Barack Obama’s Night Out

The Pool’s crack at the end that the blogosphere would get the vapors over this is a classic illustration of the bizarre world view that dominates teh Village. Of course Obama should talk to people on the right. Good ideas can come from anywhere. George Will’s suggestion that a condition for accepting bailout money should be that salaries be capped in the recipient organizations at the top federal salary level is an example.
.
Who wrote the pool report, KT?

not sure who wrote it. forget the blogosphere. i’m sort of tickled at how the georgetown doyennes must be getting the vapors this morning, because george will scored the first dinner party.

Yep.
.
Nice amplification of my point.

I am shocked, shocked they would pal around with anyone palling around with terrorists.

I am just surprised Kristol’s head didn’t explode and the Kraut didn’t start spewing over everyone.
.
Oh nooz, the lefty librul crashed the party.

K Teezie
.
Im channeling texte
.
Now you know Bill Ayers got the first dinner party with the thoroughly unqualified blah blah blah

I’m curious what thoughts you all have about the difficulties Obama seems to be having with Congressional Democrats over the remainder of the TARP money.
.
In fact, Obama seems to have developed a well thought out strategy for cultivating Republicans in Washington, and looks like he’s dropped the ball on cultivating Democrats. I don’t know if that’s true, or if he knows better than to try to herd cats.
.
I’m not happy with the Senate Democrats giving Obama a harder time over the second half of TARP than they gave Bush over the first half (though of course I want us to be able to say where the money went).

kathy, I do find it interesting that the dems want to hold Obama accountable. It would be better had they acted the same way with Bush, but Congress should always hold presidents accountable.
.
sgw, K-Tum, et al, the Daily Show had a hilarious bit about teevee pundits the other day that seems to fit with sgw’s comment: “I am just surprised Kristol’s head didn’t explode and the Kraut didn’t start spewing over everyone.”
http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=215338&title=Pundit-School

Check with Glenn Greenwald, but isn’t dining with Charles Krauthammer torture?

As for the pool report, I am not surprised that Obama did this, and doubt it is that interesting outside the beltway cocktail circuit. What will be interesting is how the various RW pundits – who generally show less class than Obama on a bad day – write and speak about this event.

Was this meeting to hash out some sort of peace deal? Maybe Obama promises to not lurch to the left if the conservative cognoscenti refrain from bashing his plans? It’s weak, I know. But why else would PEBO find himself in a roomful of right wing commentators?

http://www.political-buzz.com/

The NYT is reporting that the senior official in the Bush administration responsible for convening military commissions had determined that a Gitmo detainee had been tortured. The official Susan Crawford told Bob Woodward that since his treatment rose to the level of torture she decided she could not refer his case for trial.
.
Now what we apparently have is a man who is extremely dangerous who can not be tried and can not be released. All because failed to follow the law.
.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/14/us/14gitmo.html?_r=1

kathy
.
Notice the people who are voicing opposition to releasing the TARP funds are also some of the people who were closest to Obama during the election. I am not saying its the case but it appears to me that the Dems are employing a wise strategy of showing opposition so as not to be seen as a rubber stamp all the while knowing he is going to get the votes for the money. There is no way he doesn’t get the TARP funds whether by Congressional vote or veto.

This is where a historical perspective comes in handy. This is what Democrats do. They lay down for the GOP afraid if they stand up they will get stuffed in their lockers. Meanwhile they seem go find their fight only when dealing with fellow Dems who they know won’t hit back hard enough to really hurt. Trust me Obama has expected this and I suspect the dinner last night is part of the plan of bringing Dems back down to earth.

Pluk: You there? Sign or signal? Both, maybe?

I’m not sure a “muscle hijacker” is actually an extremely dangerous man. In any case, the only action possible is to release him. The question is how long it will take Obama to recognize this. The sooner the better, in my view, because the wingnuts will go crazy.
.
As with other issues he is facing, there are multiple interrelated factors here. He can’t credibly renounce torture and restore the rule of law and also keep these people captive, uncharged. But releasing them is going to be painted, even by people who strongly objected to their treatment, as letting dangerous people out who are determined and able to kill Americans.
.
The challenge is going to involve making it clear that the results–release of all the detained people in Guantanamo, even ones putatively guilty–stem from Bush’s literal war crimes. In a climate where Tweety has guests debate under what circumstances torture by Americans (but nobody else) is okay, this is a serious challenge.

Best line from wvng’s link to the dailyshow
.
on Ann Coulter
.
“That guy’s got great hair”

Of course the pool reporter’s cluelessness about bloggers is telling. But then again the idea of Charles Krauthammer getting the opportunity to bend the PE’s ear with the notion that the only good Gazan is a dead Gazan does grate a little bit.

TPM had the best headline for this story: Obama Meets Unconditionally With George Will, Bill Kristol, David Brooks

Would he do that, Paul? I don’t think so. I expect the dinner to have been very cordial, and nearly free of policy discussion. it wouldn’t be polite to browbeat the incoming President.

jay
.
You know good and hell well the wingers don’t have any manners. But I doubt Obama was having any of it. Here is the great part about going to the meeting, now no matter what Kristol and Kraut say Obama can always point out “Well I went to meet with those guys but they weren’t interested in bringing the country together”. You for damm sure won’t see Kristol nor Kraut at some liberal/progressive function. So who comes out of this dinner with more credibility with the average American? I think you already know the answer. So what happens now when he says the country needs big government spending because its the right thing to do and those two ass hats rail against him?
.
He is killing them with diplomacy and they have no idea what to do about it.

Oh they certainly do have manners. There people aren’t the cretins you see in the freeper comment threads. They’re wealthy, sophisticated, cosmopolitan people.

gunny: Now what we apparently have is a man who is extremely dangerous who can not be tried and can not be released. All because failed to follow the law. I would suspect everyone incarcerated at Guantanamo, including the many who had done nothing to justify incarceration, became either extremely dangerous, or empty shells, due to their treatment.
.
OT, not sure if this made it into Joe’s Hillary Hearing thread, but worth hearing again even if it did, digby on Vitter challenging Hillary’s ethics: Whenever I see some little diaper wearing toady like David Vitter get all filled with righteous indignation about conflict of interest and setting precedents I just have to laugh.

I bet the Nazis came up. The Nazis are always coming up with those guys.

Freepers have decided Rush must have attended.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2164271/posts

Sorta off-topic.
.
Glenzilla points to a John Cole post.

In an unusually public rebuke, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert of Israel said Monday that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice had been forced to abstain from a United Nations resolution on Gaza that she helped draft, after Mr. Olmert placed a phone call to President Bush.

Mr. Olmert claimed that once he made his case to Mr. Bush, the president called Ms. Rice and told her to abstain. “She was left pretty embarrassed,” Mr. Olmert said, according to The A.P.

Glenzilla PWNS Friedman today but good. Jeffery Goldberg is also hit with some “collateral damage

gunny, more on your topic: A former military prosecutor said in a declaration filed in federal court yesterday that the system of handling evidence against detainees at Guantanamo Bay is so chaotic that it is impossible to prepare a fair and successful prosecution. . . . Vandeveld said in a phone interview that the “complete lack of organization” has affected nearly all cases at Guantanamo Bay. The evidence is often so disorganized, he said, “it was like a stash of documents found in a village in a raid and just put on a plane to the U.S. Not even rudimentary organization by date or name.”

I bet Mrs. Will cooks so George can run to the den and check Wikipedia for quotes to drop, probably ones about appeasing the Nazis.

Tennessee Democrats show how battles are won and political wars are fought. To make a long story short the Tennessee State House has 50 Republicans and 49 Democrats. Rep. Kent Williams (R-TN) a dark horse and not the official nominee, got together with all 49 Democrats plus his own vote and put himself in the Speaker’s chair. Williams then voted for a democrat to be the number 2.
.
After the vote the House chamber at moments erupted into near bedlam and the Republicans appeared shaken in the aftermath of the vote, and sat in stunned, stony-faced silence.
.
http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090113/NEWS02/90113034/1009

Here’s my question and I suppose also my answer to the idea that these people are to dangerous to let go. We have lived with the idea of letting the guilty go free in order to insure we don’t punish the innocent sine oue inception. Do you think after over two centuries of letting dangerous individuals go free on technicalities we could suck it up and return to respecting our constitution. Yes, this may mean that some dangerous people will be let loose but if we run a competent intelligence, diplomatic, law enforcement etc. we should be able to protect ourselves and revive the notion that we are a nation of laws.

Dee
.
Its one thing to let a rapist go free to rape again because of a typo on the warrent. Its another thing all together to let an ACCUSED terrorist go because we have tortured them and or never had sufficient evidence against them in the first place. Thats snark if it wasn’t readily apparent but in a lot of ways its an indictment on our elected officials. It is true that they will stand up for the rule of law when it comes to citizens but most of them will NEVER have the courage needed to make the same point you just made Dee. Everything about closing GITMO will be more about the politics of it than the rule of law. It is what it is.

Scratch that. I bet Will wears a bluetooth device and has Ben Stein feeding him historical quotes from the basement.

“Its one thing to let a rapist go free to rape again because of a typo on the warrent.”
.
Actually there are legal means and ways available to deal with the typo.

SG– I just can’t stand the hypocracy. More people are killed and maimed in this country this year than all of the of terrorism combined (okay I’m just making that up but it sounds good and is probably true). Why are Dems so afraid of rethugs it seems to me that 9/11 scared the crap out of the GOP and they haven’t been able to think of anything else since. The willingess to throw away the rule of law, our way of life, and our most sacred values to jeep the boogeyman at bay means the GOP are either cowards or they are three.

And the PETAburgers stuffed with fresh hemp were delicious.

Allow me to channel QH/Hula:
.
==OBOBO IN PARADISE==
.
The Pool’s crack at the end that the blogosphere would get the vapors over this is a classic illustration of the bizarre world view that dominates teh Village.
.
Actually, I beg to differ. I’m getting the vapors. This story along with the reports that Obama is meeting with Limbaugh…man, Obama can be a sucker.
.
Of course Obama should talk to people on the right. Good ideas can come from anywhere.
.
I don’t disagree with this in principle. I disagree with the manner in which it is conducted. Good ideas CAN come from anywhere, but when you reward bad ideas without incentivizing good ones…well, don’t blame me when it blows up in your face.
.
I support direct talks with Iran and North Korea. But the leaders of those countries should not be the first leaders that Obama meets with after he is sworn in.
.
Similarly, I have no problem with Obama meeting with conservative pundits. But before he even has a similar dinner with liberal pundits? That doesn’t demonstrate an open mind. It demonstrates a lack of self-respect. It sends a terrible message that you can say whatever terrible things about liberals that you want. You can question their patriotism or whether they are “real Americans” and the Democrats will rush to make nice. Well, I’m having a Dixie Chicks moment, here.
.
Like with Rick Warren, too soon, Obama. Too soon.

Dee in Columbia MD
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
You wouldn’t know a viable threat to national security if it was parked on your private Babsnik beach overlooking the never-built wind mills next to Wally Crankcrap’s used oil burning mega-yacht.

Move On indeed.

Like to Egypt.

I understand they’re hiring critics too.

“I support direct talks with Iran and North Korea.”

…

When were Sandy Burglar and Richie Richardson re-hired?

Talks shmocks.

We need to be at least FEARED by our enemies, and with good reason.

Obama’s liable to be the next spastic doofus JFK, fer sher, bumping from world crisis to crisis like some out of luck cue ball without a friggin clue, starting with his ME lib dream of foaming loon Gazites and Syrians and Pakis joining the world community as contributing members instead of Junior Stalinist statist cancers — and don’t even get me started on Iran, Korea, Somalia, Yugoslobia, Ukraine, Zimbabwe, and all the other CARTER and CLINTON leftovers we’re still messing around with (or with which we’re still messing around, if not a Pell Grantee).

Hillary’s guarded testimony and 5 petro-dollars will get you a signature 3-pack of used jockie shorts at the Lieberry (brought to you by Indonesia, since inception) and that IS about it.

Jeb 2012 signs are already being printed in response, and thankfully so.

O/T and following up on earlier thread (which I think is dead now), in which Sgwhite asked whether Obama had ever actually said he hates drama. This is what he said in an interview with me last June, where I asked him how he beat a machine as formidable as the Clinton operation:
.
In some ways, that was liberating. We didn’t have a lot of pressure on us. I had some pressure in the sense that running this time with all the hype that surrounded the run-up in the race meant that if my candidacy had blown up, it would be embarrassing. But on the other hand, what I’d felt was that we could try some things in a different way, and build an organization that reflected my personality and what I thought the country was looking for. And we didn’t have to unlearn a bunch of bad habits. So my starting point was that we were going to have a ‘no drama’ campaign, that people who were involved in this campaign would submerge their egos to the larger cause—and that includes me. And because I was not favored, that meant that the people who signed up for this campaign really believed in what the campaign was about, so they weren’t mercenaries, they weren’t coming in to just attach to a campaign. They had to really believe in what we were trying to do, and that I think was very helpful.

KT– Maybe you could persuade your brethren that no drama doesn’t mean no mistakes, perfection or no mulligans. No drama then and now was all about how they responded to adversity not the absence of adversity. Perhaps you haven’t realized this but in attempt to drive this no drama = perfection meme is a phenomenon that blacks deal with in corporate America all the time. Do you know if any other president whose standard of comparison us perfection. For that matter do you know of anyone who must be perfect in order not to be deemed a failure? We grow up hearing that we have to be ten times better just to be considered equal but now it seems once again now that we’ve arrived the bar gets raised again. So much for post racial.

Dee: I think Obama himself describes it pretty well in that quote. It’s about “no ego,” which is perhaps more a goal than a realistic expectation in politics.
.
Is someone writing otherwise? Send me a cite, and I can make a post out of it, since that quote pretty well sums up what Obama meant by that.

Also, Dee, in talking to my own black friends, I am finding that nothing annoys them more than people who claim the country has become “post-racial.” Had a great discussion of that very question with a diverse group of girlfriends at a wine-fueled dinner recently.

Weird spam in my inbox:
.

Hello,
.
As I was surfing around google , I discovered your website: http://swampland.blogs.time.com I am trying to add as many informative websites as possible to my site. Which in turn will benefit my users as well as provide you with relevant traffic to your site. I have a website with about 5,000 – 7,000 people on it per day who fit the same demographic as your site.

Politico, CNN, MSNBC all flogg this meme about no drama means perfection. It’s so irritating. Huffington Post is becoming the worst. Yesterday,they featured a huge screaming front page headline, “NO DRAMA OBAMA” attached to an article about Tim Geitner’s tax issues. No subtle understanding from Huffpo, the so-called new media, that no drama means no ego. The truth is the media is addicted to drama and prefers the drudge siren style to a simple presentation of the facts.

I’m just thinking that Obama got a free lunch(dinner) from a bunch of Republicans. I hope he asked them all for contributions too.

OT -
KT on the other post you noted the perils of the dreaded alphabetical order which caused you to move to the last spot. I totally sympathize — I was born an S and the fact that I married a B was a big reason not to keep my birth name, which was just becoming fashionable.

Spencer Ackerman is thinking like im thinking.
.
http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/14/hes-the-master-of-the-game/
.
One of the more frustrating aspects of counterinsurgency involves talking to the people who were recently shooting at you — sometimes while they’re shooting at you. Often that gets misinterpreted as softness, but it’s more of a recognition that the only way to achieve a true victory is by co-opting your opponents. What looks like a decisive victory one day can easily be overturned by a simmering sense among the vanquished that they have no place in the new regime, and therefore have little recourse besides resistance. The objective in launching these sorts of parleys with your opponents is two-fold. First, to see if they can be placated, and whether the price of doing so is acceptable. And second, to visibly demonstrate to the broader population that you’ve taken every reasonable step at reaching out to these adversaries — so if they rebuke you and you counterattack, you look like the reasonable party and they look like the rejectionists. It’s generally a sound strategy, and it’s achieved real results.
.
Am I talking about Iraq? Sure. Afghanistan? I hope so. But the lesson also applies to Barack Obama’s dinner with Bill Kristol, David Brooks, Charles Krauthammer, and George Will.
.
K Teezie
.
We are definitely NOT post racial. We talk about that a lot over on Ta Nehisi Coates’ blog on the Atlantic website.
.
As for the quote you posted I still don’t see where he said he hated drama. The “no drama” theme can mean a lot of things. Most people who claim they have a no drama lifestyle mean they don’t want people around them who START controversy. Now controversy comes whether we want it to or not, thats just a fact of life. But you can cut down on it if you keep people around you who try to steer clear of drama and shunning those who seek it out. To me thats the difference that I don’t think a lot of the MSM folk get. When sh!t happens then it just happens. Not a lot you can do about that. But when you reject people who say controversial stuff or do controversial stuff I believe thats what Obama means when he says “no drama”. And thats why I think he didn’t reach out to a lot of the “usual suspects” during his run for the presidency.

Of course I am pwned by the Rev Wright thing, but who knew?

Dee, I don’t think this is about the color of Obama’s skin as much as how the perception of him as one who could do no wrong was perpetrated in the campaign, by his followers and the media itself. Then of course there is this blogosphere that has sprung up.

When you have hundreds of different high-profile outlets that have to churn out politiwonk pieces every day just to stay afloat, including opinion pages, is it any wonder that the whole politics-addicted infrastructure fills with meaningless redundancies most of the time?

I used to be addicted to opinion pages in the primaries. Now that I’ve realized there’s really nothing interesting in them most of the time, I don’t bother as much.

Speaking of the “post-racial” meme, here is an offering from the incomparable DH in my local paper.
.
Unless you are new to My Unbased Opinions, you know I did not
support election of Barack Obama. I worried about his patriotism, his allegiances, his liberal bias, and the
damage he might do to our country’s underpinnings through executive orders. I still do.
.
BUT! I am warming to some possible ramifications of his election.
Recent news stories illustrate my points.
.
January 10, Washington Post, an article written by Robert Barnes details acceptance of a voting rights case by the Supreme Court. At issue is whether our federal government must still monitor and approve changes in voting procedures by certain states made accountable to federal authorities by the Voting Rights Act of 1965. In light of the election of an African American as President
of the United States, must our government still insist upon insuring that citizens of such lineage gain special consideration when voting?
.
The same article briefly addressed another case accepted by the
Supreme Court. White firefighters in New Haven, Connecticut brought a discrimination lawsuit against the city which decided to throw out a promotion exam because not enough black applicants did well on it. I’d guess it will be tough to make a case for dumbing down such exams based on race when a member of that race won election as President………
.
Teh stoopid never ends, and will never end.

While I understand Obama’s motivation for breaking bread with this infamous bunch of scoundrels, I think he is wasting his time.