In the Arena

Dems Depressed and Disheartened

The lead item on Politico–titled “Dems Urge Obama to Take a Stand”–is almost surrealistic. Take a stand? The guy passed health care, a stimulus bill that helped avoid a Depression, a groundbreaking financial reform bill that is too complicated to be popularly described, a bailout that enabled General Motors and Chrysler to survive. He nominated two estimable women to the Supreme Court. He restored America’s image in the world. I can go on…

But Dems are distressed? He’s not populist or ideological enough? Oh please. There are several ways to go about the presidency. Ronald Reagan chose one way: he said one thing and did another. He was for cutting back the size of government, but didn’t. He was for lowering taxes and he did, but then he raised taxes–two of the laegest percentage increases in American history–when his supply-side “philosophy” proved a phony. He confronted the Soviet Union, but he also would have agreed to massive reductions in nuclear arsenals if the Soviets had allowed him to pursue his Star Wars fantasy.

Barack Obama has chosen another way.

He has pretty much done what he said he’d do. His achievements are historic. But he hasn’t wrapped them up in an ideological bumper sticker–or provided some neat way for the public to understand it, or pretended to be a yeoman simpleton, noshing on pork rinds, clearing brush and excoriating the business community. That is a real political problem. He delivered a stealth tax cut to 95% of the American people; I’ve never seen a politician cut taxes and not take sufficient credit for it before. He made it impossible for Americans to be denied health care coverage because of pre-existing conditions or chronic problems; somehow this has gotten lost in the “socialist” shuffle as well.  He ended major combat operations in Iraq, on time and without much fuss–without using the word “victory” or denying the continuing problems involved in cobbling together a coherent government there. Another President might have hyped this “achievement” relentlessly.

I find this diffidence sort of admirable and extremely incompetent. But even if Obama, and his communications shop, had been more focused on touting his achievements, and even if he delivered his major speeches on financial reform brandishing a pitchfork and a torch, I suspect the Democrats would be in pretty much the same dismal electoral shape as they are now. The country’s economic problems–the depth and devastation of this recession; the possibility that we’re in a different sort of trough than we’ve ever been in before; the confusion and anxiety wrought in certain sections of the country by changing social mores and an influx of non-white immigrants–trump and undermine abstract reports of successful government activism. So long as the Great Recession continues, it’s easy–indeed, it’s natural–to question any bailout, any stimulus project, that might protect and create jobs for some, but leaves the vast majority of Americans unaffected. So long as white middle-class Christian Americans live in the fear that their children won’t live as well as they have, it’s easy to blame Latinos, Muslims, gays, mixed-race couples (who produce ethnically confusing amalgams like Barack Hussein Obama) and elitists for attempting to steal the “real” America. It’s easy to credit the paranoid prejudices of Glenn Beck.

The idea that these tumultuous anxieties would somehow be addressed if the President behaved more like Reagan is foolish. The idea, promoted by the Democratic Party’s myopic left, that being more “progressive” might clarify things and restore the party’s status is a fantasy. The fact is, Obama has done a great many of the things liberals have always wanted–starting with health care reform–and the country is still, for the moment, a mess. That’s a problem. Democrats would be in trouble this year even if health care had passed with a “public option,” even if the stimulus package had been larger, even if “cap and trade” had passed, even if Obama hadn’t decided to double down in Afghanistan or continue many of Bush’s national security protective measures. In fact, I suspect they’d be in worse trouble. This is a profoundly moderate country. It has a distinct libertarian streak; it distrusts “big”–government or business–even as it prospers from the carefully applied benefits of both. If there is any national ideology, it is informality, which is neither left nor right. (And it occurs to me that Obama, preternaturally cool and private, is deficient in the informality zone–another much-discussed problem.)

Sure, it would be nice if the White House were Reagan-savvy (that is, Michael Deaver-savvy) about public relations. But Democrats should not delude themselves by thinking that ideological purity, or a phony populism foreign to the President’s character, is the answer. At a moment as complicated and unnerving as this, there are no easy answers.  At a moment as complicated and unnerving as this, it isn’t hard to imagine a failed presidency–although, of course, it would be foolishly premature to do so. But it is not possible, at this point, to imagine a dishonorable Obama presidency; he has faced the national crisis in a manner that may be politically flawed, but he has not run from, or fudged or demagogued, the problems. He has done pretty much what he said he was going to do when he ran for office. That is something Democrats should be able to live with, proudly.

Related Topics: Barack Obama, Democratic Party, Economy
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  • nflfoghorn

    “He ended major combat operations in Iraq, on time and without much fuss–without using the word “victory” or denying the continuing problems involved in cobbling together a coherent government there. Another President might have hyped this ‘achievement’ relentlessly”
    .
    But his enemies like to MSU to fill the vacuum (see my post in the middle of the last thread).

  • allthingsinaname

    He is not black enough, or white enough. He is not gay enough, or straight enough, He is not liberal enough, or Conservative enough. He has no spine, or he won’t do what I say. He acts like a Democrat, or he acts like a Republican.
    .
    It is Personal politics.

  • http://forgottenlord.livejournal.com forgottenlord

    I think Democrats saw Barrack Obama as the answer to the Reagan era. They saw the Great Recession as a chance to redefine America and bring it back to Liberal views – a chance to clearly demonstrate that Reaganism small government (not to be confused with reasonably small government) is bad, that a social blanket is a good thing and with it we had a hope that the Liberal fantasies of a truly better society would come about. And to boot, we had someone with both the intelligence and charisma to sell it to people, control of both houses and a super majority to boot
    .
    What’d we get? A unified Republican opposition, the tea party, Fox News more than doubling it’s competitors combined, Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck – all of these things that stand as the antithesis to what we hoped for and to our combined horror, they were ALLOWED to get away with their garbage by both the media and the Democrats. The end result, the only things able to get through without an insane amount of fight were TARP and the auto bailouts (read: bailouts for corporations). Stimulus was a struggle. Health care was a blood bath that resulted in nothing short of an attrocity compared to what Liberals hoped for. Economic bill a year later. Climate bill axed. Immigration axed. DADT delayed (though I expected that one). The list goes on and on.
    .
    No wonder Dems are feeling miserable right now.

  • http://forgottenlord.livejournal.com forgottenlord

    Please note: I’m not saying that his actual achievements are anything to sneer at. I’m just saying, Democrat expectations were pretty damn high.

  • deconstructiva

    “The lead item on Politico…” …nuff said.
    Long version: Joe, ignore that rant (and that site). It should be rewritten as “Which Dems Urge Obama to Take a Stand.” Lots of opinion but not many names / quotes until deeper in the post. Yes, many on the left have been disappointed that HCR didn’t include the PO, single pay, etc. (easy proof: our comments), but the beginning of HCR – not the end – is now law. Ditto for finance reform. Save your rants for other stuff (but no more Burlington Coat Factory Community Center posts from the team, please) and quote other sources like TPM or the Onion instead. Best of all would be to quote KT.

  • groenhagen2

    I believe Joe Klein owns extra thick knee pads with a “B” on the right one and an “O” on the left. If he would stand up and look around, he might understand why the man-child’s approval rating is plummeting.

  • groenhagen2

    “He has pretty much done what he said he’d do. His achievements are historic.”* – Liberace

    http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/rulings/promise-broken/

    * I understand that Hitler pretty much did what he said he would do in “Mein Kampf.” That made his “achievemenets” historic. However, few would say they advanced the cause of freedom.

  • newfreedomblog

    “I can go on…”

    .
    You could move out of the country, that is a novel idea Joe.
    .
    You could realize that yes, Obama did pass ObamaCare, but what did it get us?
    .
    I think the debate is still ensuing whether it was Obama or Bush who bailed out the 2 failing car companies, but for sake of argument, let’s just say both are equally reponsible for bailing them out and the only thing which has come of it is saving a few Union jobs.
    .

    “ground breaking financial reform”

    .
    Now that was a good one too. I happened to be reading my Discover Bill / Statement. It is so convuluted, and mixed up now I need an accounting degree in order to figure out exactly what they have in it so far as terms are concerned.
    .
    People will soon quickly find out the “financial reform” is yet another Government boondoggle, which they will end up paying more for credit. Not less……..MORE.
    .

    “Restored Americas image??”

    .
    Are you seriously going to go down that road? What exactly do we have with our new image Joe Klein?
    .
    1. Iran started up their very first nuclear reactor with the help of the Russians over the weekend. So far Israel has not blow them off the world map….but we hold our breath as to exactly when that will happen.
    .
    2. Afghanistan is now worse than ever, more people are dying, we have more troops than ever in the God-forsaken-place. Now that is truly acheivements on unprecedented levels no doubt.
    .
    3. Israel and Palestine continue to fight over desert lands no one else would ever want, but perhaps you know some pending summit of the Middle East we are not privy to, perhaps this might happen. I seriously doubt it.
    .
    4. North Korea has blow up how many South Korean boats now? China has continued to flame the fires in that region. China also owns more of American than any other country has in the past 234 years.
    .
    I could keep going, but why bother.

  • deconstructiva

    Also Joe, please do “The Call” with Adam soon. You haven’t done one yet. Pick any topic except the BCFCC, Tweety-style he said / she said shouting matches, literally debates, or Politico faux D outrage. Also, on your next Afghanistan trip take Jay N-S with you. She wants to go; she strongly hinted at it here. If her bosses resist then use your seniority to change this. (If you’d also remove more of other blatant / malicious personal attacks in these comments too that would help. Thanks, Joe.)

  • newfreedomblog

    Comment perfection!! Good job!!

  • Jim, Foolish Literalist

    hey saw the Great Recession as a chance to redefine America and bring it back to Liberal views -

    I would argue that no one saw how Great the Recession would be, and that has made it impossible to do a lot of the things Obama (and Democrats, and I) thinks should be done, and for some reason what Gibbs (half-accurately if very stupidly) calls “the Professional Left” can’t wrap their brains around that. The bad economy also give the Professional Stupid like Palin and Beck a hook to hang their demagoguery on, and the Establishment Media lets them get away with. CNN in particular has accelerated the pace of its own dumbing down. Their only real competition in this regard is Fred Hiatt’s Washington Post op/ed page. And maybe the lukewarm sack of carp that is Politico.

  • earljr1

    The democrats have every reason to be disheartened and depressed. The performance of Mr. Obama has be abysmal and his continued deceit will get many of them thrown out of office in November. Yes, indeed, “change you can believe in” still resonates with the American people, only this time, it is repeated with sarcasm and derision. Who can forget “my administration will be completely transparent” or “I will listen to and be guided by the will of the American people”? No, Mr. Obama, we have NOT forgotten and will take these broken promises to the ballot box, come November. Meanwhile, why don’t you take off on yet another vacation, while the nation suffers 10% unemployment and the economy founders. You will NOT be missed.

  • kevin

    Plummeting? His Gallup approval rating in August 2009 was 48%, and now it’s 44%. A giant drop of four whole percentage points over a year. Whoopdeedoo.
    .
    Lighten up, drama queen.

  • Paul-no not that one

    What is “MSU”?

  • centfan

    “It has a distinct libertarian streak; it distrusts “big”–government or business–even as it prospers from the carefully applied benefits of both. If there is any national ideology, it is informality, which is neither left nor right.”
    -
    Distrusts big business??? We pray to it. Wal-mart to Exxon to Microsoft. Joe Six Pack will continue to boost the politicians that believe in corporate welfare even as his job is packed off to China. The American middleclass asks business to shoot them in the foot and hands them the gun to do it.
    -
    Informality? The requirement of being Christian and wearing a flag pin? Sounds formal to me. Sounds like a tea ceremony that the corporate news media loves to review.

  • kevin

    Yes, indeed, “change you can believe in” still resonates with the American people, only this time, it is repeated with sarcasm and derision.
    .
    Only by right wingers like you who never voted for him. I actually voted for Obama, and yes, I got the change I wanted. Health care reform, financial reform, regulatory reform, foreign policy changes, the drawdown in Iraq, etc. etc.
    .
    Every time you or Rusty or Caribou Barbie mocks the “hope and change” slogan, all it does is remind people like me — people who did vote for Obama and will do so again — that he actually delivered on that promise and secured an historic amount of change, the most since Reagan.
    .
    Sneer all you want. It just energizes people like me.

  • kevin

    Took me a second, but I believe it’s “mess sh!t up.”

  • deconstructiva

    I thought MSU would be lovely Amy Sullivan’s enemy …as in Michigan State, since she went to U. of Michigan before the Harvard Divinity School (this is in her TIME bio).

  • Paul-no not that one

    Thanks Kevin but “to fill the vacuum” follows MSU.
    .
    Make Stuff* Up?
    .
    *or another word.

  • groenhagen2

    Wrong, moonbat. The man-child’s approval rating with Gallup never dropped below 50% in August 2009. It was 55% at the beginning of that month:
    http://www.gallup.com/poll/113980/Gallup-Daily-Obama-Job-Approval.aspx

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “I understand that Hitler pretty much did what he said he would do in “Mein Kampf.”"
    .
    When did Obama promise to eliminate our country of non-Christian non-whites?
    .
    From Republican Theodor Roosevelt, through FDR, Truman, JFK, Republican Richard Nixon and Bill Clinton all promised Health Care Reform, so, unless you consider seven of our last seventeen presidents as bad as Hitler, STFU.

  • groenhagen2

    fatpat:

    You’re an extremely stupid individual.

  • northpoleresident

    Nearly 65% of votes for Obama was from the 35 and under age group. Most of the younger generation are disengaged from the everyday discussion. When it comes time to vote we will again support Obama because the younger generation identifies with him. Many don’t vote local or even really care so what happens in the interim really doesn’t matter.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    Earl is easily confused.
    .
    He wanted tort reform, which McCain promised but did not want health care reform which Obama promised. So he is angry that Obama kept his own promise but did not keep McCain’s promise.
    .
    I bet Earl walks into McDonald’s angry that they don’t take Burger King coupons.
    .
    I bet gets angry with defense lawyers who help the defendant instead of helping prosecution.
    .
    I bet he gets angry at his podiatrist when he gets a tooth ache.

  • sevenoaks07

    Joe, give Politico a rest. They are Drudge-driving an issue a day: not worth serious attention except for those in Gastown who need their daily fix.

    Why not focus on Saudi ownership of a block of shares in Fox Newscorp or Saudi and Gulf dollars in Citigroup? It will be useful to know how US companies who work against Obama are chock full of Muslim / Arab dollars.

  • grape_crush

    But Democrats should not delude themselves by thinking that ideological purity, or a phony populism foreign to the President’s character, is the answer.

    Hey, it worked during the Bush years.

    This is a profoundly moderate country.

    Really? How exactly do you come to that conclusion?

  • northpoleresident

    Many of us forget, especially democrats, that President Obama is Jackie Robinson walking a very fine line. He must turn the other cheek. He can not play into the stereotypes of the crazed old bigots taunting him from the stands and hurling disgusting insults. When he gets a hit he keeps his head down and circles the bases with class just as Jackie did despite the racist rhetoric surrounding him on a constant daily basis.

  • nflfoghorn

    Dang it Grape, it’s ’cause FLOX SAID SO! Don’t you get it?

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    It was Obama’s half-assed, centrist approach to stimulus, which the myopic professional Left warned him about, that now has him in trouble with the electorate. However, that doesn’t stop the idiotic middle from blaming the Left for the problem, like they always do. Hopefully, their losses will be massive.

  • Paul-no not that one

    Interesting comparison but we should note that was Jackie’s response his first year.

    .
    After that he did fight back.

  • grape_crush

    Dang it Grape!
    .
    Nah. FNC sez that Real Americans@trade; are conservatives, never mind that said Real Americans@trade; take farm subsidies, Social Security, eat food made (safer) by Big Gubbamint, etc.
    .
    Joe’s just seeing it from his own ‘moderate’ perspective, in that most of the folks he considers reasonable are his fellow moderates. We all do that, to some extent.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “It has a distinct libertarian streak; it distrusts “big”–government or business–even as it prospers from the carefully applied benefits of both.”
    .
    That has to be one of the strangest statements I have ever seen written by Time.
    .
    Unless you mean “big military” or “big law enforcement” which conservatives do not call government (they believe the magic elves pay for law enforcement and the military industrial complex) which at this time are both very popular with both parties, this is a strange contradiction.
    .
    Regulatory agencies are there to limit and control the expansion of influence and abuse of power by big business. Libertarians hate government so much that they would gladly be beaten down by unregulated business practices and liberals dislike being beaten down by big business enough that we prefer regulation.
    .
    It would be better written as “It has a distinct contradiction; it distrusts “big”- -business or government –even as it prospers from the carefully applied benefits of both.”
    .
    As for HCR and the public option, finding out that we won a victory without the public option is like getting a letter from your favorite employer telling you that your perfect, high paying job with great hours will take you, but, only as an unpaid internship and only if you want to put in six twelve hour days. At best this HCR neutered by loosing the public option is a means to gain more of a push (hopefully less than fifteen years in the future – as this was fifteen years after Clinton tried HCR) to get a public option put in and, as the public option will defeat the for-profit health care system morph into a single payer system before I become a great grandfather.
    .
    As for the stimulus package, it was far too weak. This is what should be keeping Obama and other Democrats awake at night. This and only this is disheartening to me.
    .
    However, I think it is clear that Obama does seem unaccustomed to bragging about his success unlike, say, getting our country into an eight year or longer quagmire in Iraq and put on a jump suit and pose in front of the words “Mission Accomplished” bragging about thing he had not done well – like a particular man who was AWOL from the Alabama State Air National Guard.

  • allthingsinaname

    “Really? How exactly do you come to that conclusion?”
    .
    “Joe’s just seeing it from his own ‘moderate’ perspective, in that most of the folks he considers reasonable are his fellow moderates. We all do that, to some extent.”
    .
    And your view? How do you see it, and how did you come to your conclusion? Are we a profoundly Liberal Country? Profoundly Conservative country?
    .
    I find it amazing that as we become more and more polarized, that you can find that the moderates are the cause of the problem.

  • edismeiamhe

    Blah, Blah, Blah “Obama’s the Greatist” and so on.

    Typical lefty libby rhetoric…making an apple out of a lemon is their specialty.

    Actually, like the ACLU, the Big “0″ has done all the wrong things for all the right reasons.

    And so…his brilliant accomplishments have:

    – turned us from a Creditor Nation into a Debtor Nation

    – we are Trillions of Dollars in debt and heading higher,

    – we are being led around by our noses by a bunch of un-elected socialist fanatics

    – the unemployment rate is not near the low number the Big “0″ said we would reach, but is flying at 10 percent.

    – the maniac leading Iran, that Obama was sure he, a bonified silver tondued devil, could jawbone into line has strarted his first Atomic fuel factory.

    - now he plans on shoving our businesses, that should be creating jobs, down the sewey hole by eliminating the Bush (our patron saint) tax cuts.

    Please pray he stops doing so many great things…they are killing us.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “You’re an extremely stupid individual.”
    .
    You just called seven of our past seventeen presidents like Hitler and I am stupid?
    .
    Go write another self published book nobody is going to buy and STFU.

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    “- turned us from a Creditor Nation into a Debtor Nation”
    .
    It was actually Ronald Reagan who did that.

  • nflfoghorn

    ‘MSU’ is indeed accurately described by Kevin and PNNTO.
    .
    (decon – it doesn’t stand for Mississippi State University either ;) )

  • m0mentom0ri

    “Joe Klein owns extra thick knee pads with a “B” on the right one and an “O” on the left.”
    .
    Gay jokes? How old are you, groen? Does your mom know you’re using the computer?
    .
    And Rusty, what is so perfect about a homophobic taunt masquerading as a comment? Is that the level of dialogue you want to encourage? Or do conservatives prefer their political dialogue to be at a trashy locker room level appropriate for prepubescent boys? Is that all you got? Playground slurs? Grow up.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “If he would stand up and look around, he might understand why the man-child’s approval rating is plummeting.”
    .
    Even though Kevin may have made a mistake, Obama’s approval ratings have not changed beyond a standard deviation since February so, the word “plummeting” is still totally inaccurate unless this comment was made in February and accidentally showed up now.
    .
    What’s with the “man-child” thing?
    .
    Is that what they nicknamed you in Marines thirty years ago?

  • nflfoghorn

    How does one become ‘gay’ enough or ‘straight’ enough – move a mile away from Ground Zero instead of four blocks?

  • m0mentom0ri

    “Bush (our patron saint)”
    .
    Uhmmmm, what? Please elaborate…

  • afraidofheights

    Well, when he does take a stand it does not work out too well for the Dems either (see: mosque controversy).

    So what is the man to do?

    Here he speaks out about the bald eagle, congress, arugula and cricket. Maybe Dems will like these positions better…but probably not.

    FUNNY stuff. Enjoy!

    http://www.dailygoat.com/?p=2653

  • ficheye

    JOE KLEIN: Wait a minute… he passed health care? He was supposed to support a public option, a plan that would make health care affordable. Then he backed off and passed a watered down version. No regulation of HMO overcharges or anything. All he really did was pass a health care bill that gives the bloated industry several million new customers. People could already get health care if they could afford it. Now, we have to pay even if we can’t afford it. I voted for Obama, but he didn’t do anything historic except to take up a year of our time with debates; then he did nothing for the average person outside of stealing our money. Tell me I’m wrong, Joe, and why.

  • rdw56

    Joe is having a nervous breakdown. Barak is great and no one gets it but he and Barak. He has this great post at Time Magazine and all he can do is be part of a circular firing squad. How is it Joe writes this dribble after the MSM consensus is Barak had his worst week ever. The kool-aide drinkers announce he’s a man of vision and bravery floating above us all for his great speech on Friday Night only to have Barak make fools of you all 12 hours later.

    The worst part isn’t what Barak did to you, though that has to sting, but what you did to him. Having the load of beltway and media libs piss on the great unwashed as racists isn’t going to help him even a little bit. It’s very unlikely he keeps either house of Congress and one has to wonder how many subscribers of Time decide they don’t like being called racists by people like Joe Klein or called morons by Amy and cancel their subscriptions.

  • shepherdwong

    It was Obama’s half-assed, centrist approach to stimulus, which the myopic professional Left warned him about, that now has him in trouble with the electorate.”
    .
    The funny and ironic thing is that they obviously hate the “myopic left” exactly because they can almost always see the centrist’s mistakes, even as they are making them. Which is why they’re forced to trot out straw men like “ideological purity, or a phony populism,” to hide behind and pretend to see things the myopic left just can’t understand:

    Democrats would be in trouble this year even if health care had passed with a “public option,” even if the stimulus package had been larger, even if “cap and trade” had passed, even if Obama hadn’t decided to double down in Afghanistan or continue many of Bush’s national security protective measures.

    So, according to our visionary centrists, government action that reduced unemployment, gave people better choices when they’re forced to buy health insurance, a “conservative” plan to deal with accelerating global warming, drawing down from a disastrous and unwinnable war in a remote Muslim country and upholding the Constitution’s Bill of Rights is just to damned radical for our “profoundly moderate” and “libertarian” country.

  • allthingsinaname

    “People could already get health care if they could afford it. Now, we have to pay even if we can’t afford it.”
    .
    Except that government will help pay for it.

  • freeinpa

    “Take a stand? The guy passed health care, a stimulus bill that helped avoid a Depression, a groundbreaking financial reform bill that is too complicated to be popularly described, a bailout that enabled General Motors and Chrysler to survive. He nominated two estimable women to the Supreme Court. He restored America’s image in the world”
    =

    That flushing sound is your career following Time down the drain.

    A stimulus bill that avoided a Depression?

    Wasn’t it supposed to stop unemployment from going above 8%–FAIL
    =
    Enabled GM & Chrysler to survive? Bankruptcy proceedings would have down the same without the taxpayer being on the hook. And let’s not forget all of the dealers he put out of business.
    =
    He nominated two estimable women to the Supreme Court. ?

    Yes one who rules by feelings and had most of her previous rulings overturned and one who has never been a judge. He has turned the Supreme Court into an American Idol contest.
    =
    Changed the world’s view of America?

    Every body loves a sap. NKorea, Iran Russia etc laugh at our esteemed community organizer
    =
    HC? Yes without raising the deficit, premiums or services–NOT
    =
    Financial Overhaul? Yes without every addressing Freddie or Fannie the major cause of the meltdown.

    JK- Delusional to the end!

  • rdw56

    He did pass healthcare but didn’t know what was in it. Even his own magazine reported Pelosi and Reid crafted the bill and just as with the Finance bill no one understands what it’s going to do except raise prermiums. Reagan by contrast knew exactly what was in his various Income Tax bills and kept fighting until1986 to get what he wanted and finally got the top rates down to 28% a stunning 42% below the level he took office.

    And no doubt if Obama repeals the income tax cut on the rich and raises it a whole 3% he’ll call it a grand accomplishment. Hmmm, if a 3% increase is a grand accomplishment what is a 42% decrease? What’s 14 x’s 3?

  • nerdyengineer

    Wow, groenhagen2. One would think with that link you were interested in only providing one side of a story.

    This link from the exact same site instead evaluates how well he’s kept his Top 25 & most important promises.

    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/subjects/politifacts-top-promises/

    I know, you’re probably shattered that he hasn’t actually doubled the size of the Peace Corps. The fact that he removed combat troops from Iraq might assuage your grief.

  • nflfoghorn

    If Real Americans@trade; = “Real Americans” (TM), then I get it.

  • grape_crush

    And your view? How do you see it?
    .
    Thanks for asking.
    .
    My view is that America has a sort of multiple personality disorder, as we all tend to view things through the filter of our own perspectives. At this point in history, we are less melting pot than mosaic.
    .
    …that you can find that the moderates are the cause of the problem.
    .
    Moderates per se, aren’t the cause of the problem. Moderation when more than half-measures and compromise solutions are called for, are part of the problem.

  • allthingsinaname

    “upholding the Constitution’s Bill of Rights is just to damned radical for our “profoundly moderate” and “libertarian” country.”
    .
    Hmmm………? Are you suggesting that Obama isn’t upholding the Bill of Rights? As the thread started out with Obama’s Half Ass.
    .
    And while we are talking about Half Ass and the Bill of Rights, what of Derek’s opinion of not voting? Methinks that is Half Ass. It certainly doesn’t exercise the Bill of Rights.
    .
    One would think that Obama, by himself, should throw off all Constitutional restraints, and dictate what the US is going to do.
    .
    Nice approach to a difficult problem, I’ll give you that!

  • Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @allthings I find it amazing that as we become more and more polarized, that you can find that the moderates are the cause of the problem.

    well, as a moderate, I do blame “moderates”. Look at the stimulus. I agree that it should have been bigger than even the one Obama proposed, and more directly focused on infrastructure. But why was it shrunk even further: “moderates”. Claire McCaskill, whom I used to think had a serious shot at the big chair in ’16, tweeted (ugh) at the time that she and Ben Nelson had gotten rid of the “silly stuff”. “Silly stuff” included aid to state gov’ts and, my personal favorite, eliminating a program to spend $300 million on hybrid vehicles for gov’t use. Cause god knows paying American automakers to make autos, autos that use less oil, is truly silly stuff.
    The public option was abandoned in to small part because great moderate brains like Max Baucus, Jim Webb and the Senators from WalMart couldn’t understand how paying less for health insurance would cost less money.
    Olly Snowe, Susan Collin (and very soon Mike Castle) get elected to the Senate by promising to be “moderates”, then vote in lockstep with Jim DeMint and Tom Coburn, and moderate voters don’t seem to notice.
    David Broder, David Brooks, and other “moderate” media voices call on Obama and Democrats to reach out to “moderate” Republicans like Lindsey Graham (torture, repealing 14th Amendment), Chuck “pull the plug on Grandma!” Grassley and John McPalin, then blame Obama when the insanity of the Republican Party is so appalling that even they have to acknowledge it.
    Professional Moderates, to coin a phrase, are the circle-jerkers who allow the Tea Baggers and bigots and nutjobs (as amply represented in Congress as in these threads) to do the damage they do

  • rdw56

    What an odd adjective to use for the Supreme Court nominees. Rather meaningless but in fact Obama lost an opportunity. He may have gotten the sure voted he wanted but fell dramatically short on quality. The wise latina is at best a mediocrity while many will hope Kagan can reach non-entity. With zero real law experience she’s going against Scalia, Roberts and Alito? The twits really think she’s going to charm Anton?

    Yeah, that’s going to happen. For those who don’t know Anton’s best friend on the court is Ruth Bader Ginsberg. Yeah, charm, that’s the ticket!

    Bush wasn’t perfect but he nailed the Supreme Court. Roberts isn’t only a solid conservative but a brilliant writer, thinker and manager of the Court. Alito just as solid, smart and skilled.

  • grape_crush

    If Real Americans@trade; = “Real Americans” (TM),
    .
    Yargh – should have been ™ as in ™
    .
    Haven’t hand-coded in a while.

  • carotexas1

    Joe I thought historic achievements was news. I have not seen any reporting on this, only on the Internet.

    Maybe if Time magazine has it on the cover, this news might spread all over the country and more people would know this.

    Who cares what Joe Scarborough thinks of Obama on the cover again.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “He did pass healthcare but didn’t know what was in it. Even his own magazine reported Pelosi and Reid crafted the bill and just as with the Finance bill no one understands what it’s going to do except raise prermiums.”
    .
    First, as a reaction to what Democrats successfully complained about the PATRIOT act, Republicans month after month after month kept on saying that they didn’t have time to read the bill and/or the revision of the bill, From there, they told people like you through AM radio and Fox that they guessed that Obama, Reid and Pelosi didn’t read it. As usual, if Fox and Limbaugh tell it to you, you believe every word that they say.
    .
    “Reagan by contrast knew exactly what was in his various Income Tax bills and kept fighting until1986 to get what he wanted and finally got the top rates down to 28% a stunning 42% below the level he took office.”
    .
    From there between the stock market crash of 1987 and the election of 1992 the economy was fluctuating between recession and jobless growth. Reagan successfully showed us once and for all that cutting taxes on the wealthiest leaves big debts for Democrats like Clinton to pay off and, leaving it to Republicans, for a short-term feel good tax cut, they will dive us headfirst into another recession.

  • allthingsinaname

    grape. Thanks for the Clarification.

    Jim Foolish.
    .
    Many of the personalities you mentioned Max, Brooks, etc are not moderates in my view, but are conservative, they maybe more moderate than the the Far right, but maintain conservative opinions.
    .
    Have to go to work now I’m late. It always gets interesting just as I have to leave.

  • hippooath

    “- now he plans on shoving our businesses, that should be creating jobs, down the sewey hole by eliminating the Bush (our patron saint) tax cuts.”
    .
    Elaborate how the top 2% wealthy induviduals slightly higher tax will somehow affect a corporations tax rate?

  • shepherdwong

    Are you suggesting that Obama isn’t upholding the Bill of Rights?
    .
    I doubt you’d take my word for it so, tell you what. Make up a juicy bomb-plot email and send it to any Madrassa in Pakistan. Let us know how that works out (if we don’t hear from you, we’ll take that as a “no”).

  • tillkan

    The health care bill is nothing but a warmed over Republican/Heritage Foundation plan. Who voted for that?

  • kevin

    Can’t find the graph I got that number from, but it looks like it’s wrong.
    .
    OK, it’s been a ten point drop in a year. I stand by my point — hardly a plummeting approval rating, and certainly not as bad as the dropoffs Reagan had in the runup to 1982 and Clinton in 1994.
    .
    But keep telling yourself the sky is falling. It’ll make November all the more painful for you.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “It’s very unlikely he keeps either house of Congress and one has to wonder how many subscribers of Time decide they don’t like being called racists by people like Joe Klein or called morons by Amy and cancel their subscriptions.”

    .
    http://www.electionprojection.com/index.php
    .
    Actually, it looks very likely that, although small, Democrats will keep both houses.
    .
    “The kool-aide drinkers announce he’s a man of vision and bravery floating above us all for his great speech on Friday Night only to have Barak make fools of you all 12 hours later.”
    .
    The infamous Kool Aid drinkers were right wing cult who left liberal San Francisco to Guyana where they shot a Democratic congressman because they feared the US government would kill them.
    .
    I have big coffee next to me right now. I don’t remember if it was fifteen or twenty five years ago when I last drank Kool Aid, but, I have never been an anti-government paranoid like the Tea Partiers and drank cyanide laced drinks.
    .
    If you could read, you would then have to define nobody here as a “Kool Aid” drinker even if you call Obama follower’s such since we all have been very critical of Obama.
    .
    Being 50 times better for America than GWB is a very low bar, so, we are almost all very critical of Obama.

  • kevin

    turned us from a Creditor Nation into a Debtor Nation
    .
    How did Obama do that? Did he travel back in time to the 1980s and assume control of Ronald Reagan’s body?
    .
    we are Trillions of Dollars in debt and heading higher
    .
    And 86% of that current debt was handed over to him by Bush. Boy, you must really hate Bush if you hate Obama for piling up one seventh of the debt Bush piled up. Right?
    .
    we are being led around by our noses by a bunch of un-elected socialist fanatics
    .
    It’s clear you’re being led around by the nose by a bunch of un-elected fanatics, but I don’t think I’d characterize the people at Fox News whose stupid lies you’re so gullibly swallowing are “socialists.”

  • apr2563

    Joe, when will the reporters on this site find another source for their comments? Politico has replaced Drudge as the most questionable reference for news.
    Joe, how many times has it been wrong? How often does it use anonymous sources when it should name names?
    As long as you and yours continue to use the ultimate Villager, Politico, as your source you are no better than Fox propoganda.
    Also, Halperin is a fool.
    Joe, why not find real experts that are not part of the echo chamber, punditry to inform your posts.

  • kevin

    Is that all you got? Playground slurs?
    .
    Yep.
    .
    Name one positive issue the Republicans will pursue if they retake the House or Senate. They’ve got nothing but lies and insults.

  • nflfoghorn

    “…we are Trillions of Dollars in debt and heading higher”
    .
    Yeah we are. Will tax cuts help? No.
    .
    “…we are being led around by our noses by a bunch of un-elected socialist fanatics” –Like who? Name ‘em…put up or….
    .
    “…the unemployment rate is not near the low number the Big ‘O’ said we would reach, but is flying at 10 percent” –No one’s happy that unemployment is still high. No one’s got a magic wand either. You can’t say with a straight face that Republicans could fix things any faster.
    .
    “…the maniac leading Iran, that Obama was sure he, a bonified [sic] silver tondued [sic] devil, could jawbone into line has strarted [sic] his first Atomic fuel factory” –Said “maniac” doesn’t really run Iran; but anyway, this was happening under Blush [sic] and AhmaGilligan’s threats with a crazed-for-power VP and an ineffective SOS rang extremely hollow. It’s been 18 months, let’s see if diplomacy actually works.
    .
    “…now he plans on shoving our businesses, that should be creating jobs, down the sewey hole by eliminating the Bush (our patron saint) tax cuts” –thanks for the good laugh.
    .
    “Please pray he stops doing so many great things…they are killing us.” –Have it your way ;)

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “HC? Yes without raising the deficit, premiums or services–NOT
    =
    Financial Overhaul? Yes without every addressing Freddie or Fannie the major cause of the meltdown.”
    .
    Link after link after link have shown that there has not yet been any cuts in health care services at all nor any increase in premiums which were predicted to take place without HCR.
    .
    Link after link after link have shown explanations that Freddie and Fannie were not at all a significant part of the meltdown.
    .
    Now, try to stop quoting the same discredited wingnut sources and have a thought of your own, please.

  • Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Last week, the White House had a “background only” meeting with Treasury officials and some wonky bloggers. And Mike Allen. Apparently, Allen kept interrupting the discussion of policy to ask “how this will play” type questions. He was on Hugh Hewitt a while back talking about how he’s hoping for big GOP gains because it will make his job more interesting. Allen, and Politico in general, is a symptom of Beltway Rot that is making the disease worse.

  • kevin

    Wasn’t it supposed to stop unemployment from going above 8%–FAIL
    .
    No, it wasn’t.
    .
    For one thing, unemployment was already over 8% when the stimulus was passed in February 2009. I doubt Obama was bragging that he would prevent something that had already happened. White House economists thought they could stop it from hitting 10%, but no one in that group understood then just how bad the Bush recession was going to be,
    .
    Second, the stimulus did add a million or more jobs to the economy. No matter where you look — Moodys, IHS Global Insight, Macroeconomic Advisers, the CBO — they all agree the stimulus was responsible for 1.6 to 2.5 million new private sector jobs.
    .
    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/17/business/economy/17leonhardt.html
    .
    Even the conservative economists at AEI agreed that the stimulus boosted GDP last year by 4%.
    .
    But if you’re in the mood to hold politicians accountable for the claims they make about economic policies and the results, why not take a look at the rhetoric of George W. Bush and the Republicans when they pushed through their massive, deficit-exploding tax cuts in 2001 and 2003? They insisted they would create countless new jobs and yet … his first term was the first in the past seventy years in which there was a net loss in jobs, and his second term only ended with a combined gain of just over a million.
    .
    You want FAIL? Republican taxcut-and-deficit policies are the epitome of it.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “How did Obama do that? Did he travel back in time to the 1980s and assume control of Ronald Reagan’s body?”
    .
    Oh, come on, Kevin! You didn’t mean to tell us that you didn’t know that Democrats are shape shifters.
    .
    For example, starting in college Al Gore turned into twenty thousand different climatologists and invent climate change. Ask Michael Steel and he will explain that Obama turned into George W Bush and started the War in Afghanistan.
    .
    From there, obviously, Obama turned himself into Ronald Reagan while in college and created the deficit while Reagan had nothing to do with it.
    .
    Hell, I bet you didn’t know that Jimmy Carter turned himself into Richard Nixon and created the Watergate scandal!

  • apr2563

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/23/books/23green.htm
    .
    Something I learned yesterday. There was a “Green Book” for African American motorists maintained until the 60s. It informed black people where they could find accepting and safe accomodations. Imagine the hell Jackie Robinson went through when travelling with his team.
    Then we have the Rand Pauls on the right that think it would just be wonderful if we did away with those pesky accomodation laws for private businesses. And of course, we now know Sharon Angle thinks black is an evil color.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    What is it about the words “consensus builder” those on the very far just don’t understand?? Obama campaigned on having a history of being a consensus builder and while I think he has done far more sacrifacing than he should have looking a few republican votes, he was doing only what he had said he would do–search for bipartisan answers.
    .
    That health care passed was a major accomplishment. The fact that it will need to be overhauled almost as soon as it comes online is another matter entirely. HCR is law, there is no going back to how have been done for the past 50 years. The “professional left” should be happy with this small first step.
    .
    Financial reform was amazing. It was done relatively quickly. It is a far cry from the return to Glass-Steagal, but an important first step in returning sanity to financial and business centers.
    .
    Obama’s problems boil down to the fact that too many people have not seen Obama for what he is. The right sees him a socialist and their minds won’t be changed if Obama gave the wealty in the country the biggest tax cut in history, if he wiped out all regulation and closed all regulatory departments. On the other hand, the fringe left, saw him as a liberal and they are only starting to see how wrong many of them were. Obama is among the rare breed of politicians who is not going to say what people want to hear. He speaks the truth as he sees it. He also listens to all sides of the issues and then does, not only what he thinks best, but what he can passed through a deeply adversarial congress.
    .
    The far left needs to stop belly aching about not getting what they wanted. They need to accept the accomplishments of this president and work to see that HCR and financial reform are improved upon in the near future.
    .
    When liberals act like spoiled brats, kicking and screaming because they didn’t everything they wanted, they put some truth to the derogatory name “libtards”.

  • edismeiamhe

    Kevin,

    I must admit Mr. Bush was a bit heavy on the National Debt throttle.

    Must have been trying to finance all those entitlements that blew in, in the late 60′s with Lyndon’s “Great New Society”.

    (Who was it that said, “I am growing tired of the schemes of the rich, to finance the ills of the poor, with the money from the middle class” )

    Interesting tho…it took Ron all of 4 years to increase the National Debt by 2 Trillion…has taken your boy, the Great “0″ only 421 days.

    Lets see, the big “0″ has about a thousand days left to go, at 2 Trillion every 400 some odd days…thats…rats! my calculatior ran out of digits…

    Getting concerned yet?

    Oh, and these stats are not from Fox News, whoever that is, but your boys at CBS.

  • mycophile

    That was the overriding issue I made my choice of candidates on in the last presidential election – who would have the greatest chance of getting youth involved in figuring out how to run things. Their elders, collectively, have created a rather huge mess.
    .
    Their youngers will be left holding the bags and it takes time to learn by trial and usually error. So I figured the sooner they got started on that learning process, the better.
    .
    I hope the youth come out en masse

  • stuartzechman

    This is one of the more unintentionally hilarious comments in this thread, even surpassing the comedy of the idiot rightists.
    .
    This, in particular:

    That health care passed was a major accomplishment. The fact that it will need to be overhauled almost as soon as it comes online is another matter entirely. HCR is law, there is no going back to how have been done for the past 50 years. The “professional left” should be happy with this small first step.

    is an amazing construction.
    .
    Someone who is comfortable with that level of coherence, someone who’s so un-self aware in their dogmatic support of a “rare breed of politician,” someone who can blithely toss around pejoratives employed daily by Bill O’Reilly or Red State (“The far left“, “libtards“) for members of a supposed coalition –the word “loyalist” doesn’t even begin to describe such a person.

    He speaks the truth as he sees it. He also listens to all sides of the issues and then does, not only what he thinks best…

    What kind of a supporter believes that they know the purity of their favored Leader’s heart? What kind of a supporter claims to be in their favored Leader’s mind as He makes his wise decisions?
    .
    Can this sort of willfully blind adulation

    Financial reform was amazing. It was done relatively quickly.

    be surpassed by anything Fred Barnes has ever said on Fox News about George W. Bush?

  • m0mentom0ri

    “your boy”
    .
    Nice. Got any other dog whistles?
    .
    “Fox News, whoever that is”
    .
    Ahhh, feigned ignorance, at its finest.

  • deconstructiva

    apr, I’ve tried to warn about Politico (and no-name “sources”) before also, such as above, but replies usually feed crickets. On a different topic (tax cuts affecting deficit), this is an interesting and better approach to quoting others that maybe Joe can emulate in his own way…
    http://www.cnbc.com/id/38810267
    …which is interesting since Mark Haines (Erin Burnett’s on-air partner) is a diehard conservative and he quotes conservative economists to refute an R tax cut talking point. That takes guts.

  • kevin

    Must have been trying to finance all those entitlements that blew in, in the late 60′s with Lyndon’s “Great New Society”.
    .
    No, Reagan gutted most of those.
    .
    What caused his unprecedented deficit spending — accruing more debt than all of the presidencies before him combined — was the massive spree of defense spending under Cap Weinberger coupled with the massive tax cuts.
    .
    Interesting tho…it took Ron all of 4 years to increase the National Debt by 2 Trillion…has taken your boy, the Great “0″ only 421 days.
    .
    That was Dubya, not Reagan. If you’re going to hunt the internet to find things that support your belief system, at least learn how to read them when you find them.
    .
    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20000576-503544.html

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “Must have been trying to finance all those entitlements that blew in, in the late 60′s with Lyndon’s “Great New Society”.”
    .
    Reagan shut down most of the programs from the Great Society and the War on poverty.
    .
    It must have been FDR’s programs plus, of course, a Cold War budget for a post Cold War world costing over one trillion dollars per year which did it.
    .
    The old joke about Reagan and the War on Poverty was; “‘Mr. Reagan, what happened to the War on Poverty’. Reagan: “Well, the poor lost.”
    .
    Yeah those new fangled ideas from the 1930s and ’40′s during FDR’s term.
    .
    We should go back to Hoovervilles, no FDA to make sure our food and medicine are pure, no Federal Highways and let the banks drive our economy into the ground again.
    .
    Oh, wait!
    .
    After the repeal of the Glass-Stegal act of 1933 in 1999, the banks did drive our economy into the ground again!
    .
    Handing away everything we could get to an oil exploration company named Haliburton to take over for feeding our soldiers (which is similar to looking for oil deposits that Haliburton was a natural choice – note sarcasm) in no bid contracts, hiring Blackwater, a mercenary army might be a few places we could have saved a few bucks and, maybe- maybe (this is a wild idea) not invading extra countries to get GWB a second term by making false claims of WMD might have helped hold down the debt, too.

  • freeinpa

    “Link after link after link have shown explanations that Freddie and Fannie were not at all a significant part of the meltdown.”

    Explanations maybe reality NO. More likely CYA for liberal pols like Barney Frank for horrible policy Check out Barron’s this past weekend that has an article that discusses Ed Pinto (former Chief Credit Officer of for 5 yrs at Fannie) who lays out the how and why that the subprime meltdown was the direct result of government interference and complicity by Freddie and Fannie.

    “In 1992, Congress gave Fannie and Freddie a “mission” to promote affordable housing, and directed them to study a few very new ideas to accomplish this goal: “establish a down payment requirement for mortgagors of 5 percent or less; allow the use of cash on hand as a source of down payments; and approve borrowers who have a credit history of delinquencies if the borrower can demonstrate a satisfactory credit history for at least the [most recent] 12-month period.”

    =
    A CBO report sent Tuesday to Rep. Jerry Lewis of California, the ranking Republican on the House Appropriations Committee, said the estimated rise in discretionary spending – which is spending requiring annual congressional authorization – over the first 10 years under the new legislation could exceed $115 billion.

    On March 11, exactly two months earlier, the non-partisan CBO reported the estimated increase for discretionary spending could exceed $55 billion.

    =
    It’s nice to know you consider the CBO wing nuts. But then it tells more about you than anything.else

    You are still a delusional loser

    ==
    For one thing, unemployment was already over 8% when the stimulus was passed in February 2009

    Its seems Kevin you want to over take Rev Jim for dumbest liberal on the site.

    http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2010/08/graph_of_the_day_for_august_14.html

    Here is the link that shows the graph produced by Obama’s crack economic team that was used to sell the porkulus plan.

    =
    they all agree the stimulus was responsible for 1.6 to 2.5 million new private sector jobs.

    So which is it? 1.6 or 2.5? That’s a 56% variance. And the reason? They don’t know if any were created. That’s why they went from jobs created to jobs saved or created. And the true answer is a lot less the advertised.

    If you and liberals can keep repeating the same nonsense but that doesn’t make it true. Once again liberals lying to themselves.

    =

    Now we have spend baby spend.

    The Democrats new slogan:

    HOPE you don’t notice what we’ve done!

  • square1

    Take a stand? The guy passed health care, a stimulus bill that helped avoid a Depression, a groundbreaking financial reform bill that is too complicated to be popularly described, a bailout that enabled General Motors and Chrysler to survive. He nominated two estimable women to the Supreme Court. He restored America’s image in the world. I can go on…

    I never cease to be stunned at the Soviet-esque pathology of Beltway Centrists that forces them to deny the very existence of liberal goals. It isn’t enough to say that liberal goals are wrong. That would concede that liberals should be disappointed.

    No, Centrists demand liberal satisfaction! They insist that liberals be happy with Centrist goals and call them liberal goals. This is so bizarre.

    I am not a Republican and I find their intellectually-vacant obsession with tax cuts to be repulsive. But I can still admit that people who obsess about tax cuts would be upset that G.H.W. Bush raised taxes after promising not to do it. Republicans didn’t get what they wanted. They were upset. I get it.

    Why can’t Centrists simply admit that liberals want liberal policies and are disappointed when they don’t get them? Is that so hard to accept?

  • stuartzechman

    Very well said again, apr2563, although I will suggest that Halperin is a deliberate fool.
    .
    Here is a link to that background meeting held by Treasury, in which they explain that HAMP worked –meaning kept the banks from losing any more money, while people were still f*cked, as if it were like this by design.
    .
    http://www.interfluidity.com/v2/933.html

    The conversation next turned to housing and HAMP. On HAMP, officials were surprisingly candid.
    .
    The program has gotten a lot of bad press in terms of its Kafka-esque qualification process and its limited success in generating mortgage modifications under which families become able and willing to pay their debt.
    .
    Officials pointed out that what may have been an agonizing process for individuals was a useful palliative for the system as a whole. Even if most HAMP applicants ultimately default, the program prevented an outbreak of foreclosures exactly when the system could have handled it least.
    .
    There were murmurs among the bloggers of “extend and pretend”, but I don’t think that’s quite right. This was extend-and-don’t-even-bother-to-pretend. The program was successful in the sense that it kept the patient alive until it had begun to heal. And the patient of this metaphor was not a struggling homeowner, but the financial system, a.k.a. the banks.
    .
    Policymakers openly judged HAMP to be a qualified success because it helped banks muddle through what might have been a fatal shock. I believe these policymakers conflate, in full sincerity, incumbent financial institutions with “the system”, “the economy”, and “ordinary Americans”. Treasury officials are not cruel people. I’m sure they would have preferred if the program had worked out better for homeowners as well. But they have larger concerns, and from their perspective, HAMP has helped to address those.

    And Mike Allen’s response was to ask “how will this play?

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    Now, Stuart, I bet if you were asked if you approved or disapproved of Obama’s work you would, fairly clearly, tell a survey that you disapprove, yet, unless I completely misunderstood you for months, you would be just about 0% likely to vote for a Republican.
    .
    Right or wrong?
    .
    If so, that would tell you how, with 44% approval a president can win re-election since, while disapproving, one may still strongly prefer that president to the opponent.

  • pelhamite1

    In politics, as in real estate, it is all about location, location, location. And for that reason, articles such as this can usually be easily dismissed.

    Are there perhaps a few thousand “disaffected liberals” who, like Derek on this site, will proudly sit home and watch in their enraptured smugness as Democratic candidtates struggle without them? Yes, indeed. But, in the political map of 2010 USA, should we care? No.

    Although there are exceptions, the left wing blogosphere tends to be found in roughly four states – Massachusetts, California, smatterings around the beltway and my dear old New York. They happen to reside in districts where the Democrats are going to win overwhelmingly anyway – so they can generally indulge in their ideological perfection without harming the candidates and campaigns who matter.

    As the 2010 elections finally approach, each liberal has to stare into the mirror and decide just what it is they want to have happen. If you are a Californian, are you really going to let your feelings about Obama affect whether you vote for Barbara Boxer against Carly Fiorina? If you live in Pennsylvania, are you really going to sit and do nothing in the Pat Toomey-Joe Sestak race? As it happens, the preponderance of critical races for the Senate this year occur in places (New Hampshire, Ohio, Nevada, Kentucky) where the Jesuitical distinctions indulged in on web sites like Politico are well beside the point. The choice is nearly always coming down to whether to vote for a raving looney or not.

    The one exception to all this is – alas – Florida, where it has already been demonstrated how much damage a tiny handful of self-absobed leftists can do. Hopefully, the tragic consequences of that last debacle (remember, Ralph Nader doesn’t run and George bush is but a footnotre in history) should haunt anyone who decides the cool thing to do is to play “hard to get.”

  • m0mentom0ri

    “What is it about the words “consensus builder” those on the very far just don’t understand??”
    .
    What ‘consensus’ did he build? He comprimised with conservatives, screwed his base, and got no votes and no support. Where’s that noble ‘consensus’?
    .
    There’s a difference between sometimes tacking right or left on issues, and what Obama has been doing which is always tacking to the middle. He’s compromising with a ideological left and a ideological right for a nonsensical middle. Its splitting the baby in a cynical attempt to bridge a political divide. In the end, no one’s happy – left, right or middle – because the legislation no longer has any integrity – left, right or middle. It’s the difference between splitting $5 by separating it into two piles of $2.50 each, or tearing a five dollar bill in half and handing one piece to each party. There’s good compromise and bad. Obama’s compromises have been bad.
    .
    “The far left needs to stop belly aching”
    .
    “When liberals act like spoiled brats”
    .
    Thanks for the advice and psychoanalysis. May I offer you some? The middle needs to actually stand for something other than cowardly compromises and stop sitting on the sidelines and hope someone else fixes their problems. There’s nothing in the middle of the road except a yellow line and dead armadillos*.
    .
    (* h/t to Jim Hightower)

  • edismeiamhe

    nflfoghorn,

    Dear Mr. or Ms. Foghorn

    Your “put up or shut up “note on my assertion that we are being led around by the nose, by unelected socialist fanatics..

    Let’s start with Carol M. Browner:

    Quote from Washington Times (not Post) article:

    “Until last week, Carol M. Browner, President-elect Barack Obama’s pick as global warming czar, was listed as one of 14 leaders of a socialist group’s Commission for a Sustainable World Society, which calls for “global governance” and says rich countries must shrink their economies to address climate change”

    What do you think foggy?. Want five or six more?

  • husein11

    Obama girl Joe would never be depressed or disheartened over his love interest. If Obama didn’t support a stimulus neither would Obama girl Joe, if Obama supported strikes against Iran so would Obama girl Joe, if Obama didn’t support the mosque at ground zero, neither would Obama girl Joe, if Obama supported the cancellation of Time magazine so would Obama girl Joe.

  • http://erieangel.wordpress.com erieangel

    Now stuart, I don’t respond here very often, and this sort of thing is exactly why. Gosh darn it, I’m at work and was typing off the top of my head.
    .
    That said, I stand by everything I said.

  • stuartzechman

    Thanks for reading and responding to criticism in a very good natured way, erieangel.

  • shepherdwong

    Why can’t Centrists simply admit that liberals want liberal policies and are disappointed when they don’t get them?”
    .
    Because then centrists couldn’t paint liberals as irrational and extreme and they’d have to actually argue against liberal/progressive policies. They know they can’t, hence the bullsh!t arguments, straw men and unprovable assertions about what the public would approve.

  • stuartzechman

    Brilliant commentary, sqr1.
    .
    Thank you.

  • freeinpa

    One major difference_ Jackie Robinson was actually qualified for the job!

  • sy2d

    Politico has replaced Drudge as the most questionable reference for news.

    Politico has long aspired to replace Drudge as the internet resource for political gossip. Neither Politico, nor Drudge, does “news”. Innuendo, yes; news, no.

  • freeinpa

    For example, starting in college Al Gore turned into twenty thousand different climatologists and invent climate change
    =
    No he said he invented the internet. He just lies about climate change to pad his wallet. Hmm a dimheaded liberal who found the virtues of profit.

    Should Algore be on some sort looney probation for breaking the vow of no wealth?

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “One major difference_ Jackie Robinson was actually qualified for the job!”
    .
    He, also, didn’t replace a man who was AWOL during Vietnam, ran three companies in a row his daddy got him into the ground, was a self proclaimed drunk until his mid 30s, stole his job using the Supreme Court, invaded the wrong country, left a major American city drowning before responding and drove the economy into the ground.
    .
    With a bar set so low, Obama, by comparison, was the ultimate qualified man.

  • freeinpa

    “Name one positive issue the Republicans will pursue if they retake the House or Senate. They’ve got nothing but lies and insults.”

    They will undo job killing economy busting policies is the biggest positive.

    Icing on the cake will be the tears of the liberals who will be kicked out on their keisters as the American public has seen through the lies of the last campaign.

  • grape_crush

    What do you think foggy?
    .
    Oh Noes! She’s in league with that rabid Communist, “British Prime Minister Gordon Brown, who succeeded Tony Blair, in serving as vice president of the convening organization”
    .
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/jan/12/obama-climate-czar-has-socialist-ties/
    .
    Want five or six more?
    .
    Nope. You’ve said enough, Senator McCarthy.

  • m0mentom0ri

    “Obama girl Joe would never be depressed or disheartened over his love interest.”
    .
    This has been #27,345 in a series of homophobic conservative jokes.
    .
    Seriously. What is it with conservatives and the gay slurs? Is it some sort of conservative club thing? “You have to make at least 3 gay jokes a day or you lose your membership card.”
    .
    Can one of our right-wingers educate me? Why do conservatives think its funny to insult people by making homosexual references about them? Especially if they’re not actually, y’know, gay?

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “No he said he invented the internet.”
    .
    http://www.snopes.com/quotes/internet.asp
    .
    Really?
    .
    “During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet. ..”
    .
    That is not the same thing unless you are a mental patient.
    .
    “He just lies about climate change to pad his wallet.”
    .
    How could he pad his wallet if he has to pay off 20,000 people for this hoax and fake floods around the world?
    .
    We’ve been through this, you are delusional about climate change.

  • sacredh

    “Dems Depressed and Disheartened”

    Thanks for the article Joe. I agree with most of what you said. Dems may be “Depressed and Disheartened”, but if McCain/Palin had won the election I think we’d be “Furious and Disgusted”. For all of Obama’s failings, do any of us on the left think we’d be happy with what THEY would have done? Would we have been happy to have two more Scalias on the Supreme Court? Would we have been happy with more tax cuts for the wealthy? Would we have been happy if unemployment benefits never got extended because “There just isn’t the money to pay for them”? Would we have been happy with endless study groups endlessly studying our problems with the goal of never doing anything?
    .
    Would any healthcare have passed if Hillary had won? My guess is that the right would have rolled their eyes on Fox and CNN and moaned “Oh no! Hillarycare Part II”. I wanted Obama to be far more liberal/progressive than he has been. Yes, I’m disappointed about that. Am I going to stay home from the polls in 2010 and 2012 to vent my anger? The answer is a very simple “F**k no I’m not”. I plan on voting and it as sure as hell isn’t going to be a protest vote that is just voting throwing my vote away and there is no way in hell I’m going to vote for a Tea Bagger/republican.
    .
    The Supeme Court is still 5-4 conservative because of Obama instead of 7-2 conservative if grandpa/Misss Prissy had won. I voted for Obama and I can’t wait to do it again in 2012.

  • groenhagen2

    fatpat:

    There are no man-children in the Marines. But, of course, you would know nothing about that.

  • groenhagen2

    fatpat:

    “You just called seven of our past seventeen presidents like Hitler and I am stupid?”

    Only an extremely stupid person would offer a comment such as yours. What was that line from “Animal House”? Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.

  • groenhagen2

    The man-child Obama was associated with the Democratic Socialists of America (via the New Party of Chicago) when he ran for office in 1996.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    You quoted only one source taking one POV during those hearings;
    .
    Here is another:
    .
    “ANDREW JAKABOVICS, director of housing and economics, Center for American Progress: They were actually not as responsible as a lot of people would think.

    And I know that Ed disagrees with me. I think that the real problem here was the creation of an unregulated mortgage market. Wall Street was funneling trillions of dollar through unregulated channels into private-label securities. These were largely where the subprimes were.

    And what ultimately happened was the GSEs, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, were losing market share. They are government-chartered, but they were also shareholder-owned. And so they basically put short-term profits ahead of long-term safety and soundness responsibilities. And they basically sort of followed everybody else down the rabbit hole.”
    .
    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/business/jan-june10/fannie_04-09.html
    .
    Pinto is the minority opinion.
    .
    As for the bailout, you clearly do not understand the basics of economics. We’ve been through that.

  • kevin

    Oh, if American Thinker says it, then the BLS statistics must be wrong.
    .
    Sweet Jesus, you’re dumber than a bag of bricks.

  • nflfoghorn

    It’s Monday,EDis… – I’m always up for a laugh.

  • nflfoghorn

    Maybe it’s ’cause the ones making the jokes ARE….

  • kevin

    What is it with conservatives and the gay slurs?
    .
    Given what we’ve seen with how many of the “family values” conservatives are secretly gay — Larry Craig, Mark Foley, Ted Haggard, etc. etc. — I think it’s just proof of those studies that showed men who engaged in homophobic slurs were often repressing their own homosexual leanings.

  • kevin

    They will undo job killing economy busting policies is the biggest positive.
    .
    The policies they want to undo have created 1.6 million to 2.4 million private jobs in 18 months.
    .
    That’s more jobs than were created by the Republican policies of 2001-2009. There was net job loss during Bush’s first term, and a pathetic 1 million gain for all of his second term. (Clinton’s two terms? 22 million.)
    .
    Obama’s policies have already created more jobs in eighteen months than Bush’s did in eight years, and Obama has started to get us out of the ditch Bush drove us into — and yet you think the former is the “job killing economy busting” approach?
    .
    A little early in the day to be quite so drunk, isn’t it?

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    I am not fat and I rarely drink.
    .
    You compared Obama to Hitler.
    .
    Obama promised what seven of the past seventeen presidents did.
    .
    You would have to call Republicans Theodore Roosevelt and Richard Nixon like Hitler if you want to make such a comparison.
    .
    Or. you can say that bringing up Hitler is moronic.
    .
    “…drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.”
    .
    So, running a failing business, drunk most of the time and self publishing books which nobody buys the way you do is the model a New York City Commercial Real Estate Agent should take?
    .
    If you write books filled with comparing Democrats to Hitler for no reason, then no wonder you need your wife’s income to pay for your daily case of beer.

  • shepherdwong

    Thank you, sacredh. Of course political liberals will come out to vote in November and will undoubtedly pull the “D” lever. As usual, the election will be decided by the squishy, vaccuous middle, that can’t tell sh!t from Shinola. We’ve been here many times before. It’s why we’re where we are.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “There are no man-children in the Marines.”
    .
    So, is that why you got the dishonerable discharge in 1983?

  • apr2563

    Many bigots in the late 40s and 50s felt blacks were not qualified to play major league sports. Similar to how some bigots feel that way about our President.

  • nflfoghorn

    Seems like the perfect is indeed the enemy of the good. We just can’t see imagine the alternative, can we? (thx for the MP ref by the way ;) )

  • nflfoghorn

    see OR imagine ;)

  • nflfoghorn

    see 37 ;)

  • apr2563

    I read the Hugh Hewitt interview and mentioned it on another thread. The game and not the outcome is what counts. Allen is dispicable, the traditional press know it, but most curl up in a fetal position rather than acknowledge that.
    The Allen response in the HAMP meeting is to be expected. I only wish someone would have told him to STFU, go to work for Fox and Grover Norquist so you don’t have to spend your days coordinating talking points.

  • sacredh

    We have to vote for the candidates that are there, not the ones we wish were there. Obama isn’t anywhere near liberal enough for my tastes, but the thought of where we’d be if the right had been elected is more than enough to make me vote for Obama again. We’re just a good stroke or a heart attack away from a 5-4 majority in the Supreme Court. If that was the ONLY thing Obama accomplished during his one or two terms, I’d settle for that. I wouldn’t be happy about it, but the alternatives make me want to puke.

  • groenhagen2

    kevin:

    “But keep telling yourself the sky is falling. It’ll make November all the more painful for you.”

    The sky’s not falling for me, moron. I’ll make a deal with you. If the GOP fails to take control of the House, I’ll stop posting here. If the Democrats retain control of the House, you’ll stop posting here. Put up or shut up.

  • ohcalcutagirl

    We are in a deflationary cycle called a Kondratiev wave. This has lasted about 3 years and has about 5 more to go and will matter little it Reps or Dems are in power. Changes needed are greater than either these 2!

    SOLUTION IS SIMPLE;
    WE NEED A REAL POLITICAL PARTY OF THE PEOPLE with a real platform
    1st Stay out of foreign affairs cut the defense 70% since we spend more than all the rest of the world combined and 40 times per capita of 2nd place China. THIS CAN SAVE US FROM BANKRUPTCY
    2nd Admit we need absolute TORT REFORM since we do the same in lawyers as we do in military spending
    3rd Respect personal freedom; decriminalize drugs and let some kill them selves, it is far superior to killing others in their quest for the money. If a drug addict needs $200 a day, he has to STEAL $2,000.00 a day because he gets 10 cents on the dollar and OBVIOUSLY there are many EXTRA people involved in the movement of stolen goods.
    Now we can give that same drug addict his drugs at a cost of ONE dollar a day. STUDY SHOWS STOPPING THE SILLY WAR ON DRUGS =SAVE 77 BILLION pr yr.
    4th Respect personal freedom; if gays want to marry, no one else has a right to tell them NO and if states want to legalize ASSISTED SUICIDE, no one else has the right to tell them NO
    5th PUT AN END to gross over payment to public unions NOW, they can work for the national average in the private sector or say “thanks and GOOD BYE” This alone will save us from BANKRUPTCY
    6th HONOR THE 2ND AMMENDMENT; it is talking about personal right to bear arms to protect the people from tyrannical governments AND that includes our own.
    7th CLOSE THE BORDER with 30,000 soldiers of the many available when we stop wasting their lives and our resources on other countries affairs
    8th ADMIT that we are way down the list these days on many lists such as education so since we have MILLIONS TOO MANY poor dumb uneducated, THE LAST thing we need is to allow even one more poor uneducated person into our country
    9th We should have universal health care for our citizens and if we did the above things it would be easy; just what will be wasted from Afghanistan and Iraq after we pay for soldiers lives destroyed WILL in total cost 5 trillion dollars= or enough to have universal health care FOR OUR CITIZENS for the next 50 years
    10th STOP ALL PERKS TO POLITITIANS AND THEIR FRIENDS for example ; did U know that anyone who works for congress gets their student loans forgiven and it has cost billions of dollars? And who get to work for these wh0res, it is the rich and well connected of course!

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    “The funny and ironic thing is that they obviously hate the “myopic left” exactly because they can almost always see the centrist’s mistakes, even as they are making them. Which is why they’re forced to trot out straw men like “ideological purity, or a phony populism,” to hide behind and pretend to see things the myopic left just can’t understand:”
    .
    Ideological purity being in this case equivalent to economics 101, basic economics. But why settle for a complete solution, when half will do? An even scarier thing is the Right’s position. They have pretty well rejected the whole idea of a business cycle, or reason in general. Instead, they have settled on one set of fiscal and monetary policies, applicable to all situations. There is no ebb and flow in their model. No up and down.
    .
    Rational public policy is now considered radical. We can no longer separate rationalism from ideology. The beauty of the centrist position is one doesn’t even have to try. The simple act of declaring your position centrist is enough.
    .
    A. Centrism is Truth.
    .
    B. Ben is a centrist.
    .
    C. Everything Ben says, is true, in spite of all the contradictions.

  • apr2563

    If McCain and Palin had won, by now Sarah would have put the “poison in the pestle” and been saddened by McCains untimely demise.
    .
    The 1st Dude and her kids would have turned the White House into a meth lab. Momma Grizzly would be broadcasting for Fox from the oval office.
    .
    However, just after the mid-terms she would quit because the Presidency was hard work and she could offer more to the country by setting up turkey factories across the US.
    .
    The Republican Congress would have selected Jim Inhoff as VP when McCain passed and Sarah became President. Now we would have President Inhoff and we would all have to join Derek in Canada.

  • savagejoes

    Please tell me this author is kidding????? Obama’s “progressive” policies have moved this country to the edge of an abyss while Reagan saved us from the carter administrations total failure. BO would have done better to just support the status quo than to implement the monstrous policies that have and will bankrupt this country. Disheartened Dims…you got it, but disheartened because BO is proving that their policies won’t and can’t ever work.

  • ricardo65

    hey biggest moron groenfest, if the Repubs lose the House in November, you won’t quit posting. You’ll simply come up with another moniker and lie about who you are. Standard right-wing extremist lies suit you well.

  • blade1950

    Spot on!!!!

    I registered to let you know that your voice is not alone. I support ALL YOU SAID!! November will be the defining moment. I only pray the American People take back their country. Here is the list I was working on:

    1. All elected Fed, state, local government employees take 50% compensation cut.
    2. Income tax set at 10%. No deductions. Those directly involved in Medical, Police, Emergency Services and Education fields 5% income tax no deductions (not administrators/support).
    3. No more tax exempt status except for citizens 65 and over
    4. Persons not born in this country cannot own real property, Just like RP.
    5. Those born in this country of illegals are US citizens. Any child born here STAYS here. Any illegal person who tries to take a citizen out of this country is guilty of kidnapping a US citizen. US Constitution applies to citizens of the US and NO OTHERS “We the people of the United States…”
    6. Illegal’s WILL be sent BACK to country at that countries expense.
    7. LOCK DOWN the border with Mexico. Turn the land (20 KM wide area) into a weapons testing/military exercise area absolutely NO civilian property in this zone. Immediate $1K tax on any trips to/from Mexico
    8. Owners may assess own property tax levels but cannot sell above assessed value and cannot sell before 10 years after assessment
    9. Humans can marry humans if both legal age
    10. Legal age now 18 for ANYTHING. All persons committing felonies tried as adults.
    11. All religious organizations MUST pay income tax
    12. English IS the OFFICIAL language of this country. No more internal multilingual signs/documents/etc. English only in all schools. Other languages may be taught at schools expense and no credits awarded
    13. No FREE rides. Work for welfare
    14. All those citizens over 65 not pay tax
    15. All those citizens over 85 not pay tax and not pay for ANYTHING
    16. No more inheritance or capital gains tax
    17. Social security gone. Invest in yourself
    18. Health insurance companies gone. Government health care ONLY
    19. ALL Insurance companies pay out based on independently mandated levels
    20. All banks must pay minimum of ½ interest they receive from deposits back to depositors
    21. Maximum interest rate 10% no exceptions
    22. NO MORE BAILOUTS. Organizations fail or survive on own merits.
    23. No employee can receive over 5 times compensation of companies lowest compensation
    24. US now on metric system
    25. Education is NUMBER 1 and free. All teachers must maintain highest standards and tested by independent board every 5 years, no tenure. ALL schools exactly the same in abilities and available resources
    26. Health care is NUMBER 2
    27. Medical field (Doctors, Nurses, Dentists, Chiropractors, Acupuncturists, etc.) same as educators
    28. Schools teach fundamentals (reading, writing, math, science, history, art) and social survival (how to live in the REAL world) ONLY no BS classes 100% literacy in 5 years
    29. Voters voice above ALL else. The will of the people trumps ALL courts
    30. NAACP, ACLU, and all other racist organizations disbanded
    31. No organization may have more than 40% employees from single race at ANY level
    32. Equal pay equal job. Illegal to ask sex, religion, age, sexual pref. Employment based on ability to deliver
    33. Companies cannot hire own employees
    34. No government agency or entity can set own compensation levels
    35. Foreign policy is; we will help all we can with humanitarian aid. NO WEAPONS deals. Diplomacy will be fully exhausted but when the US military arrive it is as invaders not as friends. Only ROE is crushing ALL opposition. No such thing as innocent. No press allowed in conflict areas. The ONLY Great War is the one NOT fought. No such thing as “war crime”. War is a crime
    36. One military, no more Army, Navy, Marine, Air Force. All use same equipment/systems/weapons
    37. We care for our own FIRST. End homelessness and unemployment in 5 years
    38. No elected government employee can serve more than 8 years
    39. Political parties are illegal
    40. Lobbying from external entities is illegal
    41. Dependency on fossil fuels will be cut 10% per year over the next 10 years. Companies successful in reaching this gain additional 10% reduced taxes
    42. Immigration laws will be enforced. No company or person can employee or house illegal aliens. $10K fine each illegal 1st offence, $20K 2nd offence, All assets seized, sold and put in immigration fund 3rd offence, violators imprisoned for 10 years. Repeat illegal aliens put in correctional facilities for 10 years then deported at the expense of the country of origin
    43. All correctional facilities are to be EXACTLY the same. No “Hiltons”. All correctional facilities are public works camps. No free rides. Give ‘em a skill usefull in society
    44. No more death penalty
    45. 50% of organizations funds used to help the country are exempt from taxes. Must be able to prove by independent means.
    46. Must be able to independently PROVE advertised claims for products at or above 50% success rate, 95% for medical field
    47. No more double dipping of verdicts. Only criminal or civil court cases not both for same offence. It is a given that rights were violated in guilty verdicts or not in acquittals
    48. Maximum liability $100K
    49. Each person is solely and uniquely responsible and accountable for their own actions
    50. Credit rating systems are illegal
    51. Dissolve FEMA create regional national managed emergency disaster systems with pre-positioned materials and supplies to provide basic necessities for 1 month. Design and construct mobile shelters (Not tents) to house victims. Deployment requirement is set at 8 hours or less from disaster start for initial aid. Example, surrounding states provide immediate aid from pre-positioned sites for stricken state (Hawaii struck – California, Oregon, Washington, and Alaska provide immediate aid). Military immediate deployment to start ops within 1 hour. Looters shot on sight, no exceptions, and no excuses.
    52. All citizens must provide DNA sample so we know

    Locks do NOT keep an honest person honest. With honest people, you don’t even need a door!

  • shepherdwong

    Ideological purity being in this case equivalent to economics 101, basic economics. But why settle for a complete solution, when half will do?
    .
    IOW, when given a choice between rational progressive policies and batsh!t crazy “conservative” ones, a centrist will always choose half crazy.

  • gysgt213

    I just had some pretty good damn beef jerky with my beer. The world seems pretty sweet right now.

  • maverick2k9

    Yeah, Now where is 3x when we need him?

  • maverick2k9

    He was supposed to support a public option, a plan that would make health care affordable.
    -
    If my memory serves me right, in his book “Audacity of Hope”, Obama was clearly against public option (and against individual mandate during the campaign).
    -
    He has publicly acknowledged that he has changed his mind on the individual mandate.
    -
    Whatever you have to say, Obama is no flip-flopper, unlike John McCain.

  • rdw56

    From there between the stock market crash of 1987 and the election of 1992 the economy was fluctuating between recession and jobless growth

    ******************************

    You are entitled to your opinion not your own facts. The stock market crash lasted 6 months. It was nothing compared to the collapse of the Clinton bubble that started in 2000 and the NASD is STILL down more than 50%. The economy grew thru until 1991, 5 years after he 1986 tax cuts took effect. The mild recession in 91 was due to a S&L banking crises and GHWBs tax increase.

    It is impossible to degrade Reagan’s stellar economic record. Citing the stock market crash of 87 is pure desperation. The best chart is any showing stick market performance since 1930. The best period by far for investors was 1982 on when his 1st tax cuts set off a 20-yr stock market boom.

  • sacredh

    I had porcupine meatballs, mashed potatoes and peas for dinner. As soon as I finish my coffee and a cigarette or two, I’m going to have some coconut ice cream and pistachio cake for dessert. Life is good.

  • nflfoghorn

    Hmmm….how many critics would be talking about where Cindy McCain went on vacation and how much she spent? Or how dysfunctional the Second Family is? Or how clueless Vice President (ugh) Prissy is? Or how cranky President McCain gets with the media?

    Nah, you wouldn’t hear much of that ’cause Flox wouldn’t talk about it!

  • nflfoghorn

    Suddenly I just got a hearty case of indigestion :(

  • nflfoghorn

    ‘Obvious our thread has been overtaken by a coupla high-and-mighty loons.

  • rdw56

    Not it’s not likely democrats will keep the house.
    All of the generic party polls are showing Democrats in worse shape than in 1994 and the bad news is hardly over. Morgan Stanley just lowered their forecast for economic growth to a pathetic 2%. The stimulus did not work and a very large number of Americans know we pissed away $1T for nothing.

    Charley Cook is one of the more conservative forecasters and last week predicted for the 1st time the House would turn to the GOP. The Senate is a more difficult hurdle but is well within reason. Patty Murray is now behind Rossi 52% to 45%. It’s very bad bews when someone is over 50% and the incumbant can’t break 45%. Arkansas, Del, Indiana and PA are going to flip. That’s 45 GOP. The GOP is holding leads in WA, CA, CO, WI and IL while tied in NV. Blumenthal is ahead but running a rotten campaign in CT.

    More interesting is how clueless Obama is on the issues. The Ground Zero Mosque was a self-inflicted disaster. He can’t speak off a teleprompter and he’s radioactive in many states. The good news for republicans is while odds are we won’t get the Senate we absolutely will get a filibuster back with 40 solid conservatives. Brown and the Maine sisterrs can go moderate as they wish without costing the filibuster. Virtually every republican running is a staunch fiscal conservative.

  • http://milascurtains.wordpress.com milascurtains

    very short opinion: Fighting for People democrats did not learn – how to talk to people to get their trust.
    it is amazing, but liars got it.
    Maybe each of us should feel fault , that best ideas were not explained the nation in simple understandable way.
    And it is us, who is in charge for GOPs ability to screw things up.

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    “”Ideological purity being in this case equivalent to economics 101, basic economics. But why settle for a complete solution, when half will do?”
    .
    IOW, when given a choice between rational progressive policies and batsh!t crazy “conservative” ones, a centrist will always choose half crazy.”
    .
    Part crazy, part reasonable. The ratios seem to vary by issue.

  • rdw56

    Kevin,

    You can datamine all day long but you can’t sell the stimulus as good economic policy. It’s clearly failed. We have a very weak economy and no jobs growth. Using comparisons to Bush won’t help Obama in November or any other time. You comparisons to jobs created in the 1st Bush term is absurd because as everyone knows Bush inherited a stock market bubble, an accounting scandal and a recession from Clinton and then had to deal with 9/11.

    This November Democrats are going to get nailed on their votes for the failed stimulus, the dreaded healthcare bill and Obama’s general cluelessness. I live in PA and Democrats will lose the governorship, The Senate seat and up to 6 house seats. Further in 2012 Casey will lose his Senate seat for supporting the stimulus and HC.

    IN Obama you made two mistakes. He’s far too liberal and he’s far too incompetent. He is a total disaster as a speaker. He can deliver a set speech but he’s a gaffe machine off the teleprompter. He has not been able to move the needle on any issue his way. HC, Cap and Trade, his Israeli policy, Immigration, etc are all well over 50% opposed. The net result is he will have set back liberalism more than Jimmy Carter did.

  • sacredh

    nfl, I disagree. Fox would be saying that they were taking a well-earned working vacation so that they could better focus on solving the nation’s problems that they inherited from the democrats. If McCain got cranky with the media they would applaud John for not tolerating harrassment from the media. They wouldn’t talk about how dysfunctional Palin’s family is, they would try to make it seem like they were ” a real family with real family problems”…just like us!

  • rdw56

    Time magazine can hardly drive the news any longer. There are two dozen blogs with much higher readerships as well as Fox and another two dozen talk radio hosts. The internet has really killed people like Joe Klein who try to sell themselves as objective journalists but are low rent hacks.

    For example Time just printed a cover and lead story suggesting America has become islamaphobic based on silly information and conjecture. It’s the classic MSM trick of selling opinion as fact. One of the key determinants was the result of a poll question asking ‘do you think among the major religions Islam is most likely to promote violence” I forget the number but it was more than 50% and the editors suggest it means we are isalmaphobic. That’s just stupid. Michael Medved has the editor on and asked him the question and he answered “No”. That’s a preposterous answer. Of course Islam is the most violent and it’s not even a contest. The dupe of an editor tried to do the liberal dodge of using the crusades as an example of christian violence and medved mocked him correctly. The question, designed by Time, used the present tense. The fact Christians were violent 900 years ago is a stupid and useless factoid with no bearing in 2010.

    The bottom line here is while the cover was provacative Time didn’t move the needle their way. One has to be insanely PC or living in a cave to judge Christianity or Judaism as violent as Islam today. So much so it’s an insult to same people. It’s never good for a magazine to appear to be bonehead stupid. The only conclusion one could make is the magazine is politically correct to the point of absurdity and when Michael Medved gets 3x’s as many listeners as Time has readers and he makes their editor look foolish Time loses. You need facts and common sense to sell ideas not political correctness.

  • freeinpa

    “Oh, if American Thinker says it, then the BLS statistics must be wrong.”

    Speaking of dumber than bricks… Ding ding ding today you beat Patrickturd for liberal dunce of the day.

    The graph that American Thinker updates (you may not like it but its true) took the original graph from Obambi’s Economic Advisers and have updated it with the numbers from the BLS.. AT didn’t make the forecast and neither did the BLS. I also defy you to show what the data that AT has added in the updates that is wrong.

    That should keep you busy for a couple of hours before you crap yourself and fall asleep in your own filth.

  • freeinpa

    “The internet has really killed people like Joe Klein who try to sell themselves as objective journalists but are low rent hacks.”

    I take exception to that statement. JK is not low priced. He is more like a high price hooker doing the liberal pols bidding . He and Chris Tingles are the poster boys that will symbolize the end of MSM as we have known it.

  • freeinpa

    “The policies they want to undo have created 1.6 million to 2.4 million private jobs in 18 months”

    I see all the left loonbats received the same press release today. Let’s see if you can provide an answer that Kevin could not.

    Which number is it 1.6 or 2.4? That’s a 50% variance. Which menas nobody knows and it is a number thrown out on estimates and assumptions. Maybe it even includes the jobs saved. You remember those. If somebody called up a company with an order they were asked and it was from stimulus money, they counted all of those people as jobs saved.

    I guess when you watch your life long dream of having your pathetic philosophy being rejected daily now by the American public you will grasp at any straw. Problem now for you is Americans won’t believe the liberals crap anymore and they know it all has been lies. Sad!

  • rdw56

    Pat and Kevin,

    you are way too far into the weeds. If you have to cite obscure think take theories you can’t influence enough people to move public opinion. You also cannot cite your ouija board with what would have happened in a parallel universe if the Stimulus did not pass.

    People do not buy predictions and baseless suppositions. They’re opinions not facts and if your predictions were so good you’d be a billionaire on your private island. You ain’t. Your opinions are worthless.

    The stimulus did not work and as Barney Frank just clearly stated promising to hold unemployment to 8% was stupid. That’s Barney in his own words stating the obvious. Democrats are going to lose the house because of the failed stimulus. Further liberals are going to lost total control of fiscal policy.

    We have a fascinating situation unfolding under the radar with the 11 worse states in terms of fiscal health being blue states while almost all those running B/E and small surpluses are Red. All of the states adding jobs are red. Michigan, NY and CA to name just 3 are disasters. All had recently raised taxes and have become uncompetitive with states like Texas which has no income tax and lower sales taxes. MD cannot compete with VA.

    Americans understand these outrageous deficits are a fiscal disaster and are not going to stand for tax increases. Obama has not been able to sell big govt or Keynsian stimulus. It’s over for him.

  • sacredh

    I’m trying to put on 5-10 pounds. I’m not having much luck. If I could find a way to patent my metabolism, I’d be a billionaire.

  • freeinpa

    “As usual, the election will be decided by the squishy, vaccuous middle, that can’t tell sh!t from Shinola.”

    Which is exactly how Obama and the Dems were elected in ’08. Problem this time is people know what looney left is really about and the lies won’t work.

    As R Paul said this weekend, the left will try to demonize the Tea Party but being called a Democrat is what will scare voters

  • freeinpa

    “I am not fat and I rarely drink”

    Maybe more portly than is portable. But as big of a failure as you have been, to quote Bluto in Animal House, I suggest you start drinking heavily. At least then you could blame it on alcohol

  • freeinpa

    Yes only left loons need apply

  • freeinpa

    “I had porcupine meatballs, mashed potatoes and peas for dinner. As soon as I finish my coffee and a cigarette or two, I’m going to have some coconut ice cream and pistachio cake for dessert”

    Ah reminds me of my college days down south, except we finished with sour mash and cheap cigars. Life was good

  • kevin

    If the GOP fails to take control of the House, I’ll stop posting here. If the Democrats retain control of the House, you’ll stop posting here.
    .
    I’d love to take that bet, but I already have one along those exact terms with freeinpa, only with the Nevada Senate race between Reid and that nutjob Angle. I don’t think I can double down — what happens if I win one and lose one?
    .
    That said, you come across as a raging a$$hole here, so I’m sure you won’t have any trouble at all finding a taker.

  • 3xfire3

    Joe,
    .
    You have to be one of the last people on this earth that still has that warm feeling running up and down your leg.
    .
    Will you ever be somewhat normal again? Well maybe you were never anywhere near normal. Go to bed now little Joe Obama Klein. Pleasant dreams about your hero.

  • kevin

    His Pat Benatar cover band is probably playing a sweet sixteen party.

  • sacredh

    freeinpa, out of curiosity, what do you think will be the outcome in November? Do you think the democrats will lose both the house and the senate or one but not the other? My own feeling is that we’ll lose the house but keep the senate. Both narrowly.

  • kevin

    You can datamine all day long but you can’t sell the stimulus as good economic policy. It’s clearly failed. We have a very weak economy and no jobs growth.
    .
    I might not be able to sell you on the idea that the stimulus is good economic policy, but the vast majority of professional economists think so, and the vast majority of independent economic observers credit it with preventing a full blown Depression.
    .
    Did the stimulus fix everything? No, of course not. It was, as many pointed out at the time, not nearly big enough to deal with the massive crisis that George W. Bush and the Republican Party brought to our economy.
    .
    The problem is that we are in the deepest economic hole we’ve been in since 1932, and it will take record rates of job creation for us to break even from all the jobs we lost under Bush. We are, and have been, making slow and steady progress, but we’re not there yet — and, frankly, it’s idiotic for anyone to suggest that we should be there yet.
    .
    You sound like a kid in the backseat of a car traveling from New York to Los Angeles. Even though the car is speeding along at 75 mph and making good time, it has a long long way to go. If the kid said, “oh we didn’t make it to L.A. in the first day of traveling, so we must be doing it wrong” you’d laugh at that, right? You’re making the same argument here.
    .
    Seriously, look at this graph of job losses under Bush and job gains under Obama. Which one is going in the right direction?
    .
    http://blog.markcz.com/obama-racine-midterm-election-warmup/bush-obama-job-growth.jpg

  • kevin

    The twits really think she’s going to charm Anton?
    .
    His name is Antonin.
    .
    And no, no one thinks she’s going to “charm” him. She never will, and she never should even try.
    .
    She will, however, use her considerable gifts at consensus building to win over Anthony Kennedy. And if she can get Kennedy to join with her, Sotomayor, Ginsburg and Breyer, that’s a 5-4 liberal majority.

  • terryyrret

    Gosh Mr. Klein, He did all of that, and He is your hero, we know.
    But we are still at record levels of unemployment (for elitists like you that means that the real people who work for a living in this country have no means to go to Spain on vacation,) and yes, we (that’s me and my co-workers who actually pay taxes as opposed to elitists like you and Mr. Obama,) did bail out all of the companies elitists like you and Mr. Obama own stock in, (yes, He probably doesn’t but they pay him to be elected, and that’s the same.)
    As much as you wish we all fell off the Turnip Truck yesterday, some of us can see what reality is in regards to Him.

  • kevin

    I see all the left loonbats received the same press release today. Let’s see if you can provide an answer that Kevin could not.
    .
    See that name next to this post? Kevin. And the name next to the one above your? Kevin. And the previous citation of these numbers? Kevin again.
    .
    I know as part of Rusty’s multiple personality disorder, you tend to see one person as a dozen or so, but these have all been mine.
    .
    Which number is it 1.6 or 2.4? That’s a 50% variance. Which menas nobody knows and it is a number thrown out on estimates and assumptions
    .
    I’m not sure if this is an actual stupid question or one of the fake-stupid questions you all like to throw out, but the reason for the variation in the numbers is (1) they were calculated by different macroeconomists working on their own, (2) the studies were conducted with different timesets as the funding was extended on a rolling basis, so they didn’t cover exactly the same “stimulus,” and (3) the stimulus funding was often used to augment and amplify projects that had other sources of funding, so there’s no clear 1:1 correlation between the two (as anyone who even took Econ 101 in college would understand).
    .
    But here’s what’s clear — all the experts agree the stimulus had a significant, positive impact on the economy. You can furrow your brow at the numbers and use Bush’s old lame “fuzzy math” excuse, but the data is as clear as they get.
    .
    The data is just as clear on what happened the last time we let Republicans employ their patented “tax cuts and unicorns for everyone!” approach to the economy. The 2000s were the first decade in a century in which median income actually dropped, and its total record of job creation — negative in the first term, a bare minimum of 1 million over the second term — is the worst since Herbert Hoover.
    .
    I guess when you watch your life long dream of having your pathetic philosophy being rejected daily now by the American public you will grasp at any straw.
    .
    Oh, so that’s what happened to you? When the voters threw out Republicans in 2006 and 2008, elected Obama by a massive margin, and historians declared Bush the worst president of the 20th century, you just started grasping at any straw, like “why is there variance in the economists’ reports? hey, I bet they counted jobs saved! Dur-hurr!”
    .
    Keep grasping for straws. It’s like watching a dog try to eat peanut butter.

  • kevin

    we are still at record levels of unemployment
    .
    You failed history, didn’t you?
    .
    We haven’t even surpassed the worst levels of unemployment under Reagan, much less the 29% we hit during the Great Depression.

  • rdw56

    She’s not going to charm Kennedy or anyone else. This isn’t Harvard it’s the Supreme Court. Kennedy has been a sitting justice for 20 years. Kagan hasn’t been a judge for 20 minutes.

    If you’ve been following the court at all the last few years you are aware Kennedy has been a sharp disappointment to liberals. The court has moved decisively right under Robert’s stellar management. The Chief Justice has the ability to guide the court to specific decision when he understands their relative positions and gauge if he can go for a narrow or a broad decision. Initially Roberts worked to avoid 5-4 decisions but now goes for them them frequently.

    Roberts has also been shrewd in deciding who writes the majority opinions. I was especially impressed with winning the DC gun control case and for the 1st time affirming the right of the individual to bear arms.

    For Kagan to gain any influence she’s 1st going to have to prove her legal abilities and with virtually no experience and certainly nothing worth citing it’s going to take quite a while. At this point there’s absolutely no reason for the other justices to seek her input any more than one of their law clerks. Anton will toy with her. It’s simly foolish to think she’ll be in a position to tell them anything about the law they don’t already know.

  • rdw56

    Kevin,

    Quite right these aren’t record levels of unemployment but for anyone under 50 they’re the highest in their lifetimes and only a few years from 5%. Politically speaking they ‘seem’ like record levels and will be the major cause of the Democrat train wreck coming this November.

    It’s not just a political issue. Ideologically speaking big govt is getting killed. Keynsian stimulus has failed. Morgan Stanley just lowered growth forecasts for the next 6 months to 2% and even the CBO is admitting growth this recovery will be less than prior recoveries. Obama’s powers of persuasion are so abymal the G-8 led by Canada and Germany rejected his call for more spending going instead in the precise opposite direction.

  • word242

    WOW, Joe Klein is even more of a delusional moron than I thought. Everything he lists as “factual” is a absolute joke (untrue). Is he paid by the White House PR Team??

  • diecash1

    For Kagan to gain any influence she’s 1st going to have to prove her legal abilities and with virtually no experience and certainly nothing worth citing it’s going to take quite a while. At this point there’s absolutely no reason for the other justices to seek her input any more than one of their law clerks. Anton will toy with her. It’s simly foolish to think she’ll be in a position to tell them anything about the law they don’t already know.

    You’re not exactly familiar with SC history are you? More than a third of past SC justices had no prior judicial experience. Some of the most respected justices, Brandeis, Reinquist, Warren and Marshall to name a few, had no prior judicial experience. You are merely attempting to disparage Kagan before she can demonstrate her abilities on the bench, nothing more.

  • kevin

    Quite right these aren’t record levels of unemployment but for anyone under 50 they’re the highest in their lifetimes and only a few years from 5%.
    .
    I’d say anyone over 40 would have memories of 1982, when Reagan’s first tax cut spiked unemployment from the 7% flatline it’d been in under Carter and soared up to 10.2%.
    .
    And yes, we may just be a few years away from 5%, but more important, we’re just sixteen months away from 8.9% unemployment — which is where things stood when the stimulus was passed — and things are only slightly worse at 9.6%.
    .
    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_nSTO-vZpSgc/S5ErOvVA_4I/AAAAAAAAH_k/cTbsusvMqJ0/s1600-h/Unemployment+Rate-2010-02.png
    .
    Yes, these may be the worst numbers in most Americans’ lifetimes, but not all voters have amnesia about how we got to these numbers. Most Americans still put the blame where it belongs — the Republicans.
    .
    http://www.gallup.com/poll/127472/bush-gets-more-blame-economy-obama.aspx
    .
    Yes, the Democrats are going to lose seats in the fall. The president’s party almost always does, and the gains the Democrats made in 2006 and 2008 came on Republican turf and many of those seats will be hard to defend.
    .
    But this isn’t going to be the massive refutation and humiliation of the Democratic Party that Fox News and the other right-wing propaganda outlets are making it out to be. Thanks to the slate of Tea Party extremists, the Republicans have no hope of retaking the Senate and are probably a toss-up to retake the House.
    .
    Frankly, it’s win-win for Democrats. Either they keep control both houses and have a better shot at cohering around an agenda with fewer conservative blue dogs mucking things up like Rep. Stupak and Sen. Lincoln, or they lose the House and Obama gets to run against Boehner and Cantor’s decidedly know-nothing caucus in 2012.

  • lorax2

    As one of the Dems that is gravely disappointed, I can easily itemize the expectations that were not met by Obama. First let me say the “accomplishments” that Joe Klein itemizes are over blown by him. They are just rearrangements of the deck chairs on the Titanic. Obama promised to close down GITMO. There is nothing that has destroyed the US reputation abroad than the torture and the kangaroo courts set up by the Bush Administration. GITMO is still detaining people without bringing any charges (the right of habeas corpus is a universal right over 800 years old). There is an up coming case in a GITMO kangaroo court where a 15 year old is accused of throwing a grenade – and “evidence” obtained by torture of him and others will be allowed. This is a continuation of the most obnoxious of the Bush policy and the promised “change.”

    The problem with US medical care is that it is dominated by private insurance. This has resulted in the most expensive medical care in the world – but we are only 29th in quality. All other civilized countries employ government insurance either in whole or part. But Obama took the government insurance “off the table” and instead made it mandatory to buy private insurance – from the very source of the problem.

    Obama spoke famously against the wars. Yet we are still continuing the disasterous occupying of countries. The Iraq war was based on lies, WMD, etc. We are supporting Pakistan which runs their intelegence service which in tern supports the Taliban in a senseless cycle where we are creating and supplying our own enemies.

    The bailouts that were started by Bush were continued by Obama. The so called finance reform has no real teeth. Instead of talking about how much bonus millions Wall Street CEOs should get we should be talking about how much time they should get. Obama kept the same banksters that advised the Bush admin. Both have created an unpayable debt that will crush the US.

    Broken promises, lies, caving in on principles, I could go on and on.

    I voted for Obama. I am very, very disappointed. There is nothing Joe Klein can say to make Obama look good to me. I will not give any more money to Obama or the Dems. I will vote for the Green Party next time. There is not a dime’s worth of difference between Dems and Reps. They are both bought out by corporate interests and we now have a permanent “warfare” state.

  • kevin

    If you’ve been following the court at all the last few years you are aware Kennedy has been a sharp disappointment to liberals.
    .
    Ha! Are you kidding? Google “Anthony Kennedy” and “Greenhouse effect” and see what you get — a bunch of furious right-wingers like Pat Buchanan who see him as “Souter Jr.”
    .
    Listen, unlike you, I actually am a liberal and I’m not at all disappointed in Kennedy. I know he authored the majority decision in Lawrence v. Texas, which is a landmark victory for gay rights, and I know he authored the slim 5-4 majority decision in Kennedy v. Louisiana, which was a major blow to capital punishment, and I know he wrote the slim 5-4 majority decision in Boumediene v. Bush which knocked down the Bush administration’s flagrant disregard of habeus corpus.
    .
    Kennedy is the very definition of a swing justice. He’s been siding more and more with the liberal block on the Court, and Kagan is perfectly suited to help keep him there.
    .
    Roberts has also been shrewd in deciding who writes the majority opinions.
    .
    Which only matters if Roberts is on the majority side. If he’s not, the opinion assignment gets determined by whichever member of the majority side has seniority — which means Kennedy would get to pick himself if he joins with the liberals.
    .
    For Kagan to gain any influence she’s 1st going to have to prove her legal abilities and with virtually no experience and certainly nothing worth citing it’s going to take quite a while.
    .
    You do realize that her last job as Solicitor General had her arguing several cases in person before these very justices, right? And even if she hadn’t, they might be a little impressed by the whole “dean of Harvard Law School” thing?
    .
    Anton will toy with her.
    .
    One more time — his name is Antonin. If you’re going to posture like you know anything about the current Court, you really should try to remember that.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “You are entitled to your opinion not your own facts.”
    .
    Agreed.
    .
    “It is impossible to degrade Reagan’s stellar economic record.”
    .
    The real estate market and the stock market were in terrible shape in 1987, but, since most people earn their money through working, the unemployment numbers went up in 1987 and did not come back down again until 1993.
    .
    “Citing the stock market crash of 87 is pure desperation. ”
    .
    No, it is marking point of when unemployment went up.
    .
    “The best chart is any showing stick market performance since 1930. The best period by far for investors was 1982 on when his 1st tax cuts set off a 20-yr stock market boom.”
    .
    If and only if your entire view of economics is the value of stocks this would be true.
    .
    It took five years for stock prices to reach their 1987 value.
    .
    “On Black Monday of October 1987 a stock collapse of unprecedented size lopped 22.6 percent off the Dow Jones Industrial Average. The collapse, larger than that of 1929, was handled well by the economy, and the stock market began to quickly recover. However, in North America, the lumbering savings and loans industry was beginning to collapse, leading to a savings and loan crisis which put the financial wellbeing of millions of Americans in jeopardy.

    The panic that followed led to a sharp recession that hit hardest those countries most closely linked to the United States, including Canada, Australia, and the United Kingdom. The economies of much of Europe and Japan were hurt, but not as badly. The US economy continued to grow as a whole, although certain sectors of the market such as energy and real estate slumped.

    The first burst of the recession was short-lived, as fervent pre-election activity by the governments of the United States and Canada created what many economists at the time saw as an economic miracle: a growing consumer confidence and increased consumer spending almost single-handedly lifted the North American economy out of recession.

    It soon turned out that the quick recovery was illusory, and by 1990, economic malaise had returned with the beginning of the Gulf War and the resulting 1990 spike in the price of oil, which increased inflation but to less of a degree as the oil crisis ten years earlier. Nevertheless, for the next several years high unemployment, massive government budgetary deficits, and slow Gross Domestic Product (GDP) growth affected the United States until late 1992 and Canada until 1995.

    The rest of the world was less affected by the downturn; Germany and Japan both grew rapidly. Some pundits guessed that this would be a permanent state of affairs and that both the German and Japanese economies would grow to be larger than the American one.”
    .
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_1990s_recession
    .
    “It was nothing compared to the collapse of the Clinton bubble that started in 2000 and the NASD is STILL down more than 50%.”
    .
    Unlike the 1987 crash, the job losses were few and far between outside of the tech industry and bounced back about five years later, just with far, far better business models. Only high risk tech focused investors lost out on that.
    .
    You are the one who is desperate. Clinton had eight years of peace and prosperity paying off Ronny’s debts and fast followed by the appointed president in 2001 who blamed everything on Clinton for the next eight years.

  • stuartzechman

    Well said, Derek.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “If you have to cite obscure think take theories you can’t influence enough people to move public opinion. You also cannot cite your ouija board with what would have happened in a parallel universe if the Stimulus did not pass.”
    .
    It’s called introduction to Macro Economics, but, often brought up with less detail in Econ 101.
    .
    If we are on a sinking boat Kevin, Stuart, Apr and I start bailing water out until we get help but the water rushes in faster, you would say that bailing out water does nothing. I would say, “stop sitting there and gab a fkg bucket!”
    .
    To follow what Kevin said, this stimulus package is like going 75 MPH from NYC to LA. If we spent more, we would have had a ticket on plane to get their.
    .
    Obama was too centrist begging for Republican votes which never came despite the fact Ford, Nixon and Eisenhower got us out of recessions this way. Unfortunately Republican thinking today considered Econ 101 too sophisticated and esoteric.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “But as big of a failure as you have been,..”
    .
    Living in the best city in the world in a job which pays an average of $200 k a year (with huge fluctuations – one deal can be as much as one million dollars), I think I could do worse.
    .
    You fix Air conditioners for a living freoninpa, you should talk about being a failure.

  • rationalrevolutionnet

    Only someone with no understanding of the issues could possibly be satisfied with Obama. I voted for him, and yes I’m completely dissatisfied with him and the entire Democratic Congress and won’t be voting Democrat again, even if it results in Republican wins.

    You say that he delivered on health care reform, financial reform, a stimulus package, etc.

    NO HE DIDN’T!

    What he did was he passed right-wing legislation under so-called progressive banners, that’s why he has no support from anyone!

    Those on the right don’t like him for too many reasons to name, none of the logical, and because he has claimed to have passed some “progressive” legislation.

    However in in reality if you actually look at the legislation, you see that its not progressive at all, indeed most of it looks like it was written by the very Republicans that make a show of feigning opposition to him.

    Here are the facts:
    1) Stimulus package: IT WAS MOSTLY TAX CUTS, LARGELY FOR TH RICH!!!!! DUH, LOOK AT WHAT IT ACTUALLY WAS!

    The “stimulus” that was signed by Obama is HORRIBLE! Of course it has failed to do much good, because it uses mostly the same old failed policies of the Republicans, once again. The single biggest component of the stimulus was direct tax cuts to businesses! Tax cuts are a HORRIBLE and ineffective form of stimulus. The next biggest component of the stimulus was just funding to the states that helped them avoid tax hikes, so all in all like 80% of the stimulus was just tax cuts or averting state and local tax hikes, that’s it!

    For $800 billion, they could have directly commissioned 10 million jobs, at a cost of $80,000 per job. If these jobs had paid between $20,000 and $50,000 a year there would have been plenty of money to fund the jobs, plus provide materials and administration. The $800 billion was WASTED ON MORE TAX CUTS FOR TH RICH, DO SOME REPORTING AND STOP JUST FOLLOWING MINDLESS TALKING POINTS!

    2) Health Care “Reform”
    The health care reform passed by Obama and the Democrats is a total disgrace!

    The whole thing is a horrible misguided give away to big business, that instead of reforming health insurance, just puts Americans even more firmly under the insurance industry’s thumb!

    This “progressive” reform plan was largely a combination of a prior Republican reform plan and a plan put together by the Heritage Foundation, one of the most far-right think-tanks in America!

    GET A CLUE DUDE!

    They caved in on every meaningful aspect of reform to the Insurance and Pharma industries. The insurance industry made ZERO concessions! Do you think that they care about the new restrictions? They don’t at all, because once everyone has to go by those restrictions, its no longer a competitive disadvantage for them, and THERE IS NOTHING IN THE LAW to keep them from just jacking up the rates!

    This legislation is a horrible, horrible failure and disgrace. Please NEVER EVER call this “progressive” legislation, its like calling the pro-slavery South progressive, just absurd!

    What did progressives want? Single Payer for starters, at LEAST a public run, not-for-profit, insurance options.

    But that’s not even the half of it. Why not fund a single payer system with taxes on the very things that are the CAUSE of our health care costs, like cigarettes, junk food and drinks, high risk activities, etc. Why not take the burden of health care off the backs of employers like other countries with universal health care systems, so that instead of GM having billions in liabilities for union insurance plans all employers would pay a modest flat tax per employee. Its cheaper for employers, and we the people never have to worry about losing coverage due to our jobs or moving to a different state! But NOoooo, that’s just “far left” crazy talk.

    3) Financial Reform?

    What a joke, EVERYONE agrees that what was passed is largely useless and won’t prevent another melt down, and does basically nothing to those that caused the problems, and makes no fundamental changes to the system.

    If the financial reform bill had actually been appropriate the stack market would have tanked, but instead its been up.

    They didn’t even get near stuff like high frequency trading, or limits on transaction fees, and all manner of other things. The incentive system on Wall Street, and the fact that they largely create no value while just sliming huge amounts off the top and holding our economy hostage has no changed!

    Anyone who calls themselves a progressive and supports Obama is a fool. Anyone claiming that progressives should be supporting Obama is an even bigger fool!

    Obama is just another Republican in sheep’s clothing! This was the time I was gonna give the Democrats one last chance, and they definitely blew it, I’m never voting Democrat again, even if it means handing the country over to the out of the closet fascists, because voting for in the closet fascists isn’t doing us any good either!

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    We are in a deflationary cycle called a Kondratiev wave.
    .
    I never heard of this and looked it up:
    .
    “The Russian economist Nikolai Kondratiev (also written Kondratieff) was the first to bring these observations to international attention in his book The Major Economic Cycles (1925) alongside other works written in the same decade. Two Dutch economists, Jacob van Gelderen and Samuel de Wolff, had previously argued for the existence of 50 to 60 year cycles in 1913. However, the work of de Wolff and van Gelderen has only recently been translated from Dutch to reach a wider audience.”
    .
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kondratiev_wave
    .
    NeoClassical economics done by a citizen of the Soviet Union eighty five years ago, long ago torn apart.
    .
    “Yes only left loons need apply”
    .
    Really, like the second amendment be interpreted in a conservative way, an end to public sector unions and a freeze on immigration are “left wing”
    .
    “Spot on”
    .
    That would be British English.
    .
    It’s like the Beatles invasion, but really awful. Maybe it’s more like when Duran Duran was introducing synth pop music from England to America.
    .
    We now have bloody wankers coming to America.

  • sacredh

    kevin, I think we are going to lose the house in november, but I also see a silver lining if we do for precisely the reasons you do. If they do win, they’re going to have to be a part of the Washington culture they claim to abhor. They can’t run against themselves in 2012. They will either have to come up with viable alternatives or pack their bags. If the people that vote for them are looking to them as the answer to our problems, they have to produce solutions. They can’t have a slim majority in the house and automatically think the senate will go along with them. There’s also the little matter of a Presidential veto to contend with if they get too big-headed. If we didn’t have a mandate with the majorities we had, do they honestly think we’re going to really consider a slim majority a vast majority?

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “Ah reminds me of my college days down south, except we finished with sour mash and cheap cigars. Life was good.”
    .
    I can just see you in the Jim Crow South in a Bible college getting drunk and pretending that you learned something, Freeinpa.
    .
    Don’t tell me, you went to U White.

  • truevcu

    “I understand that Hitler pretty much did what he said he would do in “Mein Kampf.” ”

    I hereby invoke Godwin’s Law

  • lloyd227

    Amazing, nearly every sentence in this piece is delusional at best.

    Has Joe Klein finally fallen completely over the edge?

  • allthingsinaname

    “Are you suggesting that Obama isn’t upholding the Bill of Rights?”
    .
    “I doubt you’d take my word for it so, tell you what. Make up a juicy bomb-plot email and send it to any Madrassa in Pakistan. Let us know how that works out (if we don’t hear from you, we’ll take that as a “no”).”
    .
    You are fking nuts. You think as a citizen of the US I have the right to practice or prosecute my own frigging war?
    .
    God almighty you are nuttier then the far right! You are absolutely a fruit cake!

  • jtg1977

    I have no problem with Latinos, Muslims, gays, mixed-race couples or the name of our President. What I DO give Obama a failing grade for is fixing the economy. But since Joe Klein has a job and is not in danger of being laid off anytime soon, I guess he’s not all concerned about that.

    Some of you Obama supporters are no different than the Republicans and conservatives who’d think Bush was an infallible God-emperor who could do no wrong. The party is different, but the mentality is the same.

  • allthingsinaname

    While we are on the subject where were are these Liberal Democrats while the debate of Health Care was going on? I do not remember seeing many Democrats at all on TV, On the sunday morning news, shows. There were a tremendous amount of Whackos, pushing Death Panels etc..
    .
    You think a couple of Democrats derailed what you want? Your nuts I didn’t hear nothing but lip service for the publlic option from the Dems, period, let alone single payer. Yea you can name a couple I am sure, but nowhere near 60. They didn’t want it, period.Just keep adding, Climate Change, Stimulus, Immigration.
    The deal was struck before you knew there would be anything.
    ..
    As far as the rest of the BS you three throw around, it is BS. Blame belongs to the public for listening to the right wing nuts, the press for doing nothing but giving them a voice, for past Congresses for allowing the press to own the market.
    .
    The you can blame the far right, and I’ll blame the far left right with them. The both of you act as if the world should just center around you. Screw you!
    .
    The majority are doing just fine, they have their Health Care, Paying jobs, Money in the bank, and they do not trust change, those are facts, learn to live with it.
    .

  • rdw56

    come on KEVIN,

    This is amateurish. This is why Obama and the MSM fail. Your suggestion Reagan’s tax cuts sent unemployment up are nonsensical. Not even the dumbest of the dumb would make that connection.

    What drove unemployment up and the economy down in 1982 were 20% interest rates as Reagan and Volckner were trying to bring inflation down from 10%. They succeeded.

    Kevin this is 2010. The MSM doesn’t control the data and they damn sure no longer control the narrative. If you want to win an argument you need coherent, logical and accurate facts. The MSM can’t hide the fact Reagan had a huge inflation problem he solved with monetary policy. Anyone who took a basic marco economics class understands this in a way Joe Klein can’t manage.

    Obama passed a stimulus package he promised would help growth and create jobs. It FAILED. Any moron can see it FAILED. You can create all of the alternate universes you like but in this one it FAILED. When voters go to the polls this November every single one of the will know it FAILED.

  • rdw56

    No, I am not trying to disparage Kagan merely pointing out the obvious. The vast majority of the third you were referring to were far in the past. During the modern era justices for the most part have been experienced judges or at least experienced laywers. Kagan is neither. The court is a very different place than in 1950 or 1920 or 1865. If I am not mistaken all of the current justices except for the wise latina are at the top of their law class or very near. These are all very accompished legal scholars. Scalia, Ginsburg, Roberts, Breyer and Alito are intellectual stars. Kagan is a politican with little legal experience. To suggest she’s going to have influence with this group is preposterous. She brings NOTHING to the table. Obama had one goal in mind. He needed someone who would approve his HC package. All he cared about was that vote.

  • rdw56

    Kevin, lighten up, his pals call him Anton.

  • rdw56

    ‘You do realize that her last job as Solicitor General had her arguing several cases in person before these very justices, right? And even if she hadn’t, they might be a little impressed by the whole “dean of Harvard Law School” thing?”

    OK, this is getting stupid. Her term was SG was short, sweet and unimpressive. In once case it was kennedy who undressed her in questioning before voting against her. While the SG post was at least a legal job The Dean of the Harvard Law school thing is useless as far as the courts go. It’s a political job heavy on fund-raising. There’s nothing in the job of Dean to prepare one for the SC.

    I have no doubt Kagan is very bright with a wonderful personality. But you can’t possibly compare her legal experience to anyone on the court. She hasn’t a single legal accomplishment worthy of mention that can’t be offset by a poor accomplishment. Roberts, Alito, Scalia, Ginburg, Breyer were all accompished jurists and recognized legal scholars. Kagan is a politician and social climber. She has no standing in that world. She was picked only because she’ll deliver Obama the vote he needs.

  • rdw56

    “If they do win, they’re going to have to be a part of the Washington culture they claim to abhor. They can’t run against themselves in 2012.”

    Well since they all live in DC they’re part of the culture. Their task is actually quite simple. They don’t have to pass much legislation. they only need to block Obama and if they win the house that’s a given. Further the GOP doesn’t need 51 Senate seats to control the house. The filibuster ends the possibility of liberal legislation. Today they have 41 seats but the Maine sisters and Scott Brown are very moderate. There will be at least 10 new GOP senators who will be ardent fiscal hawks. Pat Toomey is a long time supply sider who will replace the moderate Arlen Spector. Marco Rubio is an ardent conservative replacing a moderate republican in FL. Even the seats that will stay within the party are getting more conservative replacements. There will be 40 solid conservatives for a fliibuster freeing up Brown and other moderates to do what they need to satisfy their base without ending the filibuster.

    Of great advantage is Obama is such a rotten communicator. He hasn’t moved the needle on anything. Sell Cap and Trade? He was useless. Immigration reform? I don’t think so. Tax increases? No way. He is in a nasty box of his own making. The economy sucks because his stimulus sucked. People are done with deficits. They won’t approve more stimulus. The economy is slowing repairing and eventually will get over Obama’s malfeasance. It will begin in Red states like Virgina, Texas and Florida where the tax rates and business environment is so much better. I think it was toyota announced this week they expect to hire 2,000 for a new plant in Mississippi thanks to the great work by governor Haley Barbour and I’m sure a competitive tax package combined with lower energy costs and a on-union work force. It’s simply impossible for Detroit to compete. GM and Chrysler have radically downsized while the foreign makers are expanding. It won’t be long and the majority of cars will be made in the south by non-union labor.

    How interesting is it while government motors is touting green cars the recovery in sales is in trucks, luxury and mid-sized sedans with little market for electric and compact cars. Government motors will do as well here as it did n the Soviet Union.

  • rdw56

    It’s much worse than you know. By following virtually all of GWBs national security policies Obama has confirmed them as official US Policy. Once both parties agree to implement a policy it is US policy. Rendition, wireless wiretaps, etc all now the law of the land. Even more interesting is Obama turned Bagram AF base into gitmo. At the detention facility he is doing eveything Bush did in gitmo including delaying habeas corpus indefinitely and military tribunals. Further Obama went to the Supreme Court and using all of the same arguments GWB used for gitmo and WON. The difference being apparantly the long term lease on gitmo suggests it’s defacto US territory. No so in Afghanistan. Actually when you look at the drone wolfpacks and other aggressive assassination techniques one can make the case Obama is more aggressive than GWB in killing muslims.

    Moreover the belief Obama ‘ended’ torture is pure scam. Bush has already changed our policies on waterboarding long ago via executive order. As you know those orders are only good if the President agrees. The next President was remove a prior executive order with a stroke of a pen and doesn’t even have to tell anyone. It’s nothing like legislation which has a difficult repeal process.

    Obama even kept the entire defense team and policies in place. How is the liberal historian going to deal with this. Obama and the libs for years berated GWB on his defense policiesand then upon getting the WH kept every one of them. How does the typical academic historian make the case GWBs poliices were poorly thought out or diminish them in any way then explain the liberals keeping every one. He’ll make an ass of himself.

  • jtg1977

    Invocation of Godwin’s law as well as being an Internet tough guy and an ersatz conservative whose vocabulary mostly consists of bumper sticker slogans. You’re really on a roll, groen.
    But, yeah, if anyone doesn’t agree with you, they’re just Obama-loving libs/socialists, right?

    Intellectual conservatism truly is dead, and groen here is further evidence of that.

  • jtg1977

    Ah, darn it, somebody beat me to it on the Godwin’s law thing.

  • rdw56

    “Kennedy is the very definition of a swing justice. He’s been siding more and more with the liberal block on the Court, and Kagan is perfectly suited to help keep him there.”

    He is a moderate conservative but mostly conservative and he has not been siding more with the liberal side. He and O’connor were both swing votes the prior decade with Oconnor less conservative, less consistent and less predictable. I think in one day she voted down an affirmative action plan in an undergraduate schools while siding with the majority and allowiing reverse discrimation in a lalw school. This kind of spastic logic made her impossible to predict. Kennedy is more conservative and more consistent. He is a reliable vote against affirmative action. Oconnor is why the Alito appiontment moved the court right. He replaced the whacky Oconnor. Roberts replaced a reliable conservative sotomayer and kagan reliable liberals. There is an outside chance souter and stevens were so liberal sotomayer and/or Kagan will be less liberal by comparison.

    So you are correct he is the swing vote but he is absolutely more reliably conservative and consistent than Oconnor and this court the best for Conservatives in 50 years.

    Kagan has no prayer of moving Kennedy. He was an appelate judge for 13 years and has been on this court for 22 years. At age 74 his legal philosophy is rather fully formed. He did write the opinion in Lawrence but it was a 6-3 vote. He also wrote the majority opinion in a 5-4 vote allowing the boy scout to ban gays. He reversed his decision on gitmo giving Obama the right to follow GWBs flargant disregard for Habeas corpus in Afghanistan. He’s for partial birth restrictions and some restrictions on the death penalty and he supported gun ownership as an individual right under the 2nd amendment. His decision in the capital punishment case in Louisanna was hardly a big deal. The death penalty is rarely assigned in cases where murder wasn’t committed. He’s also voted for banning the death penalty for minors or the mentally impaired. These are hardly major limitations.

    None of this changes the basic point and criticism of Obama’s appointees. They’re lightweights. Sotomayer is the definition of mediocrity and Kagan is the least accomplished appointee since WWII. Bush meanwhile hit two home runs. Roberts and Alito are brilliant justices.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “Your suggestion Reagan’s tax cuts sent unemployment up are nonsensical. Not even the dumbest of the dumb would make that connection.”

    What drove unemployment up and the economy down in 1982 were 20% interest rates as Reagan and Volckner were trying to bring inflation down from 10%. They succeeded.”
    .
    .
    rdw56
    .
    That was a situation called Stagflation. Outside of this inflation comes with very, very low unemployment and an overheated economy and unemployment comes with very low to zero inflation.
    .
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stagflation
    .
    Reagan’s tax cuts to big business and the wealthy brought money to the small spenders and, by cutting government services, took money away from the big spenders.
    .
    Spending by consumers (including businesses, households and government consuming goods and services) = jobs.
    .
    Reducing spending on the poor who spend the largest percent of their income = job losses.
    .
    Reducing taxes to the wealthy = small increases in jobs due to a small amount spent.
    .
    Hence, decreasing spending while decreasing taxes on the wealthy and businesses = job losses.
    .
    “Obama passed a stimulus package he promised would help growth and create jobs. It FAILED. Any moron can see it FAILED. You can create all of the alternate universes you like but in this one it FAILED. When voters go to the polls this November every single one of the will know it FAILED.”
    .
    Just like three people with buckets bailing out a boat that needs six people bailing out water to take out the water coming through the whole in the bottom, it did not do enough.
    .
    Economists do have evidence that the stimulus package created jobs:
    .
    “Mike Pickett, CEO of Onvia, a Seattle, Washington, firm that advises clients who may be looking to bid on contract work and tracks government contract spending, told CNN the stimulus so far is a mixed bag.

    Picket estimated “roughly $68 billion have actually reached contractors and subcontractors. We estimate that has delivered… or saved about 500,000 jobs.”

    “It looks like the majority of the remaining funds — some $200 billion — will leave Washington and reach contractors this year. And that should increase the jobs created or saved number to around 1.6 million. And I think that’s where it’ll cap.”"
    .
    http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/02/17/economic.stimulus.2010/index.html

  • xira666

    “Are you suggesting that Obama isn’t upholding the Bill of Rights?”
    .
    “I doubt you’d take my word for it so, tell you what. Make up a juicy bomb-plot email and send it to any Madrassa in Pakistan. Let us know how that works out (if we don’t hear from you, we’ll take that as a “no”).”
    .
    You are fking nuts. You think as a citizen of the US I have the right to practice or prosecute my own frigging war?
    .
    God almighty you are nuttier then the far right! You are absolutely a fruit cake!

    It’s simple. If the government isn’t monitoring every communication you make then they’d have no way of knowing that you emailed whatever to Pakistan.

    If they are watching every word that comes from your lips or fingers, then they’ll arrest you pronto. In spite of the constitution and the bill of rights which is supposed to protect us from searches without a warrant or cause.

    Really it’s people like you who make me ashamed to be an American. Yea, I have been trying to move to Canada for years. Nice place up there, good economy.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “They don’t have to pass much legislation. they only need to block Obama and if they win the house that’s a given.”
    .
    The Party of No, the newest Republican strategy has not yet been taken to the polls. We have yet to see what will happen, but, it does not sound like a winning strategy.
    .
    ” There will be at least 10 new GOP senators who will be ardent fiscal hawks”
    .
    Ten Republican wins in the Senate is, at best, optimistic among Republicans (or pessimistic among Democrats) to outright improbable.
    .
    http://www.electionprojection.com/index.php
    .
    .
    “Government motors will do as well here as it did n the Soviet Union.”
    .
    Really?
    .
    “At General Motors, sales of Chevrolet, Buick, GMC and Cadillac jumped 25% to 199,432 vehicles.

    The Buick and Cadillac brands were particularly robust, with both selling more than twice as many units last month compared with the same period a year ago.
    Reviewing GM’s Cruze

    The Wall Street Journal’s auto reviewer, Dan Neil, reviews GM’s new Cruze.

    It was the 10th straight month in which sales for GM’s brands were up as compared with the same month a year earlier. So far this year, sales for the four brands have risen 31%. The strength was broad-based, with everything from trucks to crossovers to sedans posting gains.

    “When we say we want to design, build and sell the world’s best vehicles, we’re not talking about just one vehicle, one brand or one month,” said Don Johnson, vice president of U.S. sales operations, in the sales report. “Our July results again reflect that each of our brands has contributed significantly to our gains.” ”
    .
    http://www.marketwatch.com/story/gm-sales-see-big-rebound-in-july-2010-08-03
    .
    The Soviet Volga is not doing as well;
    .
    “Volga production peaked at well over 100,000 units per year during the early-to-mid 1990s, then fell sharply due to Russia’s worsening economic crises, reaching just 56,000 cars in 2000. With a gradually reviving export network, the Volga has made progress on the road to recovery, with nearly 70,000 cars produced in 2004.”
    .
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volga_%28automobile%29#Current_status
    .
    It looks like you, once again, do not have the numbers right.

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    allthingsinana…what are the key attributes, in your opinion, that make the Left exactly like the Right? What is the essence of that equivalence?

  • michaelfury

    “He has done pretty much what he said he was going to do”

    Indeed.

    http://michaelfury.wordpress.com/2008/10/30/the-ones-who-attacked-us/

  • ricardo4max

    You lefties are a hoot!
    The so-called “news media” now being what it is, the propaganda arm of the far left aka Democrat Party / Obama Regime, you are unable to distinguish news from opinion. Matt Drudge posts links to “news” stories, although they are mostly written by the left wing state run media. Politico is just propaganda disguised as opinions, editorials, etc…
    Sure, Matt sometimes writes the “headlines” for his links but he doesn’t write the stories.
    apr2563, you lefties kill me. You pretend to be so intelligent but can’t even spell or use spell checker. “despicable.”

  • americanlgbexile

    >> He has pretty much done what he said he’d do.

    Yeah, I guess so, if by “pretty much,” you’re fine with leaving out the primary reason that I supported his campaign with my time and money:

    “I would, as president, make absolutely certain that all federal laws pertaining to married couples—benefits pertaining to married couples are conferred to people who—same sex couples who have civil unions as well.”

    –Barack Obama, appearing on Meet the Press with Tim Russert, Nov. 11, 2007.
    Transcript: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21738432/page/5/

    I am an American citizen, born & raised in Louisiana. My partner, however, is not a U.S. citizen, and exclusively because we are not of opposite sexes, I cannot sponsor him for permanent residency.

    Had Mr. Obama honored his own words, I might be able to live in my own country. Instead, he is struggling to minimize the coming losses of his party, and I am struggling to survive thousands of miles away from home in a developing country whose language I can barely speak.

    But that’s “pretty much” fine, right?

  • rdw56

    ” There will be at least 10 new GOP senators who will be ardent fiscal hawks”
    .
    Ten Republican wins in the Senate is, at best, optimistic among Republicans (or pessimistic among Democrats) to outright improbable.

    *************************************************************

    I said 10 new GOP Senators not GOP pickups. For example Portman of Ohio will be a staunch and articulate fiscal hawk and a leader of the movement to bring spending back in line with 2005, prior to the Pelosi / Reid Congress. Portman is replacing another republican.

  • http://optionjohn.wordpress.com optionjohn

    Obama is just offbase that is all. No need for commentary.

  • rdw56

    Really?
    .
    “At General Motors, sales of Chevrolet, Buick, GMC and Cadillac jumped 25% to 199,432 vehicles.

    The Buick and Cadillac brands were particularly robust, with both selling more than twice as many units last month compared with the same period a year ago.

    ************************************

    Yes, Really, GM has lost market share and jobs to it’s competitors it will never get back. The 25% jump is very nice but it’s off a pitifully low base and it’s not in the segments the goverment has shifted substantial investment towards seeking to make GM greener. Small cars and electric cars are duds. GM will never again be the company it was in 2005 and Michigan will continue to bleed population to the South where the auto jobs are relocating.

    There is a serious and rebalancing of the economy under the radar as low tax red states take jobs from high tax blue states. CA simply cannot compete with TX. TX is in a dramatically better fiscal position with a much lower tax structure and far more attractive to business. CA is a decade away from addressing it’s problems and will almost certainly have fewer jobs in 2020 than they do now. Michigan has at least 1M too many people for it’s job base. Long the leader in outward migration they will continue for the forseeable future.

    Interestingly early in his term Obama was set to present a plan to essentially bulldoze huge portions of dozens of Northern cities such as Flint and Detroit because they were essentially abandoned and grotesque eyesores. Granholm stupidly raised taxes and spending in a state already uncompetitive. Even dumber she invested much of the money in green investments like solar and wind. Michigan ain’t very sunny and businesses can’t afford to pay up for unreliable sources of electricity. Meanwhile Tennessee is moving forward on several nuclear power plants. If Granholm tried to destroy the Michigan economy she could not have done a better job.

    The good news here of course is Michigan will lost at least one house seat maybe two and they will go to Texas. CA and NY will lose as well.

  • allthingsinaname

    You both want purity! You both are crazy, immature, and self focused. You both are polarizing, and both are into self aggrandizement.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “You pretend to be so intelligent but can’t even spell or use spell checker. “despicable.”"
    .
    Kevin’s been ragging on you for months about how you use British spelling all of the time and you are eager to catch one spelling error.
    .
    This is a case in point about my thesis that wingnut propaganda is reading what Democrats said about Bush and then changing the name to Obama.
    .
    Bush: too many vacations most obviously during Katrina.
    .
    Wingnut claim: Obama, going on fewer vacations is accused of going on too many vacations.
    .
    Bush: obsessed with religion and “god telling him what to do”. In some situations if you say that you are hearing the voice of deity in your head you are placed in a mental institution.
    .
    Wingnut claim 1: Obama rigidly follows Rev Wright.
    .
    Failed to catch on.
    .
    Wingnut claim 2: Obama is a Muslim.
    .
    Bush: drove first three businesses handed to him by daddy into ground, did mediocre to poor job as Texas governor and far less qualified than Gore.
    .
    Wingnut claim: Obama has done nothing with his life except a year as a community organizer after law school in 1980s. Totally untrue.
    .
    Bush: PATRIOT Act passed unread hours after published such that no human being could read the whole thing.
    .
    Wingnut claim: HCR debated for over half a year has secrets in it and was passed too quickly.
    .
    Bush: violated constitution in Gitmo, signing statements and in PATRIOT act.
    .
    Wingnut claim: Obama’s tax incentive for HCR reform is against the constitution.
    .
    Bush: had extremely close ties to big oil, Haliburton and Eric Prince, trust fund billionaire founder of mercenary army Blackwater.
    .
    Wingnut claim: Obama owes debt to ACORN and SEIU and takes orders from community organizers and janitor’s union.
    .
    Bush: Demanded even discredited intelligence from CIA to create claim of Iraq having WMD to create lie to the public that we needed to invade Iraq and even that, despite bin Laden and Husein having death warrants on one another, that the two were together responsible for 9/11.
    .
    Wingnut claim: Obama is a liar about something, but never specific about what.
    .
    Bush: had AM radio and Fox News as free 24 hour a day advertising.
    .
    Wingnut claim: MSM is eager to promote Obama.
    .
    The only original claim about Obama is a bizarre conspiracy theory that he is somebody else and was not born in Hawaii despite making his birth certificate and school records public.
    .
    Now, Retardomax, please don’t start calling Kevin English because he called you English.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “I said 10 new GOP Senators not GOP pickups.”
    .
    Well, you can see how easy it is to misunderstand what you meant.
    .
    Still, without a majority and only the ability to filibuster, what good will it do to have uber conservatives who can not get anything passed?
    .
    All they could do is shout “no” more often and, perhaps more often.
    .
    How would that do anything other than make our country more divided along partisan lines?

  • killaw

    As a foreign right-leaning observer I really don’t see the deception of some democrats about the health care “public option”, among other, as purely ideological or as “phony populism”. It was just a surrender to special interests, to the anti-big gov/socialism (sic) propaganda, to the right side of the party or to those on the insurance industry payroll. Now I would rather blame the democrat congress than Obama for that.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    But it was not “government motors” when it lost market share 2005 and is “government motors” when it gained 25%.
    .
    Clearly you should re-read your argument.
    .
    Privately held 1908 until 2009: grew for decades and, due to poor management, crumpled for three decades.
    .
    Publicly owned 2009 – 2010: 25% increase.
    .
    Hence TARP II, implemented by Obama and distinctly different from Bush proposal is a success.

  • http://patricksartor.wordpress.com patricksartor

    “There is a serious and rebalancing of the economy under the radar as low tax red states take jobs from high tax blue states. CA simply cannot compete with TX. TX is in a dramatically better fiscal position with a much lower tax structure and far more attractive to business. CA is a decade away from addressing it’s problems and will almost certainly have fewer jobs in 2020 than they do now. Michigan has at least 1M too many people for it’s job base. Long the leader in outward migration they will continue for the forseeable future.”

    .
    http://www.dol.gov/opa/media/press/eta/ui/current.htm
    .
    “The highest insured unemployment rates in the week ending July 31 were in Puerto Rico (6.7 percent), Pennsylvania (4.8), New Jersey (4.6), Oregon (4.6), California (4.5), Alaska (4.3), Connecticut (4.3), Nevada (4.3), Rhode Island (4.1), and Wisconsin (4.1).

    The largest increases in initial claims for the week ending Aug. 7 were in California (+4,393), Indiana (+1,999), North Carolina (+1,895), Pennsylvania (+1,626), and Georgia (+1,458), while the largest decreases were in Wisconsin (-1,873), Puerto Rico (-1,014), New Jersey (-688), Utah (-503), and South Carolina (-291). ”
    .

    As you can see, there is no clear correlation between “Red” or “Blue” and unemployment.
    .
    You make the classic wingnut error believing that the only thing a business does at all is to not pay taxes.
    .
    Obviously, every business is, instead, concerned with a post-tax profit. So dark, dark red Alaska is not going to get NYC’s wall street four time zones away from NYC nor will it get Sunny California to move it’s movie studios up North to Alaska for zero to 24 hours of sunlight due to cheaper taxes.
    .
    Also, as much as taxes take away from a bottom line, good local government services such as good roads so that the employees do not break an axle in huge potholes or have good public transit back and forth to work, and good law enforcement so that you and your employees are not robbed and raped by criminals.
    .
    Your understanding of business is very weak.
    .
    Businesses look for: 1) a good market for people to buy their goods and services. 2) Among good markets, they look for a well qualified labor pool to choose from. Both 1 & 2 are attracted by good local government services among many, many factors. 3) of places with many people to sell to and many qualified workers, the one which charges the lowest taxes is chosen. However, if there are not many millionaires and wealthy tourists to buy from your five star restaurant nor many highly experienced employees in rural Alaska where taxes are low but many of both in high tax NYC, the restaurant will be located in NYC no matter how low the taxes get unless the state of Alaska starts paying them to hire people to stand there at the door and greet guests who are not there in rural Alaska.

  • Ivy_B

    Actually his nickname is Nino. Guess you don’t know his pals.

  • rdw56

    Partisanship is the biggest scam in the world. Of course we’re partisan. We believe in different things. I argue for my side and you argue for yours. We are partisan by design. That’s what democracy is.

    Polarizing is a very different thing and no one has been more polarizing as President than Barak Obama in part because he is relentlessly partisan but moreso because he is so extreme left. There are contributing factors such as his narcissistic temperment, incredibly thin skin, lack of relevant political experience and inability to mount a coherent communications regime. He’s a gaffe machine off the teleprompter and he keeps giving those empty campaign speeches. He’s been able to pass very significant legislation using legislative muscle but without ever getting majority support. He does not know how to convince. What may have been successful in a law lecture is counter-productive in governing. His one trick pony act of setting up ridiculous straw men works when speaking to law students required to kiss your ass but is insulting when changing healthcare or passing a stimulus package.

    The goal of the GOP after the election will 1st be to do no more damage. We’re going to see at least 40 house seats change parties and as many as 60 new house members ALL elected on a promise to get spending under control and to not raise taxes. Once business has some confidence the spending spree is over we’ll get more confidence and the economic recovery will gain strength. The key to lowering deficits is to freeze/lower spending and let the economy grow. Right now spending is too high by 10% so some cuts are necessary but once a freeze is passed and we get GDP growth > 3.5% we’ll get much faster growth in tax collections. If spending is limited to 1% growth and tax collections are growing 5% the deficit will shrink very quickly.

    Under GWB after the marginal rate tax cuts in June of 2003 we had 16 quarters of double digit growth in tax collections. Unfortunately George was liberal on spending. Had he held increases in the base budget to the inflation rate we would have had a surplus in 2006 and 2007.

    You see this at the state level. This is where the Democrats are in serious trouble because there is a sharp dicotomy in the fiscal health and economic projection of red states versus blue states. CA, MI and NY are fiscal basket cases. TX, VA and a dozen others have small budget surpluses and if they’re not adding jobs are at least stable. These are the states that are going to lead the recovery. VA has a fiscal conservative as governor determined to cap spending increases at the inflation and use any excess revenues for tax cuts and to restore their rainy day fund. VA already has a lower tax structure than MD as well as less debt.

    The mere fact Obama will not be able to pass more radical legislation will help the business environment. Steps NJ and VA have taken this last year to strengthen their fiscal heath has put them on the road to recovery. If we grow 2% the next 6 moths as predicted by Morgan Stanley VA might grow as much as 4%. If confidence is boosted by Obama losing the Congress GDP growth could move up to 3% – 4% and VA could grow 5%. McDonnell would have a large surplus and could pass some generous tax cuts putting even more pressure on MD to do the same.

    You can see how this plays out at the national level. We all know the stimulus failed. Keysian economics isn’t the answer. We can all see the failed states are the high tax states. While the tea party itself might not grow over 20% sentiment for lower spending will be over 65%. Reagan won this debate 30 years ago and Obama didn’t move the needle an inch his way.

    The GOP could have a record 30 governorships due just to running on a conservative fiscal policy. Ed Rendell is leaving office in PA with his lowest polls EVER due to his tax increases and deficits and we will elect a conservative GOP governor and Senator. Americans do not want their lives controlled by politicians. Obama never moved the debate. Now that his stimulus has failed he’s lost control permanently. The best he can do is what Clinton did and move to the center. Clinton embraced real spending cuts, welfare reform, free trade, harsher sentencing, etc., the things the majority supports.

    I don’t know about you but I think Obama would be miserable doing that and I doubt he even could. The GOP can’t nominate a dolt but if they get a decent candidate and they run on fiscal restraint Obama is going down. It’s what we want and he has zero credibility on the issue.

  • jeanclellandmorin

    Finally, someone with a “voice” that will be read that speaks for me and my support for Obama. But, I expected the sore-losers and Obama-haters to keep up with their vitriol. I’m a liberal (oops, I mean progressive. Didn’t mean to use a vulgar term) and I have seen what Obama has accomplished in the face of the Party-of-Obstruction and lack of Campaign Reform. And he’s done it without a Baguette Magique.// Jean Clelland-Morin

  • lbjack

    The hatred of Obama by the ranting right is so vicious and unhinged, that surely something else is at work. Implicit in all the lies and lunacy is rage by NASCAR America at being presided over by a “n—–”. They don’t come out and say it — in fact, anyone articulating it publicly is drummed out of the movement — but listen closely to the rants, and you can hear the code.
    .
    Obama and the Congress are doing what Americans have always complained that politicians won’t do — vote their conscience instead of whatever will get them re-elected. This happened to the Democratic 107th Congress under Clinton. The budget reform that ushered in a decade of prosperity also got that Congress replaced with the GOP, which proceeded to plunder the nation on behalf of their predatory patrons, culminating in six year of complete GOP rule, which brought on the worst worldwide financial meltdown in generations.
    .
    It took a decade and a World War for a Democratic president and filibuster-proof Democratic congresses to dig America out of the last great GOP pig-out. And now the dumbed-down, infantile, narcissistic American public, their greed harnessed by the GOP, expect Obama and Congress to undo the damage in only a couple of years?
    .
    NASCAR America’s rage is so depraved and obtuse, so seemingly willful, as to be accountable by only one thing. I have only seen this quality of hatred once before — in the Southern reaction to the civil rights movement of the 50s and early 60s. This is not a coincidence. Nor is it a coincidence that today’s GOP is dominated by Southerners. They may not talk the talk, but believe me, they haven’t changed. They’ve wised up. “Racist? Moi?
    .
    In theory, the right’s Obama-hatred is no more racist than the left’s Israel-hatred is anti-Semitic. But guess what? In fact, both usually are.
    .
    Democrats may be “depressed and disheartened,” but they are under no delusion: they realize that their moment is brief. They have done right by America and are wiling to take the consequences. Though perhaps prematurely, this president and congress evoke William Allen White’s words about Woodrow Wilson:
    .
    With calumny rampant around him, he tasted the ingratitude of his Republic — the statesman’s ancient cup of hemlock. No wonder that on the high and empty altar where the flame of his fame was quenched and the cold charred ashed were strewn, he lay helpless while the high priests of the temple cut out his heart.

  • rdw56

    I didn’t mention unemployment but if I did I’d use the unemployment rate rather than those collecting unemployment insurance. IN any even the 1st 5 you mentioned are blue states and 9 of the top 10 are blue states. That would be a very strong correlation.

    The problem is actually more insidious due to a surge of tax increases this decade by mostly, but not all, liberal governors. California is a train wreck for a number of reasons and the fact their income and other tax rates are so much higher than their neighbors and other large states such as Texas CA simply cannot compete for new business. Right now the gap between low tax states and high tax states is the widest it’s ever been. Further this carries into electric generation where blue states tend to be far more restrictive regarding low cost coal and nuclear while supporting very expensive green technologies such as wind and solar witch put a competitive burden on business.

    This is the 1st census where CA is expected to lose population and a house seat. I think it was 18 months ago Texas passed CA in total employment. CA is long past it’s days as the Golden State. While Arnold is a republican he is not a conservative and was unable to get his fiscal policy passed in the house.

    BTW: did you choose unemployment insurance because it leaves off the biggest economic disaster of all, Michigan? Cherry picking data is the most obvious of frauds. The bottom line is long term blue states such as CA, MI and NY are hosed because they haven’t bottomed yet and haven’t begun to address their issues. NJ was in as bad shape but christie is cutting spending and promises to cut taxes when he gets surpluses.

  • rdw56

    “Also, as much as taxes take away from a bottom line, good local government services such as good roads so that the employees do not break an axle in huge potholes or have good public transit back and forth to work, and good law enforcement so that you and your employees are not robbed and raped by criminals’

    You state the obvious in terms of the ideal but if you are suggesting the roads in very highly taxed NJ are better than in much lower taxed PA or VA you are out of your mind. Generally speaking services provided by long term unionized employees are very expensive and very poor. The South has a huge edge is costs.

  • http://www.bpvrm.net/blog bpvrm

    Actually, if you look at the average ratings of the last 12 presidents, Obama follows a pretty similar trend. It’s the battle of high expectations versus actual governing. Not everyone will be happy. BTW – Reagan’s approval rating followed a pretty similar trend after ~550 days. G.W. Bush was following a similar trend until 9/11. Clinton followed a pretty similar trend for ~550 days, with the exception of a pretty big dip and recovery from 100-250 days.

    In any event, not out of the norm, for presidents from either side. Hardly “plummeting”.

    Interestingly enough, out of the last 4 Presidents prior to Obama, they all ended up about 5% points within where they began, with Clinton being the closest (1% point) and Bush I the furthest (5% points). Ford and Carter were well outside the 5%, and Nixon only 2% points lower when he resigned versus when he started.

    My point: presidential terms are too long to track day-to-day, or even quarter-to-quarter Job Approval ratings.

    http://www.gallup.com/poll/124922/Presidential-Approval-Center.aspx

  • rdw56

    “But it was not “government motors” when it lost market share 2005 and is “government motors” when it gained 25%.”

    That would explain why CEO Ed Whitacre explained he wants to do an IPO ASAP because the tag ‘Government Motors’ is harming sales. A large part of the population will not buy cars off the govt.

    The 25% number is bogus because the base period was a deep depression. In fact 25% is not impressive.

    As far as Tarp I versus Tarp II as I explained before you are way too deeply into the weeds. Obama’s success as an economic manager will come down to GDP and Jobs as they are reported by the govt not the fertile geewiz minds of liberal hacks. Morgan Stanley lowered it’s growth projections to an anemic 2% and that was before todays pitiful housing report. Jobless claims have moved to higher levels recently. There are real fears of a double dip recession. The stimulus has clearly been a total failure. There is absolutely no chance this economy will turn positive before the election.

    BTW: Blunt had pulled ahead of Carnahan 51% to 40% and Rossi ahead of Murray 52% to 45%. The GOP is almost certain to get at least 7 pickups and a very solid conservative block of 40 for an iron clad filibuster. This will free up Scott Brown and the Maine twins to go against the GOP as necessary to keep their electability high.

  • rdw56

    Lbjack,

    Are you an academic? A wee bit melodramatic don’t you think?

    It is interesting you cite Wilson when he’s taken such a beating the last decade with the propaganda we were fed in school being replaced by real history. I am 56 and it was only a few years ago I found out Wilson was an avowed racist and it was his administration that resegregated the post office and much of govt.

    Jonah Golberg of the National Review wrote a NYTs bestseller called ‘Liberal Fascism’ in order to correct what had been the narrative of the Wilsonian era regarding the relationship of fascism with communism and socialism. Jonah wanted to correct the notion that fascism belongs on the right. It’s pretty obvious when you think about it. Conservatives are small govt, classical liberals. Fascism is one of the totalitarian systems and belongs squarely on the left. IN fact many progressives were supporters of fascism including HG Wells who coined the term, ‘liberal fascism’

    I have to admit I am still shocked at how boldly fraudalent our history text books had been on Wilson, Hoover and the New Deal. Fortunately with the explosion of the internet and ease of fact checking academic historians can’t get away with that nonsense. The most pleasing part of the debate over the book was how many liberal pundits admitted they knew Wilson was a racist and refused to defend him. How ironic that in 2010 racism has become so repulsive the hero of the progressive era is reviled. No self respecting liberal/progressive can defend Wilson in public. It partially explains why when these rankings of the Presidents come out Wilson is falling so far.

    It was always absurd he was ranked in the top 5. He efforts to force a peace agreement in 1919 were disasterous for the world and that alone makes him a bottom 10 President. His support for the League of Nations was also greatly embellished in the History books but today is recognized as bad policy and really bad politicking. As it becomes more widely known he was our most racist President, and it will, he will become reviled.

    it’s also interesting to me how the spin on the New Deal has shifted from having ended the depression to having extended it and how Hoover created the depression following conservative policies to the precise opposite. George Will and Robert Reich has a great exchange on ThisWeek on Hoover, Robert turned purple when George explained that Hoover doubled federal spending in less than 4 years and that FDR in 1932 ran on balancing the budget.

    It’s always fascinating how technological developments take us to places we never anticipated. The internet has democratized data and taken it out of the control of academics. When they get away from the facts there’s always someone who knows more than they do ready to embarrass them.

  • dsb10

    Dems Depressed and Disheartened:

    Joe, I get it. You’re not feeling warm and fuzzy about every one in the Democratic Party, but you’ve always known that the Party lacks certain types of commonality, so why complain now? The house has always been divided. But ask yourself this, does your article make things better or worse?

    You refer to “Simpletons” who eat “Pork Rinds,” which in the days of Moses, might have been described as “Uncircumcised Heathens.”

    But as you know, not all white Christians who are simpletons eat pork rinds, and your article insults many Democrats whose support is badly needed, so consider the idea that “breaking-bread” is the better course, even though there are those who do not understand every thing.

  • http://deepnation.wordpress.com DeepNation

    “[Obama's] achievements are historic. But he hasn’t wrapped them up in an ideological bumper sticker–or provided some neat way for the public to understand it.”

    And as a result, Democrats will likely lose control Congress and Obama’s administration will be virtually powerless and lifeless for the rest of Obama’s presidency.

  • dnha14

    The guy passed health care, (that a majority of Americans did not want or need and will cost individuals a whole lot of money)

    a stimulus bill that helped avoid a Depression, (the jury is still way out on that. Anyone read the latest housing and employment news? It ain’t pretty. I hope not, but this Depression may still be on the horizon. I don’t think we can count on Keynesian thought as FDR did to pull us out of this. It didn’t work for FDR.)

    a groundbreaking financial reform bill that is too complicated to be popularly described, (and didn’t include any reforms for arguably the worst of the worst, Fanny and Freddie. All those that think the banks and credit companies won’t find a way to recoup the fees the law took away, please raise your hands, I have some swampland to sell. And we ain’t stupid, please try to explain it and give us a chance.)

    a bailout that enabled General Motors and Chrysler to survive(at the expense of the actual bond holders in a way that sent bankrupcy back on its butt for the next decade. I’d still like to see the legalities of that move heard by the Supreme Court, but…)

    He nominated two estimable women to the Supreme Court (that will make sure the illegal nature of the GM bailout will become settled law. That might be the best we can expect from these two.)

    He restored America’s image in the world. (I didn’t realize our image was that bad, except maybe in the muslim world and if that is the case I’d like to keep it that way. With friends like that…)

  • xiaodre

    Certainly achieved alot for corporate earth.
    The writing was on the wall when he backed FISA immunity for the telecoms during his campaign.

    He delivered every citizen to the health insurance industry (by the way, insurance companies are still denying people because of pre-existing conditions, today and tomorrow).

    He helped the biggest banks without giving them any order to take writedowns or mandatory mortgage redos or help customers in any way, shape or form, and was shocked when they didn’t help their customers, and instead decided they could now weather the storm.

    He bailed out some (the biggest), and left most to twist in the wind – especially the local and regional banks and most local and regional businesses.

    The new student loan stuff is a joke, considering what is going on with tuitions in higher ed.

    And through all this, helping and helping and helping the corporate juggernauts of America without consideration for the folk (except that old claim – what’s good for business is good for Americans in general), you suppose the left is disappointed in Barack Obama for little or no reason?

    Hmmm…I wonder if they are going to come out and vote this year…

  • fatside

    “Oh, please?” WTF, r u queer or what?

    Obama, the Muslim, hasn’t done anything for us. Let’s see, he socialized the auto industry.

    It is suppose to be good because he nominated two women to the supreme court. R u joking? R we going to nominate people because of their sex?

    What a bad joke.

  • http://gensmahaut.wordpress.com gensmahaut

    Obama’s approval remains quite strong outside of the US. Within the US, his approval remains quite strong among nonwhites. The big drop has come among whites who previously approved of Obama, particularly working class and lower middle class types who preferred Hillary in the primaries.

  • jshaver001

    Dems are depressed and in disarray because of two things:

    1. Obama, regardless, Joe, of what you think he has accomplished, finds the country MUCH WORSE OFF than what he promised it would be if he were elected. Blaming Bush worked for awhile but that excuse has lost its luster.

    2. The rest of the population, which is everyone but the Obama true believers, has not bought and is not buying whatever it is that Obama is selling They don’t want any of the wonderfulness to which you allude in your hand-wringing and whiny article. The fact is that people like you and other Dem activists just can’t wait to “fix” what’s wrong with America. Americans, on the other hand, who are rightfully distrustful of you and members of the political class like you, don’t want you and yours fixing anything. They know that you and others like you, including the precious one, Obama, are incompetent, JUST LIKE BUSH WAS, for crying out loud.

    Get a grip, Joe. People are not just unhappy about Obama. They are fed up with the lying, spinning, self-serving, conniving, manipulating, dishonest, arrogant, elitist politicians that continue to enrich and aggrandize themselves at the expense of the country and its ordinary people who can’t spend every waking moment keeping track of the corrupt and craven behavior of these people.

    Get it now?

  • http://flyingspur13.wordpress.com flyingspur13

    Joel Klein should be writing for Comedy Central!

  • gspeye

    Mr Klein

    I see that like Chris Matthews you have chills running up your leg while your head is buried in the sand. Mr Obama is the worst President in my life time and I was alive when FDR was President. I am a Democrat but not a Progressive so I am what you call a moderate. I have been in the Democratic Party since JFK but I am contemplating turning Independent, because the Democratic Party has been hijacked by the likes of you…. who by the way, is less then truthful and more of a propagandist then a journalist. You must have a heard of sheep following you if it this is what you call an honest assessment of Mr. Obama’s Presidency. Do you believe anyone with even a partial brain could take you seriously? Oh BTW are you not the one who suggested that the MSMedia call anyone who opposes your collective dribble a racists, even if it was not true? Get real.

  • toby928

    RCP Average: Right Track 31.5% Wrong Track 61.3%

    November will be epic.

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