closed? You know, after the non-partisan BRAC commission decided it needed to go. So I guess Thune is saying pork is bad, unless it’s my pork.

And what’s Thune’s electability angle? As boring as Romney, but with no real-world work experience? He doesn’t exactly fit the leading model of middle-aged brunette in a miniskirt.

I asked:

“Media is even using some Beck rally photos to misrepresent.”
What media? What photos? What text to misrepresent?
Proof, please.

What you offer is not proof of anything that I asked. It is what you say is true. I have no way to tell if your pictures are proof of what the site says, and you still have not answered.
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I also belonged to a national union. When my previous employer decided to rid itself of a bunch of low-level clerks who belonged to a union, they laid us off. The work we did was assumed by salaried workers, in addition to their regular tasks. The union fought it, but your Republican Labor Dept. took no action.
Anyway, I now collect a small pension from the union; without it, I would be in serious financial difficulty.
Please note that the salaried employees mentioned above mostly hate their jobs because of how the company treats them, but they are mostly stuck. Your Bushrecession makes it almost impossible for them to find comparable jobs elsewhere.
Note also that their employer has discontinued its matching contributions to their 401K retirement program, while giving huge raises to its CEO, President, VP etc.

I live in California. The unemployment rate is 12.4%, and it is not the highest in the nation. That bastion of small-government libertarianism, Nevada, has that honor.

Either check your sources or stop lying.

By the way, The state and federal governments have given billions and billions of dollars of tax breaks to big busineses here, with little in the way of promised jobs due to the “trickle down” theory of Repub governance.

I’m not going to swear at you. I will just redirect your final comment:

“Get the message? F off.”

liberal – I repeat my request for an answer:

17.1 I asked:

“Media is even using some Beck rally photos to misrepresent.”
What media? What photos? What text to misrepresent?
Proof, please.

What you offer is not proof of anything that I asked. It is what you say is true. I have no way to tell if your pictures are proof of what the site says, and you still have not answered.

– Waiting…