President Obama’s Apparent Embrace Of Preventive Detention

At its most basic level, the idea behind “preventive detention” is that there are some bad guys out there — especially in wartime or in a time of terrorism — that should be imprisoned even if the government cannot prove in court that they have committed a crime. Adam Serwer, writing in the American Prospect, has produced an excellent explanation of the issue and the steady drift of President Obama’s position of detaining terrorist suspects without trial. The White House is currently seeking ways to continue the practice, which was widely employed by George W. Bush, under a different legal framework in a narrower set of circumstances. As Serwer explains, the reluctance to reject the Bush Administration policy outright has its roots in a division within the legal left.

On the campaign trail, candidate Barack Obama was fearless in the face of conservative demagoguery on national security — he even said that if he managed to capture Osama bin Laden, he would subject him to a jury trial to avoid making him a martyr. He pledged to institute a system for trying detainees based on the Uniform Code of Military Justice, which has rules similar to those in federal courts. Some civil-liberties advocates dared to hope that if Obama was elected their fight would be over.

As the Bush years drew to a close, however, a rift began to open on the intellectual left. There was still near-unanimous agreement that torture was deplorable and that detainees had a right to due process, but the coalition was divided on the issue of preventive detention. While some groups, like the ACLU, continue to advocate for a “charge or release” policy in all circumstances, independent legal experts are engaged in a vigorous debate about how — and when — it is constitutionally permissible to hold suspects against whom we have scant evidence.

Read the entire story here.

Related Topics: Barack Obama, White House
  • Latest on Swampland

    Morning Must Reads: Secret

    Obama Administration Blocks Global Health Fund To Fight Disease In Developing NationsHuffPost Politics

    SAUL LOEB / AFP / Getty Images

    A Tale of Two Economies: Mitt Romney vs. Republican Governors

    The great recession has left the state of Ohio battered and bruised–and Mitt Romney would have you believe it’s Barack Obama’s fault. Writing in the Cleveland Plain-Dealer on May 4, Romney advised Ohioans that the President has delivered them “paltry results,” and that their state is in need of “a fundamental change in direction.”

  • Tom in The Swamp

    Wow, it only took you and Serwer three months to get caught up with this story.

    What took you so long?

  • destor23

    Look at this innocent but odd phrasing: “especially in wartime or in a time of terrorism.”

    Isn’t any time technically a “time of terrorism?” There’s always some extremist out there who will blow something up to make a point. So if we have rules for a “time of terrorism” it’s akin to being in perpetual war or a perpetual state of emergency and that’s stupid.

  • momentomaury

    “a rift began to open on the intellectual left.”
    .
    Really? All those on the left who think detention without charges is a great idea, please raise your hand.
    .
    Nothing says freedom and democracy more than, “Let’s lock him up for looking shifty”.

  • brianunion

    Michael — you regularly take a lot of heat in comments, so I think it’s worth pointing out your posts have been high quality and thoughtful lately. Please keep up the good work!

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    Obama doesn’t believe in the rule of law, or the concept of being innocent until proven guilty, and yet the MSM still refers to him as a liberal.

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek
  • grape_crush

    The White House is currently seeking ways to continue the practice, which was widely employed by George W. Bush…
    .
    That reads as somewhat prejudicial framing, Michael. Further along in the Prospect article:

    Even if [Obama] changes the policy so that, in the future, the United States only detains those against whom we have solid evidence, we are still left with the detainees whose cases were bungled by the Bush administration.

    So the issue is not as much what will be done in the future – but what will we do about what happened in the past.

    Anyway, I’m not sure that your framing of this is reasonable without giving the context of…

    …a different legal framework in a narrower set of circumstances.

    Far from being an embrace of Bush policy – with its emphasis on a Unitary Executive with unlimited power unchecked by oversight and dismissal of human and civil rights issues as irrelevant – the motions occurring now indicate that what will happen in the future regarding the detention and trial of terrorism suspects will have process and legal protections considered invalid in the Bush years.

  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    ones that frankly, you don’t think committed crimes but if you release, you’re pretty sure will take up arms against you again?
    .
    Why am I suddenly thinking about health-care town halls?

  • mccainfluffer

    Derek,

    A president uses Terror Alerts for political reasons?

    Apparently, this is not newsworthy for Time or their blogs.
    Now if Sarah Palin happens to utter a phrase, they will be all over it.

  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    Changes in rhetoric mean little if the end result remains the ability to lock someone up forever on the say-so of one or two intelligence operatives. Mistakes are easy and ‘safety’ dictates that ties go to the prosecution. Abuse is inevitable.

  • http://www.hulagate.org hulagate

    Speaking of Habeus Corpus 2009:

    This was sent to us from Bozeman, MT…

    [Names have been changed to protect the Americans.]

    “Hello All,

    By now you have probably heard that President Obama came to Montana last Friday. However, there are many things that the major news has not covered. I feel that since Alan and I live here and we were at the airport on Friday I should share some facts with you.

    On Wednesday, August 5th it was announced locally that the President would be coming here. There are many groups here that are against his health care and huge spending so those groups began talking and deciding on what they were going to do. The White House would not release ANY details other than the date.

    On about Tuesday Alan found out that they would be holding the “Town Hall” at the airport. (This is only because Alan knows EVERYONE at the airport.) Our airport is actually located outside of Belgrade (tiny town) in a very remote location. Nothing is around there. They chose to use a hangar that is the most remotely located hangar. You could not pick a more remote location, and you can not get to it easily. It is totally secluded from the public.

    FYI: We have many areas in Belgrade and Bozeman which could have held a large amount of folks with sufficient parking. (gymnasiums/auditoriums). All of which have chairs and tables, and would not have to be SHIPPED IN. $$$$$

    During the week, cargo by the TONS was being shipped in constantly. Airport employees could not believe how it just kept coming. Though it was our President coming several expressed how excessive it was, especially during a recession. $$$$$

    Late Tuesday/early Wednesday the 12th, they said that tickets would be handed out on Thursday 9am at two locations and the POTUS would be arriving around 12:30 Friday.

    Thursday morning about 600 tickets were passed out. However, 1500 were printed at a Local printing shop per White House request. Hmmmm, 900 tickets just DISAPPEARED.

    This same morning someone called into the radio from the local UPS branch and said that THOUSANDS of Dollars of Lobster were shipped in for Obama. Montana has some of the best beef in the nation!!! And it would have been really wonderful to help out the local economy. Anyone heard of the Recession?? Just think, with all of the traveling the White House is doing. $$$$$ One can only imagine what else we are paying for.

    On Friday Alan and I got out to the airport about 10:45am. The groups that wanted to protest Obama’s spending and health care had gotten a permit to protest and that area was roped off. But that was not to be. A large bus carrying SEIU (Service Employees International Union) members drove up onto the area (illegal)and unloaded right there. It was quite a commotion and there were specifically 2 SEIU men trying to make trouble and start a fight. Police did get involved and arrested the one man but they said they did not have the manpower to remove the SEIU crowd.

    The SEIU crowd was very organized and young. About 99% were under the age of 30 and they were not locals! They had bullhorns and PROFESSIONALLY made signs. Some even wore preprinted T-shirts. Oh, and Planned Parenthood folks were with them, professing abortion rights with their T-shirts and preprinted signs. (BTW, all these folks did have a permit to protest in ANOTHER area.)

    Those against health care/spending moved away from the SEIU crowd to avoid confrontation. They were orderly and respectful. Even though SEIU kept coming over and walking through, continuing to be very intimidating and aggressive at the direction of the one SEIU man.

    So we had Montana folks from ALL OVER the state with their homemade signs and their DOGS with homemade signs. We had cowboys, nurses, doctors you name it. There was even a guy from Texas who had been driving through. He found out about the occasion, went to the store, made a sign, and came to protest.

    If you are wondering about the press? Well, all of the major networks were over by that remote hangar I mentioned. They were conveniently parked on the other side of the buildings FAR away. None of these crowds were even visible to them. I have my doubts that they knew anything about the crowds.

    We did have some local news media around us from this state and Idaho . Speaking of the local media, they were invited. However, all questions were to be turned into the White House in advance of the event. Wouldn’t want anyone to have to think off the top of their head.

    It was very obvious that it was meant to be totally controlled by the White House. Everything was orchestrated down to the last detail to make it appear that Montana is just crazy for Obama and government health care. Even those people that talked about their insurance woes, the White House called our local HRDC (Human Resource and Development Committee) and asked for names. Then the White House asked those folks to come. Smoke and mirrors, EVERYTHING was staged.

    I am very dismayed about what I learned about our current White House. The amount of control and manipulation was unbelievable. I felt I was not living in the United States of America , more like the USSR !! I was physically nauseous. Alan and I have been around when Presidents or Heads of State visit. It has NEVER been like this.

    I am truly very frightened for our country. America needs your prayers and your voices. If you care about our country please get involved. Know the issues. And let Congress hear your voices again and again!! If they are willing to put forth so much effort to BULLY a small town one can only imagine what is going on in Washington DC.

    - Bozeman, Montana”

    CLINTON ACCOMPLISHED

  • grape_crush

    Changes in rhetoric mean little..
    .
    Agreed. Are changes in policy and law more substantial?
    .
    …if the end result remains the ability to lock someone up forever on the say-so of one or two intelligence operatives.
    .
    Would it be more acceptable if – in the future – a terrorism suspect was locked up forever because they were caught on tape trying to buy explosives from a covert intelligence operative….and then tried in Federal court?
    .
    That type of policework goes on today, with all of its oversight, safeguards, etc. Is something like that objectionable? Does anyone know what the final shape of all this is?
    .
    See, this is why object to Michael’s (and to be fair, other people’s) framing of this: it leads the reader towards a faulty conclusion that the Obama administration will handle the detainment of terrorism suspects almost exaclty like his predecessor did. Not only is it idle speculation – nowhere has Michael identified what is the official White House policy, or that it is still being worked out – it’s prejudicial because there is no context supplied in Michael’s post. What does “under a different legal framework in a narrower set of circumstances” mean? There’s plenty in the Prospect article, but it’s ignored for a juicier ‘Obama versus the Left because cause he’s like Bush” storyline.
    .
    Abuse is inevitable.
    .
    True, no matter what safeguards are or are not in place. It’s an imperfect world, although it is what you make of it.

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    Ambinder: Sorry I Was So Stupid, But I Was Right To Be Stupid

    The idiot still finds a way to blame liberals even though they were right. Sounds familiar.

  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek
  • http://derekg.wordpress.com/ Derek

    I guess links have been turned off?

  • grape_crush

    Formatting is jacked in the ‘respond to this comment’ sections.
    .
    No line breaks, and the links you put in won’t be highlighted in a different color like everyone in the world is used to. Try <b> or maybe enclose the link text in [] to identify links in responses until the High Sheriffs wake up.

  • momentomaury

    What a fun little game. Here, I’ll give it a try..

    [The names have been changed to protect the guilty.]

    Swampland troll forced to ‘marry’ goat

    A Swampland troll has been forced to take a goat as his “wife”, after he was caught having sex with the animal.

    The goat’s owner, Mr Alifi, said he surprised the man with his goat and took him to a council of elders.

    They ordered the man, hulagate, to pay a dowry of 15,000 Sudanese dinars ($50) to Mr Alifi.

    “We have given him the goat, and as far as we know they are still together,” Mr Alifi said.

    Mr Alifi, of Hai Malakal in Upper Nile State, told the Juba Post newspaper that he heard a loud noise around midnight on 13 February and immediately rushed outside to find hulagate with his goat.

    “When I asked him: ‘What are you doing there?’, he fell off the back of the goat, so I captured and tied him up.”

    Mr Alifi then called elders to decide how to deal with the case.

    “They said I should not take him to the police, but rather let hulagate pay a dowry for my goat because he used it as his wife,” Mr Alifi told the newspaper.

    PARODY ACCOMPLISHED!

  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    Don’t get me going on the High Sheriffs. I have been sentenced to using 2 separate browsers ever since Swampland stopped working with Avant.

    Last night I had to fire up Firefox as it also stopped working (briefly) with IE8.

  • Tom in The Swamp

    Links are there, you just have to mouse over the linked text to see them. A dumb move, if you ask me.

  • http://www.hulagate.org hulagate

    Obama enjoys zero sway with UK on stupid release of Lockerbie bomber, hopes change to total wuss not encouraging to foes of public option.

    http://twitter.com/HULAgate

  • http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/08/morning-links-2009-08-21.html Morning Links: 2009-08-21 – Credit Writedowns

    [...] President Obama’s Apparent Embrace Of Preventive Detention – Swampland – TIME.com [...]

  • http://www.hulagate.org hulagate

    Mighty international sway with international friends renewed by international Obama earns international release of international terrorist.

    http://tiny.cc/9WuDu

blog comments powered by Disqus