UPDATE: About That Individual Mandate Lawsuit…

I guess with all the Constitutionally valid convictions to uphold the said Constitution to allow for the building of a Mosque near ground zero, we shall also see equally as much from the liberal left that passing legislation to MANDATE healthcare is also equally UNCONSTITUTIONAL. Yes?

Oh and while we are at it, let’s also talk about the other First Amendment right of Freedom of Speech.
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It seems that Congresswoman Bean, at an Illinois town hall, Rep. Melissa Bean, House Democrat (IL-8) hired thugs to intimidate citizens trying to get their questions answered:
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Now THAT is some good Liberal Constitutional respect for this great document. Don’t you think?
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Also if you wait to see the video posted above in its entirety, you shall see how fast Congresswoman Bean literally RUNS to get to her car to avoid answering the question of whether or not the Individual Mandate is constitutional or not. Priceless indeed!!!!

It’s funny how all these conservative governors who vowed not to take stimulus money and other federal aid are now eager to accept as much as possible now that the glare of the media lights are off them. Rick Perry who hinted at succession greeted Obama was open arms during Obama’s recent visit to Texas…and asked for money. Mark Sanford just took a bunch of stimulus money after making a big stink a few months ago. And now McConnell wants help.
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Geez, all that posturing and so quickly palms go out. Thought they were standing by conservative principles.

I think you meant “secession,” nibbly.
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I’m still puzzling over Rusty’s first post, in which he seems to say that if liberals favor freedom of religion for the Islamic Center, they should also favor freedom for all from the health-care mandate — the alternative being that they are hypocrites. It seems to me that two wildly different legal issues are involved, but what do I know? I only had a single full-year course in con law while in law school, and that was a long time ago.
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Maybe we could get a professor of constitutional law to give us an explanation. How about that Obama fella in Chicago? What ever happened to him, anyway?

Nah, you got that wrong yet again, nibbles. They have to take the money now because the economy is so far in the ditch they do not have a choice in the matter.
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Since Obambi has taken office, not only has unemployment for the past TWO YEARS gotten worse, it has exceeded all expectations of how bad it is. What is Obama’s solution???
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BLAME IT ON BUSH
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Anyone want to take a stab at when we simply stop blaming Bush and actually do something to make it better? Anyone??

Newfreedom, I agree with you to an extent…There certainly are problems with the government mandating that every person purchase health insurance from a private, for profit company. That’s why I was so in favor of a public option. But that was just far too liberal an idea for President Obama, the conservadems and even some blue dog dems.
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All we ended up with were some new, extremely loose regulations full of loops holes. What will happen when the law goes fully into effect nobody really knows, but I suspect without the public option, the mandate won’t work, because one major reason some people go without insurance is the cost and the law as written is not going to make premiums or co-payments or deductibles any more affordable.

Oh just take those liberal rose colored glasses off that Barney Frank gave you bobell, and you shall see clearly and exactly what I meant by it.
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Constitutional law is not rocket science. Anyone with half a brain who can read understands it.

Well thank you erie, there is hope for some of you after all. Congrats!!

And here is another surprise. If we only had the choice between what we have been given by Nancy, Harry and Barack with the current cluster-F$ck called “Healthcare Reform”, I would have liked Universal Healthcare offered only through the Government as opposed to this mess.
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But I am optimistic, I believe once all of this is repealed by the new House and Senate. We can then enact sane and sensible healthcare reform legislation with the appropriate mix of regulations so that the price of health care is brought more in-line with other countries. In particular the Japanese model.

Come on, Swampland. The fact that Virginia’s governor is forming a council to see to it that health reform is implemented successfully while also pursuing a lawsuit against the individual mandate is a non-story. It’s not a conflict; it’s decent leadership!

Unlike his colleagues on the national level, McDonnell isn’t trying to sabotage the opposition’s initiatives just because he disagrees with them; he’s trying to see to it that if the lawsuit fails, his constituents still benefit.

This is a stark contrast to several national-level Republicans who say that if they can’t repeal health reform, they’re going to “defund it” by cutting off money (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0810/40536.html). This is both petulant and sets a terrible precedent for our country. Can you imagine a future when every single time Congress switches party control, they sabotage everything the last party did? Our Federal government would be even more ineffective than it already is!

Whatever your position on health reform, I still praise Gov. McDonnell for his maturity, and wish more of his fellow Republicans in DC had a similar attitude.

Nah, you got that wrong yet again, nibbles. They have to take the money now because the economy is so far in the ditch they do not have a choice in the matter.

So Repub “principles” are so tenuous and fleeting that they can be easily bought or sold and they change with the economic winds, huh? That’s some classic stuff right there rustyblogwhore.
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Priceless.

Geez, Rusty, the economy’s been in a ditch since 2008 but didn’t stop the hooing and hawing by these punk governors. Remember when Clyburn was going to get the state legislators to override Sanford about taking the stimulus money because the poor of the state needed it? Of course, Sanford was occupied elsewhere and fudging his expense reports to pay for his trips to South America. But I digress.
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Did you see Rick Perry greeting Obama at the airport!!? I mean, he really wanted that money. I laughed.

Oh, and thanks bobell, I had a few typos in there.

What is the point of this article? Is it surprising that McConnell would prepare his state to implement the health care plan while he’s suing to stop it? What would happen if he didn’t prepare then lost the suit? Seems to me McConnell using some common sense.

“I would have liked Universal Healthcare offered only through the Government as opposed to this mess.”
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Well thank you Rusty, there is hope for some of you after all. Congrats!!

If HCR is settled law (and it is) why would he talk out of both sides of his mouth?
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‘Cause he’s a politician, that’s why.
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McDonnell (and McCollum down in FL) and other AGs/GOP governors are wasting tax dollars to what amounts to tilting windmills. They should concentrate on state readiness and drop the other fight ’cause they won’t win that one.

…McCollum

thought I spelled it wrong but I didn’t

Hey, Rusty (3.3) — When I don’t know what I’m talking about, even if it takes someone else to point it out, I usually own up. And given that I’m a much better bullsh!tter than you are — after all, i’m professionally trained — I recommend the same to you.
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And if you think anyone with half a brain can understand constitutional law, do you think I should ask for a tuition refund?

You missed this part of my quote as usual, momento.
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“If we only had the choice between what we have been given by Nancy, Harry and Barack with the current cluster-F$ck called “Healthcare Reform”,

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But, with you what else is new?

Passing laws is unconstitutional???

You take one step forward, Rusty, then two steps backwards.
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But, with you what else is new?

newfree, the level of hypocrisy shown by our liberal friends is quite remarkable. Nibbly, at her sanctimonious best, accuses conservatives of racism and hyperbole for questioning the location of Cordoba house, raising the constitutional issue to override sensible debate. On the other hand, MANDATING insurance is perfectly okay and how dare we question its constitutional correctness? Oh, the angst of offended liberals…it would truly be laughable if it were not so sad.

Rustydog:
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President Commemorates Eid al-Fitr
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Remarks by the President
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The Islamic Center of Washington, D.C.
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Washington, D.C.

2:25 P.M. EST

THE PRESIDENT: Thank you very much, sir. It’s good to be with you again. And it is my honor to visit the Islamic Center of Washington once again.

For half a century, this beautiful mosque has served as a place of worship for Muslims and has helped to advance understanding between people of different faiths. Millions of our fellow Americans practice the Muslim faith. They lead lives of honesty and justice and compassion.
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I am pleased to join you today in the celebration of Eid, the culmination of the Holy Month of Ramadan. I appreciate so very much Dr. Khouj, and I want to thank the other distinguished imam from the Washington, D.C. area. Thank you all for being here. And I enjoyed our visit. I also appreciate the Muslim schoolchildren who are here, telling me stories and reading poems and showing the art work. Please tell them thanks again for their hospitality.
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Islam traces its origins back to God’s call on Abraham. And Ramadan commemorates the revelation of God’s word in the Holy Koran to the prophet Mohammad — a word that is read and recited with special attention and reverence by Muslims during this season…
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…During Eid al-Fitr, Muslims celebrate the completion of their fast and the blessings of renewed faith that have come with it. Customs vary between countries — from illuminating lanterns in Egypt to lighting firecrackers in Pakistan, to inviting elders to traditional feasts in Niger. Around the world, families and neighbors and friends gather to share traditional foods, and congratulate each other on meeting the test of Ramadan.
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The spirit behind this holiday is a reminder that Islam brings hope and comfort to more than a billion people worldwide. Islam affirms God’s justice and insists on man’s moral responsibility. This holiday is also an occasion to remember that Islam gave birth to a rich civilization of learning that has benefitted mankind.
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Here in the United States our Muslim citizens are making many contributions in business, science and law, medicine and education, and in other fields. Muslim members of our Armed Forces and of my administration are serving their fellow Americans with distinction, upholding our nation’s ideals of liberty and justice in a world at peace. And in our Nation’s Capital, this center contributes greatly to our spiritual and cultural life.
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On behalf of Laura and our family and the American people, I bring our best wishes to all who worship here, and to Muslims throughout the world for a joyous Eid, and for health and happiness and prosperity in the year to come.
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Eid Mubarak. God bless.
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END 2:30 P.M. EST

Which President do you think that was, who commemorated “The Islamic Center of Washington, D.C.” with such a grand, pluralistic, deeply American speech that day, Rustydog?
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You didn’t vote for somebody like that, did you?

Good point, gilroys. I’ve update the post.

“…[S]everal national-level Republicans…say that if they can’t repeal health reform, they’re going to “defund it” by cutting off money…This is both petulant and sets a terrible precedent for our country. Can you imagine a future when every single time Congress switches party control, they sabotage everything the last party did? Our Federal government would be even more ineffective than it already is!”
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This pretty much sums up my feelings, yep.

“Constitutional law is not rocket science. Anyone with half a brain who can read understands it.”
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Obviously, it helps in thinking you can.

Kate — Brava!(5.1) That’s how it should be done. Perhaps Rusty (see 3.3, 3.7) can learn from your example.

Whoever or whatever the thing that calls itself newfreedomblog is unconstitutional and needs to get a real hobby and stop posting lameass comments on here.

On the other hand, MANDATING insurance is perfectly okay and how dare we question its constitutional correctness?
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Oh, you’re welcome to question its constitutionality, but you shouldn’t expect to get very far. The idea of an individual mandate is so uncontroversial in legal circles that even HCR opponents like Charles Grassley were saying last summer that “everyone accepts” the idea.
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The same goes for Rusty’s hysterical idea that HCR will be repealed. The polls are showing more and more people approving of the legislation, so it seems doubtful that Republicans will be able to muster the necessary two-thirds margin needed to override the certain veto that President Obama would put on any such repeal.
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But hey, don’t let those pesky facts stop you from wasting as much of your time and energy on this. The right seems to be specializing in windmill jousting these days — amend the 14th Amendment, repeal the 16th and 17th, etc. — so why should this be any different?

Wow, thank you! I’m very glad I could contribute!

Thanks so much to Kate Pickert for responding to commentary, and to gilroys for an excellent contribution.

Well played, stuart. Well played. ::golf clap::

He’s like rotten egg smell. He’s harmless so you put up with him

stuartzechman:
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Probably the same President who said this:
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“THE PRESIDENT: Good evening, and welcome. Over the past eight years, we have made the Iftaar dinner an annual tradition here at the White House. And I’m really glad we did. At this year’s gathering, we pay special tribute to the many contribution Muslim Americans have made to our nation. We join in wishing Muslims around the world, “Ramadan Mubarak.”
Mr. Prime Minister, welcome. We’re honored you’re in our midst. Congressman Keith Ellison, Congressman André Carson are with us. Members of the administration here tonight; members of the diplomatic corps — we are glad you’re here; my fellow citizens. Major, I’m looking forward to the blessing. Thank you for being here with us today.
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According to the teachings of Islam, Ramadan commemorates the revelation of God’s word in the Holy Koran to the prophet Mohammad. The word has become the foundation for one of the world’s great religions. Today more than a billion Muslims around the globe celebrate the month of Ramadan with daily fasting, heartfelt prayer, and acts of charity.
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During Ramadan, we are reminded of Islam’s long and distinguished history. Throughout the centuries, the Islamic world has been home to great centers of learning and culture. Muslim thinkers and scientists have advanced the frontiers of human knowledge. People of all faiths have benefited from the achievements of Muslims in fields from philosophy and poetry to mathematics and medicine.
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At the beginning of a new century, Muslims in the United States are continuing this proud tradition of innovation and invention. Tonight we honor members of the Muslim community who’ve risen to the top of their professions. Among our guests are individuals with wide-ranging accomplishments — from working on the Apollo Program, to pioneering advances in healthcare and medicine, to developing cutting-edge applications for the Internet.

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But what exactly is your point stuart. Are you attempting to say that someone like me, a conservative has no appreciation for those of the muslim faith? That all muslims are bad bad people? That someone like George Bush despite declaring war against the muslim terrorists, would then go to the trouble of inviting the muslim leadership within our own country to break bread with them?
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Well mr zechman, let me inform you right now that despite what you may read, what you may hear from people, we on the conservative side do not condemn all muslims for the acts of a few people who also hold their same faith and values.
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We do however question, and will remain skeptical of those who are from the muslim faith, who will not come out and denounce the types of groups who we know full well will not only commit acts of terrorism, and have also acted on those actions such as Hamas like Imam Rauf.
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We will also like I have investigate their past, to better understand where they are coming from and what they have professed in the past. Especially in the case of Imam Rauf whose own father was part of the Muslim Brotherhood. Now that may not make his Son, the Imam Rauf guilty of anything but association. But, I wouldn’t let my guard down a second so far as he is concerned. Call me paranoid, I would rather consider it to be prudent.
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Does that help, mr zechman?

Whatever a$$wipe, go crawl back into your far left liberal extremist hole in the ground.

nflfoghorn~
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Passing laws is unconstitutional???
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Really?
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The mere fact that a bill has passed legislative muster is in no way an indication that it is constitutional. That’s why we have a f*cking Supreme Court, to pass judgment on the admissibility of laws and policies. So, to answer your question, no, passing laws is not unconstitutional, but the laws that are passed very well may be, such as a government mandate that citizens purchase a product from a private company. My apologies if I’m coming off as a bit peeved, but I cannot stand nonsensical deflections such as yours. You know perfectly well that Rusty -as disasteful as I may find him to be- was not suggesting that passage of law is unconstitutional in itself.

…and while Rusty’s in a bad mood (y’mean he’s NOT that way 24/7? Guess he has to sleep sometime!) here’s some hopey-changey news about how “popular” Flox’s Miss Prissy has become. Oops.

http://jacksonville.com/news/politics/2010-08-17/story/venue-change-palin-appearance

Keep dreaming that dream, kevin, When the true ramifications of this bill strike home, the American public will be screaming bloody murder (and rightly so). For new patients, good luck on finding a doctor who will accept medicare. For old patients, be prepared to take a number and wait. For elective surgery, the wait may even be longer.

Rusty, in another thread you said, “Cordoba represents the initial invasion of arabs into what has been considered to be mostly first Roman lands after the fall of Rome, and what was subsequently Christian holdings.”
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“Do yourself a favor if you believe that the Cordoba House is not a non-violent attempt at the takeover of western countries.”
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So, when you later say, “we on the conservative side do not condemn all muslims for the acts of a few people who also hold their same faith and values” then who ARE you condemning? Only the “arab” ‘muslims”?
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“Call me paranoid…”
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You’re paranoid if you think Cordoba House represents a takeover of western countries. Unless you think the strip club that’s the same distance away is trying to take over western countries, too.

Here is a video of at least one, momento. Take the time and actually listen to her. Listen to what she says if you dare, then come back and talk to me. She is I am sure 1 of thousands of Muslims who understand what we on the conservative side are saying. That says mountains compared to people like YOU.
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To Exiled my GOP wannabe friend. Don’t do yourself any favors in coming to my aide. You are not only “as distasteful” to me as I am sure I am with you. Declare your independence from all things conservative Exiled. You are indeed a joke if there ever was one.
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“So Repub “principles” are so tenuous and fleeting that they can be easily bought or sold and they change with the economic winds, huh? That’s some classic stuff right there rustyblogwhore.”

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No a$$wipe (ladydiecash), it is due to the regulations, and all of the big Federal Government mandates the rest of you liberal loons have put on the States that they can no longer govern and make the necessary decisions for themselves. Handouts from the Federal Government are now a necessary evil to keep the State Governments from bankruptcy.
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Those are not “principles” they are indeed facts.

“The event is a fundraiser for Heroic Media, a faith-based non-profit group that helps women facing unexpected pregnancy. It is scheduled to start at 6 p.m. Thursday, Aug. 26.”

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Now I know Sarah Palin is not as popular to your left-tards as Obama is to your heart.
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But you think that because she is not in a 2,000 seat theater versus a 600 seat is an omen of her demise?
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Keep on wishin buddy boy. Keep on with that hopey-changey thing you have with your pal Obamanation.

Rusty, when will you realize that so many of the ill-conceived issues under your banner have nothing to do with political ideology? How is this issue a matter of liberal or conservative thought? It basically boils down to reason versus irrationality. As per usual, you’re on the wrong side of this human divide.

Yea Exiled, that is why well over 60, maybe as high as 70% of the folks just happen to be in agreement with me and NOT you.
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Enjoy your exiledness!!

Two possibilities.
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The first is that an early campaign to vilify the Cordoba House -as an imposing mosque being constructed on the still smoldering ashes of the WTC led by a jihadi sheikh- immediately brought forth connotations of an intentional provocation in the minds of the American public. As mentally lethargic and stubborn as our society is, few looked deeper to reveal the actually innocuous circumstances surrounding this community center, or, upon realizing such, held fast to now vocal statements against the construction lest they appear to have jumped to conclusions.
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The second possibility is that 60% of Americans demonstrate an eclectic mix of idiotic and morose bigotry.
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Take your pick.

Well one persons “bigotry” is another persons truth.
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Take your pick.

But one man’s terrorist is not another man’s freedom fighter?

When the true ramifications of this bill strike home, the American public will be screaming bloody murder (and rightly so). For new patients, good luck on finding a doctor who will accept medicare. For old patients, be prepared to take a number and wait. For elective surgery, the wait may even be longer.
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You know why I don’t agree? Because we’ve heard the exact same dire predictions from conservatives with every liberal legislative accomplishment. Every time we accomplish something, you all predict the public will rise up and reject it.
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Remember Ronald Reagan’s prediction about Medicare in the early 1960s?
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We do not want socialized medicine…behind it will come other government programs that will invade every area of freedom as we have known it in this country until one day as Norman Thomas said we will wake to find that we have socialism…We are going to spend our sunset years telling our children and our children’s children, what it once was like in America when men were free.

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According to Reagan, Medicare was going to lead federal officials to dictate where physicians could practice medicine, and open the door to government control over where Americans were allowed to live. Reagan warned that if Medicare became law, there was a distinct possibility that the federal government would control where Americans go and what they do for a living.
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Sounds just like your hand-wringing here.
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And here’s what Republicans said when Social Security was being moved through Congress in 1935:
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Title II provides for compulsory old age annuities, and title VIII provides the method by which the money is to be raised to meet the expense thereof. These two titles are interdependent, and neither is of any consequence without the other. Neither of them has relation to any other substantive title of the bill. Neither is constitutional. Therein lies one of the reasons for our opposition to them. The Federal Government has no power to impose this system upon private industry. … These titles impose a crushing burden upon industry and upon labor. They establish a bureaucracy in the field of insurance in competition with private business. They destroy old age retirement systems set up by private industries, which in most instances provide more liberal benefits than are contemplated under title II.

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The mandates in the bill are unconstitutional? Sounds just like Rusty here insisting the Supreme Court will strike down the Affordable Care Act. The bill will cripple business? Standard conservative complaint for anything.
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Seriously, feel free to keep predicting the American people will rise up in anger against the latest liberal accomplishment. It’s one of conservatism’s oldest traditions, and I’d hate to see you stop it now.

gilroys: You are correct that Gov. McDonnell is prudent to allow for contingencies.
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Sadly, though, too many elected officials use this tactic to “have it both ways.” These days, it seems to be a common GOP game plan.
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Last year, our very own US Rep, Mike Rogers (R-MI-8), did exactly this by voting against the Stimulus Bill into which he had inserted ~$30M worth of earmarks(!). The local rag lauded him on Page 1 for “Bringing Home the Bacon”….

That’s the ignorant rustybloghwhore we all know so well.
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So first the economy was in the dumper when these idiot repubs said they wouldn’t take the stimulus money due to their principles but now you contend that it’s regulations and their states own budgetary problems that causes your repub heroes to become hypocrites yet again. You can spin it any way you want to but it’s still bullsh!t.

Rustydog:
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“Well mr zechman, let me inform you right now that despite what you may read, what you may hear from people, we on the conservative side do not condemn all muslims for the acts of a few people who also hold their same faith”
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Well, that’s a relief!
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I thought that, when I may have read things like
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“to allow for the building of a Mosque near ground zero”
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that meant all mosques, but now I understand that you would have no problem if 50 mosques went up downtown, just as long as this particular imam wasn’t doing it.
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That’s funny, because I was thinking the whole time that you were making some kind of statement about the inappropriateness of any mosque or any Islamic cultural center going up anywhere near the mass graves of Americans murdered on 9/11, but now that I know it’s just this specific one, I have a completely new understanding of your side of the issue.
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So, I suppose that, if another Muslim cleric were to take over the building of the 51 project/Cordoba House tomorrow, you’d be jumping for joy. Since that very well may happen, I’ll look forward to your relief and happiness at the announcement. Same mosque, different guy, Ground Zero, 9/11, you’re perfectly happy about it. Good to know.
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Thanks for clarifying!

@rusty: Just because 60%-70% of the people POLLED are in agreement doesn’t mean they are right. Polled is the operative word. I’ve never been involved in a political poll, except the elections in which I’ve voted since turning 18—every single election for 30 years.

Gee, Rusty, I would loved universal health care offered only the federal government, too. You do know what that’s called don’t you? Its socialized medicine.
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There is help for you afterall.

As stated previously, keep dreaming, kevin. When and if this bill is implemented, the American public will be outraged at the inconveniences it will create. If we stop accepting new medicare patients, the backlog will overwhelm the system and chaos will prevail. Just how quickly do you think repeal would follow? Democrats thumbed their noses at us when they jammed this monstrosity through….well guess what? We have the ability to make them pay and pay dearly. If you voted for this bill, it could well be your ticket OUT of office.

You are right, erie, it would require socializing the entire health care system and I would LOVE to have the public vote on that probability.

“Yea Exiled, that is why well over 60, maybe as high as 70% of the folks just happen to be in agreement with me and NOT you.
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Enjoy your exiledness!!”
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Well having a majority does not mean what you profess is moral or just, does it Rusty? Because if it does then the Democrats for the last couple of years must be the moral or just party.
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Just a Thought, Rusty.

As I said, Earl, you’re part of a long and undistinguished line of conservatives who predicted that “once this law is implemented and people see what’s in it, they’ll rise up in outrage!”
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They said it about Social Security and they said it about Medicare, and they were laughably wrong both times. Third time’s the charm?

But you think that because she is not in a 2,000 seat theater versus a 600 seat is an omen of her demise?
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I hope not. She’s doing an excellent job of leading the Republican Party down the path to extinction.

Yeh Kevin – the Pied Piper of Wasilla. Eeesh.