UPDATE: Public Option Smoke Signals

For a PO to get to this point is fairly significant given that so many senators said it was as non-starter…that is, until they read the polls.

It’s amazing there’s any WH effort to preserve a laughable illusion of bipartisanship by caving to a single GOP senator on a point that would seriously erode – if not demolish – the benefits of HCR. Better to leave Snowe out in the cold, pass a reform bill that actually has the prospects of restraining costs, and let every single Republican say “No” yet again.

Snowe’s “trigger” is lousy policy and worse politics. Let her self-identify with the likes of Inhofe and Bachmann, and see how that goes over in Maine.

So the PO is still alive. Is the opt-out the choice de jour or the most likely to pass – for real or just for now? (Remember the exchanges? It’s not quite “Remember the Maine”.) Would any red meat state really have the cojones to opt out, even with nearly states still facing unemployment and foreclosures? Perhaps ones such as Alabama, Idaho, or even ….sorry KT, really, forgive me… Texas? I remember Gov. Perry’s harsh words implying an opt-out …of the US. But if I remember, does TX still have the right to carve up herself into multiple states? Thoughts, KT?

I think it’s a combination of things. The PO has always polled well, as we’ve noted in this space. But it has recently gotten some good scores from CBO (and, therefore, some cred with moderates). I also think the insurance industry overreached with that report a few weeks back. Finally, there has been a new spate of horror stories of people having insurance denied for ridiculous reasons–baby too big, baby too small, because, in one case, a woman was a rape victim.
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All that said, things remain very dicey in the Senate. Moderate Dems are going to vote with Reid on the “motion to proceed,” which gets the bill on the floor, but it is still unclear whether they will vote with him on cloture, which is what it would take to get the bill OFF the Senate floor.

Decon: See my earlier comment, which must have crossed in the electrons with yours. And, no, I can’t imagine any state actually opting out.

Around here we analyze such questions with another question: They shoot doctors, don’t they?

KT, you might want to recalibrate your imagination.

…thanks, KT. You’re right; we must’ve been typing at the same time but you were first. I think you also type faster.

Not even the reddest state will opt out and if/when a public option is voted on it will pass. Easily.

The real hurdle is cloture.

KT-You really can’t imagine any state actually opting out? Well, maybe you are right, but there will be states that do their best to screw it up as much as possible, complain at the same time while take credit for the sucessful parts at every opportunity. Just like the stimulus bill.

KT,
Here are a couple of quick points:
1. This is health insurance reform, not health care reform. Health care reform is going to be a long term issue.
2. If the PO costs the states any money at all, there is a good chance states will opt out. Up here in NH, the state has no sustainable revenue. Adding another expense wil not fly.

Karen, employees are already finding new insurance contracts are rising and in the case of my daughter no choice this year. They have always had two before.

The conservative Senators, and House Republicans plus Snowe are the only ones worried about a level playing field for the Insurance Companies.

“1. This is health insurance reform, not health care reform. Health care reform is going to be a long term issue.”
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There is still the issue of being able to afford health insurance and not being able to afford health care.
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With insurance out of pocket expenses can also put you in the poor house.

OT, but oh, WTF, wow …KT, I just read your tweets and found windycitywatch’s rightfully upset tweet about RNC facebook fan post with racist anti-obama poster. I hope you’ll grill the RNC on this and post here with some scoop on who / where / what / wtf. Someone screen grab this before it’s pulled; other than WTF, there are no words….

progress: not sure why it would cost the states money, considering it would be paid for by beneficiaries premiums and federal subsidies. (there’s a misconception out there that it would be free; it wouldn’t) it is medicaid that costs the states money.

Maybe at the same time Karen T. You can ask Obama for another teaching moment of the race peddling of Sharpton and Jackson.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/21/megan-williams-of-west-vi_n_328934.html

Not likely since it doesn’t fit neatly into the liberal presses view of racism in this country.

RNC was unaware of that “fan photo.” Press shop was appropriately horrified, and it was taken down.

KT:

Should I assume the President is still out golfing?

I think the big picture is being missed. For decades the Congress has been the Broken Branch of our Government. Since at least 1995 (and possibly before) Congress has done very little legislating as an independent and co-equal branch of our government. Mostly, the House and Senate have stepped in lock-step with Leadership (the Gingrich/DeLay era) or rubber stamped the wishes of the President (the Bush era). The ability of various committees and members to craft legislation and learn to work together has been lost.

One Thing that is clear about the HRC debate is that Congress is being forced to relearn this skill. It is messy and unfamiliar territory to anybody who does not remember what a functioning Congress looked like. Most Reporters, staffers and Members have never covered or been part of a functional legislative process. The measurement for Legislative success over the last 15 years or so has been: are they doing or not doing exactly what Leadership and/or the President wants them to do. The current HCR debate can not be measured by that yardstick. This time success will be measure by how well or how poorly Congress crafts Legislation.

President Obama has given the Legislative Branch his goals and preferences for legislation. He has not given them marching orders–and that is a good thing for our Democracy. Congress will have to sort out the details themselves. It is called Legislation and I for one am glad that this branch of Government is beginning to act like a co-equal part of the Government again. It is also good that President Obama refuses to give into the temptation to tell them exactly what to do. This tough love for the broken branch is way overdue.

Regardless of the HCR debate this is a good thing.

Cheers

Thanks, KT! You rock. The RNC poster is gone. Are you already getting calls, emails, and tweets for interviews? The power of media starletdom. Use it. Can you have your agent get you a guest spot on “Heroes”? Perhaps as an intrepid reporter who helps bring down an evil media mogul bent on world domination? …which means a remake of Bond flick “Tomorrow Never Dies” (that’s the one with Teri Hatcher in a low-cut little black dress, but she dies at the hands of her evil husband …Michelle Yeoh was the Bond Girl).

This thing where an ad floats right over the text you are trying to read has got to go. I’d love to read Swampland but they aren’t making it easy.

The answer is quite simple and it applies to both parties: Their only interest is in getting and maintaining power which means getting elected again. To do that they all need to spend money (of the taxpayers) to buy votes.

PS Gingrich was leader during the Clinton administration not Bush.

Opt-out is a perfect compromise. Republicans and “moderate” Dems can promise that their states will opt out. Then later, they can take credit for a popular program while enthusiastically opting in. Much like the stimulus package.

The WH is still dancing around the issue. The WH is obsessed with Snowe and keeps signaling that it expects something less and will live with it. How is that showing support for the PO? It isn’t. It showing support for Snowe, not the PO.

So Fox News lies but your strategy would be ??? What? Casual misinformation?

I think it’s great.
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States’ rights and the public option.
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Then, instead of having someone like freetopee presenting opinions as facts, all one would need to do is for one governor to look into his neighbors’ yard and see how well his grass is growing!
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That way, FOXworld can remain the virtual reality of ignorant people everywhere, and states would actually have real information to go by when charting the course for health care reform in their states.
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Canada’s while somewhat different, is administered by individual provinces, and all one needs to do to measure the efficacy of any solution is simply to look at other states who’ve done it.

No going to mention the hundred million the HCIC’s have poured into the coffers of your peers, are you, freetopeeintothewind?
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Keep that “casual disinformation” flowing…

I find the suggestion that the CBO scoring affected the recent change in political climate to be, frankly, absurd.
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I can’t think of a legitimate — i.e. non-”in-the-pocket-of-insurance-carriers” — reason for being willing to filibuster the PO. Prefer another system? Sure. Filibuster? No way.

The most plausible reason that has been floated for opposing the PO is that it would unfairly compete with the private carriers’ plans and drive them out of business. But in order for that to occur it would require that the PO be more efficient that plans offered by private carriers. Since Obama promised that a PO wouldn’t be subsidized, anyone who feared a PO must have assumed that the CBO scoring would be AT LEAST as favorable as what has been released.

“I also think the insurance industry overreached with that report a few weeks back. Finally, there has been a new spate of horror stories of people having insurance denied for ridiculous reasons–baby too big, baby too small, because, in one case, a woman was a rape victim.”
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Anything that highlights the rottenness of the insurance companies and the current systems certainly ratchets up public anxiety for a solution but, as you say, the public option has always polled well. So it may be just as simple as nflfoghorn suggests: Democrats, particularly “conservative” Dems, are coming to realize what will happen to them if manifestly good reform isn’t enacted and (as Dr. Dean says) the PO is the only thing that will work. A mandate without a PO, or some other failed effort will spell the end for a lot of conservadems, period.
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They only question now is whether any of them will be willing to tank decent reform – and the party – in exchange for some future reward from industry.

IQ 35:

Hard to believe but you got dumber.

You are right no lobbyist money from unions and left wing nut job groups has ended up in liberal Dems pockets.

Talk about your casual disinformation.

You are dumber than a bag of rocks

Once one chooses not to view the debate through the distorted lens of Village CW, everything makes a lot more sense.

For about 20 years, the corporate wing of the Democratic Party has fantasized about stealing all the big-business cash that was flowing into the GOP’s coffers. Sure there were plenty of corrupt Democrats before then, but they were corrupt on an individual, pragmatic level. They didn’t fetishize kow-towing to corporate interests the way the DLC-ers and their progeny do.

There is only one hitch. Unlike the GOP, which openly embraces corporatism as a guiding principle of conservatism, the corporate-Dems must hide their true allegiences.

So, when Dems are in charge, we get this Kabuki: Dems pretend to fight for their middle-class constituents while simultaneously selling them out at the drop of a hat. The corporate donors get what they want (e.g. tax beaks, deregulation, and access) and the grassroots gets the illusion of a party that is fighting for their interests.

This Kabuki requires the participation of a few helpful Republicans. The Corporate Dems can’t openly admit that they want to sell out. They need to pretend that they had their arms twisted to cut a deal. The media reliably steps in to praise the spirit of bipartisanship give their blessing to a corrupt state of affairs that serves their own corporate interests.

There is only one hitch. As the number of “moderate” Republicans who are willing to cross over the aisle to deal continues to diminish, the Dems look increasingly foolish. Holding up the most important piece of legislation in Obama’s agenda to cater to Olympia Snowe? Please. This only makes sense if Snowe’s support is sought as political cover for legislation that Dems want anyway.

IQ# (and falling)

States’ rights and the public option.

Proving once again liberal ideas suck and can’t pass without smoke and mirrors or the liberal Dems don’t have the stones to try and pass it.

Again proving they only care about power and re-election.

Mom’s calling you 53, time for meds and a nap

Reid said they going forward with WH support public option no trigger.

Various reactions.

freepee:
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/06/special-interest-money-means-longer.html
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/22/ahip-lobbyist-to-gop-dont_n_329828.html
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As always, you are full of invective, but you are empty when it comes to content…

Not to worry, freepee…