In the Arena

Cavedwellers Upset

The Washington Post says that Al Qaeda is boggled by Barack Obama.

The New York Times says the Pakistani government is boggled by the Taliban. This is a far more concrete and disturbing story, with tremendous downside potential. It seems clear that the Pakistani Taliban–and we should begin distinguishing these guys, as best we can, from the Afghan Taliban–are having a fair amount of success moving out from the Northwest Frontier Province into more mainstream Pakistani areas. And it seems equally clear that the Pakistani Army is either unwilling or unable to fight them. My guess is more the latter than the former. The Pakistanis have trained for a big-bang war with India and have no idea how to conduct low-intensity conflicts:

From 2,000 to 4,000 Taliban fighters now roam the Swat Valley, according to interviews with a half-dozen senior Pakistani government, military and political officials involved in the fight. By contrast, the Pakistani military has four brigades with 12,000 to 15,000 men in Swat, officials say.

But the soldiers largely stay inside their camps, unwilling to patrol or exert any large presence that might provoke — or discourage — the militants, Swat residents and political leaders say. The military also has not raided a small village that locals say is widely known as the Taliban’s headquarters in Swat…

When the army does act, its near-total lack of preparedness to fight a counterinsurgency reveals itself. Its usual tactic is to lob artillery shells into a general area, and the results have seemed to hurt civilians more than the militants, residents say.

It seems obvious that one thing the U.S. could offer the Pakistani Army is training in counterinsurgency tactics. Indeed, it wouldn’t be a bad idea to condition U.S. military aid to Pakistan–which should be targeted for the Taliban war–on Pakistan’s willingness to have its troops trained by U.S. advisers. I know, I know: for people of a certain age, the term “U.S. advisers” summons forth the early days in Vietnam, where the term camouflaged a slow-motion invasion and marked the beginnings of the quagmire. That problem can be mitigated by having the training take place away from the war zones (even in the United States for some of the more promising Pakistani officers).

On the other hand, the situation in Pakistan is far more consequential than Vietnam or Iraq (or the possibility than Iran may build a bomb). We’re talking about a country with a nuclear arsenal. The Taliban are 100 miles away from it. This is as serious a foreign policy crisis as we have.

Update: Commenter Cliff asks why we should distinguish between the Afghan and Pakistani Taliban. Answer: because the Pakistanis do. They have begun to see the indigenous Talibs as a real threat to their government…at the same time, though, their army and intelligence agency maintain the hope that they can keep the Afghan Taliban as a destabilizing force in their neighbor to the north. The proof of this that Mullah Omar and his leadership group operate openly in the Pakistani city of Quetta. By the way, it’s interesting that there have been no U.S. Predator strikes in Quetta, even though it is the home base for many of the Taliban commanders who have been running the war against the NATO forces in Helmand and Kandahar provinces. This leads me to believe–contra the public complaints–that the Pakistani government is complicit in the Predator strikes against Al Qaeda and Pakistani Taliban operatives in Waziristan.

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  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    On the other hand, the situation in Pakistan is far more consequential than Vietnam or Iraq
    .
    Well, now is a fine time to mention it? I won’t ask where your voice was in ’03 – I’m aware that there are conflicting versions out there.
    .
    Has anyone else noticed that we’ve been sitting back and allowing this situation to simmer until we could get some adults in charge of policy? People joke about ‘messiah’ references when talking about Obama, but it appears to me that we’ve put all our problems on hold in the hopes that he’s going come in and instantly fix everything.
    .
    I hope that 18 months from now, while all these difficulties are still swirling around that we still remember how we got here. There are a whole lot of people who’ll be interested in rewriting history by then. It’s important that they not get away with it.

  • joyfulalternative

    Yes, counterinsurgency training in the U.S. would be an excellent solution to the problems you portray. The Army War College in Carlisle educates a great many foreign senior officers from an amazing array of countries–sometimes local news shows, say, a Mongolian colonel at a sportsmen’s club skeetshooting event–and this can be expanded to cover these needs.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    It’s just a little typo, but aid, not aide.
    .
    The thing is that to be actually effective in reducing the nuclear threats of other nations, the US has to lead. Although I do believe in the power of deterrence–even if the Taliban (in their tiny numbers, with almost no resources) were to somehow get in charge of the Pakistani nuclear arsenal, it’s by no means clear that they would use it–the US still should do what the NPT says, and reduce its own warhead collection, unilaterally, or by agreement warhead by warhead with Russia.
    .
    That’s how you start on this kind of thing. And, re START, you do it in commemoration of Reagan.

  • plukasiak

    I’d like to suggest that there is nothing to be done about this problem right now — the kind of effort needed is disproportionate to the perceived threat, and unless and until there is another event like 0-11 that shocks the international community into action, the best strategy is containment and isolation, rather than “victory”.

    We’re far better off concentrating on improving our image among the world’s Islamic community as a whole than attacking a small, radical splinter group of Muslims — and indeed, it makes far more sense to let the Islamic world take the lead against Al Qaeda in Pakistan and Afghanistan. Islamic radicalism represents as much (actually, far more) of a threat to the established political, social, and economic order in Islamic countries than it does to the USA, and as long as America insists upon “leading” the fight against al Qaeda, the political leadership of Islamic countries don’t need to.

  • Cliff

    It seems clear that the Pakistani Taliban–and we should begin distinguishing these guys, as best we can, from the Afghan Taliban
    .
    Um, why?
    .
    I thought it was all pretty much the same tribe or group of tribes, operating in two countries. And obviously their tribal loyalties are stronger than their national loyalties.
    Why should we bother running over there with a magic marker and drawing a line down the middle of the Taliban?

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    Cliff–
    .
    Because they are probably different tribes.
    .
    In other news, there are no case files on the “detainees” in Guantanamo
    .
    http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_01/016593.php
    .
    This is, of course, Obama’s fault.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    Joe beat me to it. Good job, JK.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    More on Guantanamo:
    .
    http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_01/016600.php#more
    .
    For the last eight years, over and over again, it’s been worse than I could imagine.

  • rose83

    If the Obama Administration feels that they have to be careful with India as it starts to became the “Israel” of South Asia – a place that is virtually immune from American establishment criticism – then they should just stay out of the way. Launching Predator strikes in Pakistan while letting India treat Muslims terribly is not going to result in a happy ending (unless you’re a fan of the rapture!).
    .
    Supposedly this is all to prevent another terrorist attack, but if that’s truly the main concern investing in domestic border security would be more effective. As would increasing humanitarian aid in the region to try and reduce the skewed gender ratios caused by sex-selective abortion and infanticide: If that problem is not mitigated Pakistan will be a hostile nuclear state in 20 years anyway.

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    I think I suggested this, before, but wouldn’t it be more cost-effective, and simultaneously develop new markets, if we just off-loaded tons of consumer goods on the area? Right now, I imagine the big thing over there is to just survive; it can’t be a paradise of abundance. Set up an infrastructure – water, roads, power supplies, Internet, etc – and then build decent, modest homes for people and stock them with refurbished goods from various manufacturers. Set aside, for the moment, the fact that we can’t even fix NOLA. There’s a new sheriff in town, now.

    The idea is to get them dependent on commodities and bring them into the first world. That will do far more to “civilize” them than bombing them or other military actions. The “nothing to lose” mindset would diminish.

    At least that’s how it’s worked in America. I rather think our forefathers would be embarrassed by our lack of action against Bush over the last eight years. But that’s another argument.

  • Cliff

    Ah, that’s the piece I was missing. Thanks Joe!

  • rose83

    I forgot one thing…
    .
    I appreciate much of Joe’s writing recently, but this line is unintentionally hilarious: The Pakistanis have trained for a big-bang war with India and have no idea how to conduct low-intensity conflicts…It seems obvious that one thing the U.S. could offer the Pakistani Army is training in counterinsurgency tactics.
    .
    Seriously? Because the U.S. has been so successful with counterinsurgency tactics (Yes, that’s sarcasm). The Sri Lankan army is probably better qualified to advise Pakistan!
    .
    I know someone will say that the army has made huge improvements in Iraq, which is true, but many of those improvements have been due to external factors, like paying off insurgents which is not a viable option for Pakistan. And it’s still not going well.

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    @ rose: but many of those improvements have been due to external factors, like paying off insurgents which is not a viable option for Pakistan.

    Why not?

  • Friar Tuck

    Is there any reason to believe that, over the long term, paying off insurgents was/is a viable alternative for Iraq? For instance, what happens when the money stops flowing? If the answer is “We’re right back where we started”, then do we just cross our fingers and hope that it doesn’t happen until after we’re gone?
    .

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    @ Friar: yes, there is that: how long does the bought “peace” last? Are we just supplying them with cash that they can use to buy _more_ weapons and become more dangerous? Until the fundamental issues that push these folks to pick up arms against whomever is addressed, do our bombs and other weapons – aka “death and destruction” – present a better option?

    OT: what year is this? I thought it was 2009…

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/us_goat

  • wvng

    jay, thanks for those case file links. In case anyone here didn’t click on them, here they are again because this is required reading; a case file post sounds boring – it is not.
    .
    There will be a test. And Joe would do well to cover this story both in the Swamp and in dead tree and on all the chattering class shows.
    .
    http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_01/016593.php
    .
    http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_01/016600.php#more
    .
    Remember, there will be a test, so you had better read these hilzoy posts.

  • cincinnatus est exterminata!

    I don’t know if you realize this, but we can’t afford our military anymore, probably never could but 30 years of false demand created by cheap credit skews things a bit.
    .
    OT McCain opposes stimulus
    http://rawstory.com/news/2008/McCain_opposes_economic_stimulus_package_%5BVIDEO.DE%5D_0125.html
    .
    ALso, John King on CNN w/ a Rethug talking about the CBO report that shows this stimulus won’t hit the economy until 2010…the CBO report that doesn’t exist. I think it’s all over folks, if the media is going to let the GOP just make it up.

  • bitterpill8

    Why do we have to advise the Pakistanis? If their own soldiers don’t want to take the local Taliban what makes us think it is because they lack training?

    Rose: Hindu extremism, especially in the Gujerat area, has been a curse, and Indian Muslims have paid the price. But in any comparison India emerges better than Pakistan in dealing with minorities.

  • wvng

    cincy: I think it’s all over folks, if the media is going to let the GOP just make it up. That means Obama has to both go around them, and have a persistent full-court media press to shove wingers back into their caves.
    .
    Certainly no one would have predicted this: Obama’s Right-Wing Dinner Friends Rip His Stimulus Package: Worst Bill In ‘Galactic History’

  • cincinnatus est exterminata!

    I’m waiting for Lieberman to come out against it now. The window of opportunity for Obama to ease this country into something other than total collapse is passing by I’m afraid. This whole thing is going to go down in a heap of stupid.

  • wvng

    cincy #20 -it’s only been 5 days. Surely it will take at least a full week for him to fail?

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    > I think it’s all over folks, if the media is going to let the GOP just make it up.

    Don’t give up hope, yet. There are still solid reporters out there – like our own MS – who will fight the good fight and press the backs of these evildoers against the wall and force the Truth from them.

    In case it’s not obvious, yes, that’s tongue-in-cheek.

  • rose83

    First, it wouldn’t be Pakistan paying off insurgents, because they don’t have enough money. It would be the US. Second, the paying off your enemies thing is temporary and perhaps counterproductive in the long term, as Friar Tuck pointed out. And there is a long-term for Pakistan; The US can just leave Iraq, but the Pakistani military is not occupying the country, it’s actually where they live. Third – this is both more vague and probably more important – paying off insurgents will lead to divisions between “sell-out” insurgents and “genuine” opponents of US Imperialism/domination, which historically (e.g. Iran, etc.) has often led to greater popular support for extremists that are perceived, in spite of their flaws, as being able to stand up to foreign intervention. Adding money to the equation puts more of a premium on proving you’re not an American puppet, although ironically the people who are most successful in proving their indigenous loyalties are often the ones who won the most American aid. Like the Taliban.
    .
    bitterpill8, you’re probably right. Although there are massively more Muslims living in India than Hindus living in Pakistan, so the scale of the problems seems different. I’d rather live in India, but I also think Indian treatment of Muslims lies at the heart of the region’s problems.

  • cincinnatus est exterminata!

    “cincy #20 -it’s only been 5 days. Surely it will take at least a full week for him to fail?”
    .
    It’s not Obama that’s failing, it’s the media, the populace at large and our civilization. How does Obama succeed when the press behaves this way? It was John King who just no brought up the non-existant CBO report, it wasn’t the winger…I mean wtf?

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    Rose, good points, all, but, idealism aside, how do you propose to fix the “long-term” problem? Throughout all of history, men have been at their neighbors’ throats. To stop this, you can bomb them into oblivion; you can pay them off; you can give them their own countries and allow them to do with it what they will. It doesn’t really matter. Neighbors will just start fighting, again.

    About the only long-term solution is to get rid of all men. Someday, that will happen. Until then, the question will ever be: bomb them, or buy them. Personally, I’m of the “bomb them” persuasion: that leaves fewer intransigents to fight. But modern society doesn’t have the stomach for that, and doing a half-arsed job just stirs up the remaining pool of potential intransigents, and causes the cycle to loop back to square 1.

    So, what’s left?

  • stuartzechman

    Joe Klein:
    .
    Thank you very, very much for responding to commentary; it is appreciated, and greatly enhances the value of your posts.

  • stuartzechman

    Personally, I’m of the “bomb them” persuasion: that leaves fewer intransigents to fight.
    .
    That sounds a little imperial, doesn’t it?

  • stuartzechman

    This is almost too much to be believed.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    Yes, wvng, it will be interesting to see how the complete absence of any sort of due process, or even vague to guilt or innocence, in Guantanamo will be covered. Given the meme that because Bush let out a bad guy (or “61″) therefore guilty and innocent must be jailed forever, elsewhere, I do not think the public will seeing the straight story from Wolf and his chums.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    Rose, good points, all, but, idealism aside, how do you propose to fix the “long-term” problem? Throughout all of history, men have been at their neighbors’ throats. To stop this, you can bomb them into oblivion; you can pay them off; you can give them their own countries and allow them to do with it what they will. It doesn’t really matter. Neighbors will just start fighting, again.
    .
    Europe was a place essentially at war for 3000 years. The US ended that state of affairs with a combination of a security umbrella, alliances, and, most importantly, the Marshall Plan. The short answer to your question is that if the US stops fighting imperialist wars of choice, then things would get markedly better.
    .
    If the US unilaterally disarmed, cut military expenditures by two thirds, reduced nuclear stockpiles to the level of France in concert with Russia, and engaged in the kind of effective foreign aid that Bill Gates is engaged in, then things would be markedly better.
    .
    It is in the sphere of deviance to say this, but the US is to blame a shameworthy number of the woes of the world.

  • rose83

    Until then, the question will ever be: bomb them, or buy them. Personally, I’m of the “bomb them” persuasion: that leaves fewer intransigents to fight.
    .
    If we bomb them that will increase their numbers, because it’s the most foolproof way for extremists to recruit. We’ve seen that happen enough times. In fact it’s happening right now around the globe. Personally, I’m of the “let’s address their problems or at least get the h–l out of there” persuasion.
    .
    About the Hilzoy info, I think that impacts the debate about prosecuting members of the Bush Administration. It’s difficult to justify not prosecuting at least someone when you see that blatant contempt for the rule of law.
    .
    Signing off now…

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    sz: That sounds a little imperial, doesn’t it?

    You could make a case for that. In actuality, I’m simply more pragmatic. I don’t see humans as a “higher” species; just ordinary biological beings that can make better use of tools. Cockroaches with power saws and grenade launchers. When some of us die, it’s not like the world stops revolving.

  • Dee in Columbia MD

    The problem is really lexis-nexis. These lazy reporters keep repeating the same erroneous information because every time they go to write something they look it up and attach the misinformation. Despite the exceptions, most of them have no work ethic otherwise they would do their own research rather than rely on a database that once the first story is entered whatever misinformation is included gets referred to every time the subject comes up

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    And, of course, there’s the fact that a US not being fearmongering a-holes actually makes bin Laden scared, angry and less effective.
    .
    http://tinyurl.com/cvdm82
    .
    Same is true in Iran, IMO. By not acting like a Great Satan, you diminish the power of Fear of the Other that’s exploited by their mullahs.

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    rose: If we bomb them that will increase their numbers, because it’s the most foolproof way for extremists to recruit.

    Ah, see – that’s where “half-arsed” comes in. Notice how the Japanese lost their will to fight – at least within the upper leadership – after the two nuclear bombings. I’m not suggesting we take the same approach in various global hot spots, but if we did, I suspect they wouldn’t be hot spots for long. It’s like fighting a cancer: if you surgically remove only part of it, you leave roots for it to come back.

    jay: I don’t disagree with your point, really. In fact, I more or less said as much in my first post or two. If we’re not going to do a right proper job of bombing them out, then we might as well buy them out. Ok, quibble about the details and semantics of “buying them out,” but it still boils down to engaging them on economic terms, rather than military.

  • shepherdwong

    “It seems obvious that one thing the U.S. could offer the Pakistani Army is training in counterinsurgency tactics.”
    .
    Perhaps we should learn them ourselves”before we try to teach them to others.

  • Dee in Columbia MD

    Perhaps the GOP ought to rethink their plan. If the only reason that the Obama administration is reluctant to after Bus for war crimes is to preserve any chance of bipartisanship, we might still have chance since its clear that the GOP does not intend to play nice. If Dems have to do it on their own then I say we have nothing to lose and we should bring the full weight of the law down on their heads.

  • http://nicewhitelady.blogspot.com/ joyomama

    Low moment from today’s John King show on CNN:

    Mike Pence (R-IN) explains GOP new math: yes, we are the minority in congress but you forget the American people. Together we are the majority. (paraphrase mine)

    John King: Thank you very much for being here today.

    Mike Pence: A pleasure, John.

    Joyomama, from big red couch: WTF! But the American people just voted against you, dude!

    John King: And thanks to our viewers for joining us.

    Joyomama, jumping up from big red couch: And thank you for nothing!

  • shepherdwong

    “If the only reason that the Obama administration is reluctant to after Bus for war crimes is to preserve any chance of bipartisanship, we might still have chance since its clear that the GOP does not intend to play nice.”
    .
    Again, everyone knows that Republicans are obstructionists and won’t cooperate with Democrats, except when politically expedient. This show is for the media elite, to prevent them from hurling the (corporatist) epithets “partisan” and “liberal” at Obama. If he can avoid those labels it may force Republicans into doing what is both politically expedient and good for the country. In other words, they are then forced to cooperate to avoid being seen as the ones who are “partisan” and obstructionist”.

  • shepherdwong

    I just heard CNN suggest (broadcast) that Obama was appearing “partisan” for signing the executive order reversing the ban that prohibits funding to international family planning groups (presumably because Republicans told them so). I’m still looking for news reports claiming how “partisan” it was for Ronald Reagan to create and institute the ban in the first place or for George W. Bush to reinstate it, both by “partisan” executive orders.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    I think that’s right, shepherdwong. At least, I hope it is.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    Ah, that’s because Republicans are principled, while Democrats are partisan.
    .
    The teevee has done so much damage to political discourse in this country.

  • cincinnatus est exterminata!

    joyomama, did you catch the beginning in which King started the conversation by using the non existent CBO report to point out that stimulus won’t reach the economy until 2010? A real softball question and the softball wasn’t even real…they’re playing ‘air journalism’ over at CNN.

  • shepherdwong

    “Ah, that’s because Republicans are principled, while Democrats are partisan.”
    .
    New acronym:
    .
    IOPIYAD

  • cincinnatus est exterminata!

    It just occurred to me, that like this generation’s kids who don’t actually learn guitar, and who just want play the video game instead, our media really just doesn’t want to spend the energy it takes learn their craft. So how about a game, “Journalist Hero”, the goal of which is to repeat right wing talking points fast enough and accurately enough to make a panel of virtual pundits nod their heads in agreement. Hey at least it would give them something to do.

  • wvng

    cincy, that is a great idea. If someone has the skills to do it, perhaps a clever YouTube that went viral could drive home the point. It might star Gregory and King and Halperin.
    .
    On the media point, and the need for Obama and crew to push back, I think this piece from Greg Sargents new blog is very very very good news: Obama Allies Preparing To Launch TV Ad Blitz Targeting GOP Senators.
    .
    I also like this comment from Pelosi: Nancy Pelosi says that Republicans have had the opportunity to present their ideas for the stimulus — but their ideas have to be good ones.

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    shep: I like it. Now I’m wondering if the Repugs sit around and discuss how they’re going to play these games – eg. refer to non-existent reports, etc – or if it just comes naturally to them. Is the media actively complicit, or just willing patsies?

    And Cinci, if we don’t like the Media, why can’t we start our own channel? I see there are a couple of web-streaming options, such as http://www.livestation.com/ or http://www.ustream.tv/. What’s to stop us from grabbing a camera and starting our own journalism channel?

  • wvng

    Nice Guy, the problem with your solution is that we aren’t the problem. It’s the great masses who get their news from CNN et al. Our own channel doesn’t do the job.
    .
    It is mighty helpful to have Rachel and Keith on the teevee. Without them, Matthews would be the “liberal voice.”

  • Friar Tuck

    Oh, poof, wvng. I was sitting here inventing all kinds of interesting slogans for SwampChannel.
    .
    “SwampChannel: Because Reality is Unfair and Unbalanced”
    .
    “SwampChannel: Real News! (Caution: Oxygen Masks May Deploy)”
    .
    “SwampChannel: PWNing Truthiness 24/7/365″

  • cincinnatus est exterminata!

    MNG, what wvng said, it’s not about us, it’s about the Moron Majority.
    .
    The ads going after GOP Senators sounds great. If the media continues to willfully mislead the public…what if Obama addressed it? He could potentially put the same amount of pressure on the media TO REPORT FACTS by calling them out using instances of media failure like this CBO. Of course the narcissistic, self righteous, navel gazing @ssholes that make up the media would probably take it as a personal challenge and just double down. Then again, let us compare BHO’s approval rating w/ the media’s.
    .
    PS, this channel clearly couldn’t have any association w/ Swampland…my god.

  • jcapan

    Ah, a blog where all the South Asian experts can weigh in with their refined opinions about how to solve the region’s problems? Isn’t it grand. Like Joe, so many armchair diplomats with Wiki-research a window away. After all, these are just uncivilized cave-dwellers, more of the world’s brown. Bomb them, bribe them, lecture them, manipulate them, assume they will nuke one another while the Soviets and US were far too civilized to do such a thing. Delude oneself that it’s about “preventing terrorism” or at least the white man’s burden, that it doesn’t possibly concern resources and markets and continued hegemony. Forget that the regions borders, as with Israel, were borne out of western hubris and failure. Or that the same ravenous colonial/imperial hunger defines our greedy glances to this day.
    ~
    The state dept. is a PR organ for America’s insane fo-po. Sadly, our media largely echoes their estab. propaganda, regardless of who assumes command at Foggy Bottom. And from west to east (Asia that is) our policy still smacks of untempered orientalism (i.e. the arrogance that we know best how to solve their problems or, worse yet, that we should take the lead, selflessly of course). At least the centrist Zakaria knows the region. Reading Joe on an issue like this reminds me of grimacing over my college students’ essays–freshly minted from online CliffsNotes et al. There’s no there to it, and what is there is cobbled together out of so many status quo voices. Read voices from my field–Arudhati Roy, Salman Rushdie, or book of books, Said’s own Orientalism. Then reassess what you think America should do to/for this region.

  • Dee in Columbia MD

    Well they seem to respond to authority so perhaps if Obama throws around a couple of enoughs and Gibbs take them to task at the next few press briefings like he did Hannity they will behave accordingly.

  • sacredh

    Much of the problem can be addressed by infrastructure improvements. One sure way to thin the ranks of the wingnuts citing nonexistent CBO reports is to build more Men’s restrooms within easy walking distance of Congress. Stock them with wired volunteers. Resignations to follow.

  • shepherdwong

    “Now I’m wondering if the Repugs sit around and discuss how they’re going to play these games – eg. refer to non-existent reports, etc – or if it just comes naturally to them. Is the media actively complicit, or just willing patsies?”
    .
    Id have to say, yes, yes, yes and yes.

  • cincinnatus est exterminata!

    Dee, I think it might have been a good idea to go ahead and have a 3rd oath taking, this time w/ all the WH press corp invited and served milk and cookies, their little heads patted.
    .
    jcapan…HOW DARE YOU! Oh, wait, everything you wrote is true. We could go on and on about our short-sighted, corporations first foreign policy all day long and what should or shouldn’t be done. The bottom line for me is: the US is no longer in a financial position to maintain empire. For many its hard to let go when you’ve lived your entire life in the post WWII hegemony bubble.

  • shepherdwong

    “Reading Joe on an issue like this reminds me of grimacing over my college students’ essays–freshly minted from online CliffsNotes et al. There’s no there to it, and what is there is cobbled together out of so many status quo voices.”
    .
    I assume that this is the sort of voice to which you refer:

    “The Washington Post has a good assessment of the emerging Obama policy toward Pakistan–continue the effective Predator strikes against terrorist targets in the Northwest Frontier areas…”

    .
    Are you suggesting that it is somehow naive or immature to overlook, say, the righteous anger generated in millions of Muslims, loss of moral authority around the world, a more destabilized Pakistan and not to mention a rather shocking number of innocent woman and children blown to bits when concluding how “effective” one of our high-tech military techniques might be.

  • cincinnatus est exterminata!

    F@ck it, I’m crossposting:
    .

    “Not helping matters is a report from the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) that came out Tuesday, which shows that only 38% of the $350 billion in appropriated funds — which includes $274 billion for infrastructure investments — would make their way into the economy within two years of enactment.”

    http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1873192,00.html

  • shepherdwong

    “While some Democrats defended the study, saying it did not look at large parts of the bill, it was still a topic of some contention at the caucus’ weekly lunch meeting on Wednesday.”
    - Jay Newton-Small
    .
    So, if large portions of the large, unaccounted for parts of the bill were to make their way into the economy faster that two years, wouldn’t that make the 38% statistic really, sort of, A BUNCH OF BULLSH*T?! Nice catapulting the propaganda there, Ms. Newton-Small. Now trot off to your GOP sources and get a cookie, you’ve earned it.

  • cdrwayne

    Before the U.S. can even dream of being successful in any counterinsugency war, President Obama and Secretary Gates will have to completely revamp the military leadership. The only people in the U.S. military that understand how to fight insurgencies are the special ops forces. The rest of the military leaders are focused on standard warfare because that is how they get promoted.

  • sevenoaks07

    jcapan” several posts here have asked why we think we can affect Pakistan’s internal politics. We certainly won’t welcome a post in Islamabad’s blogworld where some one tells us how to solve our economic problems. I am okay with a live and let live policy. BUT can you ask the Pakistan Govt not to send their ambassador around to State and Defense asking for yet another hand out. It is that action which gives our side the ability to get into the prescription busniness.

  • Mr. Nice Guy

    jcapan: I fully sympathize with your general sense of umbrage, but the question then becomes: what do you propose to solve the problem? It’s a serious question. You sound somewhat informed. I’m curious what ideas you have.

  • http://polaris.nationalinterest.in/2009/01/26/linkfest-january-25-2009/ Polaris » Linkfest: January 25, 2009

    [...] political commentator Joe Klein argues that U.S. military advisers should be sent to help Pakistan improve its counterinsurgency [...]

  • pneogy

    For anyone interested, William Dalrymple’s review of Ahmed Rashid’s “Descent into Chaos” (http://www.nybooks.com/articles/22274) has an excellent summary of the origins and the present status of Al Qaeda and the Taliban in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

  • rogertompkins

    Joe,
    You want us to teach them “successful counter insurgency tactics”. As in “The operation was a total success even though the patient died.” We haven’t invented successful tactics, we’ve barely come up with less catastrophicly failing tactics. We’ve come up with ways to keep bloodshed to a publicly (American public) acceptable level in the absence of a government. The only successful antiinsurgency strategy is good governing, and there is no military tactic for that.

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