Bailout Update

Here‘s the latest on the mess that is the auto bailout on Capitol Hill. Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell today insisted that the GOP be allowed to vote on an amendment by Tennessee Senator Bob Corker.

From his speech on the Senate floor:

“The Corker Amendment does not just encourage reform, it requires it. And it does so with crucial specificity. First, participating companies would be required to reduce their outstanding debt by at least two-thirds through an equity swap with bondholders.

“The Corker Amendment also requires that labor costs at participating companies be brought on par with companies like Nissan, Toyota, and Honda — not tomorrow but immediately — because it is delusional to think that a company which spends $71 per labor hour could compete with a company in the same industry that spends $49.

“The Corker Amendment would improve the liquidity and cash-flow of automakers by requiring that a portion of the payments made to union accounts consist of company stock.

“And finally, the Corker Amendment would require participating companies to file for Chapter 11 reorganization if any of these conditions aren’t met by a fixed date.

“The Corker Amendment forces necessary reforms, holds companies accountable, and assures taxpayers that these companies won’t be back for more. If legislative action were necessary, the Corker proposal would make many much needed and dramatic improvements to the underlying bill.”

In a similar speech, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid this morning said he’s more inclined to allow substitute bills than amendments.

“I’ve had calls from a number of senators today; frankly, mostly Republican senators, telling me that they have a solution to all the problems of the auto industry. Just need a few amendments. Mr. President, we have done our very best to include everyone that wants any input into this legislation.

“The White House, President Bush and his people, have been heavily involved in this legislation. There was a decision made that the minority would not participate in the preparing of this legislation, but the White house was heavily involved. Negotiations took place for days between Chairmen Frank and Dodd and the White house and now we have a piece of legislation. Some have asked, well what we want is to set up a procedure where we have lots of amendments, and then we’ll ultimately vote on the final version.

“Mr. President, I think it’s only fair, if the minority, the Republicans, want to have a better bill, then they should offer an alternative. And I invite them to do that. The House passed a bill last night. It would be my suggestion then we, perhaps, have a vote on the substitute or the alternative that the Republicans would put forward, vote on the House bill, vote on the Senate bill. If there’s no agreement that can be reached on that, Mr. President, we have danced this tune long enough.”

It seems we have reached détente. We’ll see over the next few days who blinks. But a surprising number of aides (and members) on both sides of the aisle  reminded me yesterday that President Bush and Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke do have the authority to act here. If Congress can’t get something passed, the market will take a huge hit, yes. But it would also force Bush or Bernanke to deal with the Big Three since everyone agrees that they also have the power to fix this. And, given the last few weeks (or months or years), dumping the problem in Bush’s lap would produce no small amount of Schadenfreude on both sides of the aisle on Capitol Hill.

Update:
Apparently, Corker and Dodd are sequestered in the Capitol working on a compromise amendment. As you can see in McConnell’s remarks above, Corker’s pretty tough on the UAW. But the union is apparently willing to cede a lot of ground in order to see a deal done. Word is the two are surprisingly close to a deal — though there remains some serious details to be ironed out — and if an agreement is reached the leaders plan to run to the floor with it tonight.

Update2:
They have an agreement and Corker is meeting with the Republican conference right now to see if the GOP can come up with enough votes. If so, they will vote tonight.

Update3:
The talks collapsed over whether the UAW would accept salary parity with other automakers in the U.S. by the end of 2009. The cloture vote to end debate failed 52-35.

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  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    Do my ears deceive me or are the Republicans the ones dictating specific management directives to private industries? Next up, the five-year-plan. Will they next go through the employeee lists themselves to determine who gets laid off?

    Damn commies are taking over!

  • nibblybits

    JNS, since you’ve taken on the auto bailout beat, can you please investigate the additional pork and riders being tacked onto this $15B bill? We’ve heard about the raises for judges. What else is in there and who is attaching them?

  • Paul-no not that one

    Thanks for keeping us updated JNS.
    I’m not sure I would call the situation between the Ds and Rs in the Senate as a détente. More of an impasse.
    But maybe I misread.

  • Jay Newton-Small

    Paul: I was surprised as well! It’s rather like applying Reagan’s approach to Democracy in Latin America: you will be competitive in the open market if we have to kill you to make you so. JNS

  • Andy from MA

    JNS — First, thanks for staying with this story for the last few weeks.
    .
    Paul Dirks, I think there is an incredible irony that these “free market” republicans want to micro manage the auto industry. What they want to do is break the union and/or drive this country into a depression. I think it’s very cagey of Reid to ask the Republicans to belly up to the bar with alternative bill. I also think he should drive (no pun intended) the republican into a filibuster over this issue and make them take the floor to keep this from coming to a vote.
    .
    JNS, when are we going to see the MSM or you start calling the Senate republicans for what they are: Obstructionist, union busting, seditious leaders who want to drive this country into a depression?
    .
    You could even ask their leadership this question:
    “Some say, all you want to do is bust the unions and are unconcerned that killing a bailout would drive this country from a deep recession into a depression. Isn’t it true, that you are soft on the economic security of this nation? Isn’t killing the bailout putting our nation at risk of depression? Aren’t you just being obstructionists?”
    .
    Here I just made your job extemely simple by framing the questions for you. Does anyone have the guts to ask them?

  • FlownOver

    P-nnto: My thought exactly. Hardly détente when the level of disagreement appears to be on the upswing.

    Once again the Senate GOP caucus plays the spoiled child, insisting on getting its way and supporting greater income disparity. Damn the consequences.

  • Joe Bftsplk

    JNS, sorry you’re stuck reporting a story that matters when all the fun is in Springfield, but thanks anyway!

  • Paul-no not that one

    So what is the end game? I hope they can resist the reasonable desire for Schadenfreude and get something done.
    Or at least a stop gap for the next 39 days.
    .
    I don’t see how the republicans can, in the face of the jobs reports, obstruct this without paying a price. The people in The Corner don’t count for very many votes.

  • http://elvisberg.wordpress.com Elvis Elvisberg

    McConnell is, of course, lying, on that number.
    -
    And note that the UAW already agreed to huge cuts in future wages just last year.
    -
    The GOP’s union hatred has nothing to do with anything that happens in the real world. The party is an alliance of the Pharisees and the money-changers, and the money changers call the shots.

  • Paul-no not that one

    Elvis I’m not sure how, but all this will funnel back to Card Check. Dollars to Donuts.

  • wvng
  • bobcn1

    McConnell said: “…it is delusional to think that a company which spends $71 per labor hour could compete with a company in the same industry that spends $49.”
    .
    It truly is delusional. It is delusional to believe that US car companies pay their workers $71 per labor hour. That is a lie. It is intended to smear union workers with the hope of eventually busting the unions.
    .
    As has been pointed out repeatedly, the $71 figure is a dishonest way to blame the UAW for auto industry mismanagement. It’s a phony number that tries to make current workers seem responsible for the pensions of their retired predecessors. It is arrived at by adding the cost of retirees pensions to the hourly compensation of current workers.
    .
    How many hours a current worker works or how much he receives in compensation for his work has absolutely nothing to do with the pensions of retirees he probably has never met. It would make just as much sense to add the cost of pensions to the compensation of the auto industry executives and demand to cut their pay instead.
    .
    I would like to see the Democrats respond by calling the McConnell’s bluff. Offer to let the GOPers vote on an amendment that guarantees that UAW worker will be paid less that $71 per hour in wages and benefits for his own labor. If the GOP still wants to add retiree’s pensions to someone’s compensation, add it to the executive salaries and then cut those.

  • wvng

    Steve Benen says”: Without McConnell’s support, the measure, as passed by the House, won’t be able to withstand a Republican filibuster.
    .
    All right then, Senator Reid. Now is the time to force a real filibuster.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Am I misreading this, or does it seem to anyone else like Republicans are shaking up what is essentially a pretty impressive Union/Management truce born of pragmatism in order to fire the guns of class warfare?

  • Cliff

    But it would also force Bush or Bernanke to deal with the Big Three since everyone agrees that they also have the power to fix this.
    .
    Well that’s a perfect recipe for disaster. If that happens we might as well go knock the car factories down and salt the earth beneath them.

  • FlownOver

    bobcn:
    .
    Well said. Let’s all follow the Republicans’ union-busting lead and solve the auto industry’s problems by cutting the income of workers and retirees. Or by putting the pension responsibility on the backs of the taxpayers.
    .
    Yeah, that’s the ticket. Reduce income. That’s how you get out of a recession.
    .
    Idiots.

  • wvng

    pourme, surely you know it is the Dems who engage in class warfare. The liberal msm has been telling us that for decades.
    .
    How about turning your #14 post into a haiku?

  • Paul-no not that one

    The only difference between this and the early bailouts is the word UNION.
    Well that and the fact that this is a much smaller dollar amount.

  • wvng

    PNNTO, maybe they should have asked for $200b?

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    @wvng – for you:
    out of many – one
    except for union workers
    then, no soup for you!

  • wvng

    poureme. :-)

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    I am half-expecting cup-holder amendments. America loves cup-holders.

  • Andy from MA

    I’d like to see one, just one bleeping reporter, ask the questions I posted above. These Senators ought go on the record for union busting. The unions are not the be all and end all, but the amount of money the Big 3 are asking for in guarantees is just a pittance compared to 350 B that has poured down the rat hole that is the financial industry.

  • bryanfromhouston

    FlownOver,
    -
    Shhh, that is the dirty little secret. Republicans don’t talk about jobs because they have no idea how to create them. Further, they don’t talk about causing the Pension Guaranty Benefits Corp. to go bust or the increase in costs for medicare. It is almost as if they want the country to fall into Depression or set up a situation in which Obama has to sacrifice his last 4 years by raising taxes to ensure the survival of the union!
    -
    WTF! Republicans grow up!

  • Paul-no not that one

    “maybe they should have asked for $200b?”
    .
    Truth. Go big or go home, I guess.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    According to the Big 3, everything was on track for profitability as planned and this is all about the financial crisis. If so, are the Big 3 delusional? McConnell and the Republicans go WAY beyond the facts and relevant stakeholders in laying this so squarely at the feet of labor. Overreaching.

  • bobcn1

    Has McConnell ever gone to the people of Kentucky and described his own senate compensation (per ‘labor year’) as: $169,300 + benefits + (the yearly cost of all retired senators who receive pensions and benefits divided by 100 senators)? Does anyone think he ever will?

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    If the auto industry needs help due to balance sheet pressures created by the unprecedented financial crisis, then I favor begrudgingly giving it to them. This is the truth as agreed upon by the automakers, the union, and Democrats. The Republicans are attempting a sleight of hand by casting this as rescuing manufacturing from a union-created meltdown. Those aren’t the facts as anyone involved has represented them. This is not what the Big 3 showed up and testified about to Congress. There is a huge disconnect between Republican solutions and the agreed-upon problems. Before even getting to the ideological issues, Democrats ought to make clear that McConnell and company seek to go far beyond the narrowly presented issues and engage in a historic level of market intervention. If the Big 3 are doomed without a complete re-haul of their internal cost dynamics, then they are doomed and not creditworthy. No one is making that case except Mitch F***ing McConnell. Let him hang on it.

  • sgwhiteinfla

    pourme
    .
    The funny thing is that labor costs are less than 10 percent of the Big 3 budget. Its kinda like earmarks and John McCain. But if you hear Senator “Mercedes” Shelby or Senator “Nissan” McConnell its all about the labor costs. Guess why the foreign autoworkers get less a month….because they get universal health care. Go figure.

  • bobcn1

    It’s ironic (but very revealing) that the auto industry has opposed one of the most effective ways to reduce their costs — universal health care. This would immediately reduce one of their most substantial ‘legacy costs’ and reduce their current labor costs. It would put them on a competitive footing with foreign auto makers that don’t have to pay health care costs for their workers.
    .
    So why would they oppose it?
    .
    It turns out that auto company executives and insurance company executives sit on each others boards of directors. The executives are taking care of each other. They aren’t going to let what’s good for the company, the shareholders, and the workers interfere with what’s good for themselves.

  • queencersei

    On a side note, the loss of the Big 3 would devestate one region in paticular. A region that while having a high population has been on the economic decline for decades. Is it really in the GOP’s interest to cast thousands more jobs in that region to the winds? I know they have been tilting south for votes, but seriously if they want to win a Presidential election you do need some of those northern states to vote for your person.

  • Andy from MA

    Coffee: There are a large number of non-union jobs (supply chain, outsourcers)that will be eliminated if the GM or any of the big 3 go chapter 11.
    .
    Mitch McConnell is such a wonderful stweard of the public good while his wife, Elaine Chao, is the U.S. Secretary of Labor. Imagine the pillow talk.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    @sgw – Agreed, but I can’t stress enough: if not for the financial crisis, this isn’t happening. At least not now, with all three companies, in such large amounts. Which goes to show you – it’s not about unions. And, if Chrysler alone were to have come calling with no concurrent crisis – fugheddaboutit. There would have been no support for a taxpayer rescue of Cerberus Capital. Now, it is an opportunity to get some things right now that we’re in it – but it’s not credible to make this about labor. It’s not.

  • bobcn1

    sgwhiteinfla wrote: ‘The funny thing is that labor costs are less than 10 percent of the Big 3 budget.’
    .
    Exactly. I wish nearly as many people were aware of the true labor cost number as have been deceived by the $70/hr lie. Journalists, are you listening?
    .
    pourmecoffee — well said.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    I only have a few more minutes of goofing off time, and it occurs to me that I have short-changed the limerick in favor of haiku. This will not stand!
    -
    There once was an old man named Mitch (1)
    Who drove us all into a ditch
    He blocked the car bailout
    And let all the fail out
    Harry Reid, please make him your bi**h!
    -
    Chrylser, Ford, and GM
    All cried, “Oh, Auntie ‘Em!”
    The

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Can’t finish the unfinished one – have a 3:30 meeting. You get the idea.

  • nibblybits

    Market’s tanking again since 1:30 when it became clear the votes weren’t there in the Senate.

  • wvng

    bobcn1: Exactly. I wish nearly as many people were aware of the true labor cost number as have been deceived by the $70/hr lie. Journalists, are you listening? I challenged KT on this the other day, and she pointed me to a TIME article that got it right. And the NYTimes had a fine article yesterday. I think the problem is pundits who spread it, and pundits who fail to correct wingers who say it.

  • Andy from MA

    wvng: you are very correct!

  • 53_3

    Well, at least there is consistancy on this planet.
    .
    Mountains are still built by tectonic forces, and Republicans are staying the course…

  • sgwhiteinfla

    Looks like McConnell and Demint both let slip that they are really opposing the Auto Rescue to bust the unions. Now if only there was a MSM type who could report on their statements….
    .
    http://firedoglake.com/2008/12/11/republican-senator-admits-opposition-to-auto-bill-is-all-about-union-busting-compares-uaw-to-parasites/

  • carotexas1

    This is the same childish behavior that the Republican Senators showed during the first bailout.
    .
    President Bush understands what this could mean to the economy. Why he thought the Republican Senators would welcome his efforts to make this tough on the Big Three is amazing to me.
    .
    This could have been avoided if he had just done this under the original bailout.
    .
    I hope the Democrats do not give them one inch on this.

  • wvng

    I hope the Democrats do not give them one inch on this. They must be made to do a real filibuster!

  • sgwhiteinfla

    wvng
    .
    If Harry Reid doesn’t force a filibuster he should be tossed out on his ass and thats for real. Even thinking in political terms picture this, if the Republicans actually vote against this rescue for the Big 3 they won’t get a vote from Michigan Ohio or Indiana for a generation or more. They will effectively concede those three states in every presidency for the next 20 years or so. Now honestly I think the rescue needs to go through because that idiot Bush won’t have the foresight to see that if it doesn’t he HAS to step in and that will put our entire economy at risk. But if it doesn’t get passed it at least needs to be voted on so people have to be on the record. Right now the Republicans are trying to sell a dream that they have a viable alternative. Thats bullsh!t because the corner stone of their alternative is nothing more than union busting and they know it. Nothing in their alternative bill will make one lick of difference and will end up putting the Big 3 in Chapter 11 when it is all said and done. A filibuster must be forced!

  • davemc321

    Chrylser, Ford, and GM/
    All cried, “Oh, Auntie ‘Em!/
    “If we don’t get cash quite quickly,/
    “The economy will grow more sickly”/
    To which the GOP said “Screw them.”
    .
    OK. I’ll stop now and wait patiently for pourme’s return.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    I’m really feeling it today. Possibly related to deadline procrastination.
    Interactive Car Bailout Haiku Special!
    Wither our heroes?
    Toby Keith and Bob Seger
    Save us, car rockers!

  • davemc321

    Meanwhile, in crazy Dimint Land: Steve Benen reports the esteemed senator/wack-o from North Carolina sees riots in the future if we bail out the Big 3. Yes, riots.
    .
    “We’re going to have riots. There are already people rioting because they’re losing their jobs when somebody else is being bailed out. The fairness of it becomes more and more evident as we go along. Because the auto companies may be hurting there are very few companies that aren’t hurting and are gonna hurt. We don’t have enough money to bail everyone out.”
    .
    Did I miss a riot while at lunch?

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    @davemc – Much obliged for finishing!
    Last one and then I’m going home.
    Rod Blagojevich abused his power
    In a scandal which grows by the hour
    While this leaves me quite scared
    It is nothing compared
    To my dread of Mistress Pfotenhauer

  • wvng
  • bobcn1

    From wvng’s link above: “This is what happens when you become a political party with no spine. Bullies stand up to you because they know they can. It’s time to show them that they can’t, or the next 4 years of the Obama administration are going to be one GOP filibuster after another…”
    .
    Amen.

  • viciousmaniac

    Bailout is a waste
    No one will buy the Big 3′s cars
    Anyway; The End

  • shepherdwong

    “McConnell is, of course, lying, on that number.”
    .
    Um…Republican.?! They all are, about everything (it’s what they do):
    .
    Nancy Pelosi will be designing cars.
    .
    They are unconvinced the bill will create viable companies when those companies were perfectly viable before the credit market crashed and people stopped buying cars from everyone.
    .
    Making up bullsh*t numbers and comparing apples to oranges about labor costs.
    .
    Insisting that labor concessions are needed after labor has already agreed to steep sacrifices (again).
    .
    All this Serious Consternation, for $15 billion to save the bleeping US auto industry after signing off on $700 billion to Wall Street bankers (who still haven’t shown that they are viable lending organizations), practically delivered with a big, sloppy, wet one.
    .
    The trouble is, we’re the ones who have to say they are lying because the people who are paid to tell us they are lying refuse to do so. That is, once they’ve publicized the lie at face value in the first place. Fortunately for the republic, they seem to matter less by the day.

  • sgwhiteinfla

    yeah, only those 17 million a month that WERE buying them before the financial crisis hit. But hey whats a few tens of million here or there, let them burn!

  • wvng

    Chapter and Verse from Olberman:
    .
    Beleaguered bailout faces death by GOP

    Dec. 11: After the House passed the $15 billion auto bailout bill, with stronger support than expected, Senate Republicans announced their intentions to kill it. Newsweek’s Daniel Gross discusses the speed bumps the auto bailout bill is facing and whether they are just plain nonsense.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/vp/28184396#28184396

  • wvng
  • http://elvisberg.wordpress.com Elvis Elvisberg

    The cloture vote to end debate failed 52-35.
    -
    JNS, please call a filibuster a filibuster.

  • sgwhiteinfla

    wvng
    .
    You know where I stand. Harry Reid has to go. The fact that this sorry azzed spineless muthaphucka is sitting up here praising Shelby and Corker should put the nails in his coffin if it needed any more. I can promise you that in the am I will have a “sermon” on why he needs to be replaced IMMEDIATELY. I don’t want to hear sh!t about him not having any power either. When you are the leader and people spit in your face you don’t blow them kisses, you destroy their azzes and he doesn’t have the courage for that.

  • Jay Newton-Small

    Elvis: to prevent a filibuster. Happy? I do often say it that way — I just like to mix it up so I’m not repeating the same phrase over and over. JNS

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Before I go to bed, I would just like to say that I am SICK TO DEATH of legislators thanking and congratulating themselves and one another IN THE WAKE OF ABJECT FAILURE. Where else can you get way with this? I cannot stomach another round of solemn thanks coming from the middle of a pile of rubble. These people are failing so hard out of their failholes and they should be humiliated not congratulated. Argh!

  • shepherdwong

    “Elvis: to prevent a filibuster. Happy? I do often say it that way — I just like to mix it up so I’m not repeating the same phrase over and over. JNS”

    Well, there’s always obstructionism.

  • viciousmaniac

    They are unconvinced the bill will create viable companies when those companies were perfectly viable before the credit market crashed and people stopped buying cars from everyone.
    .
    Ugh, “perfectly viable”? No offense, and I agree that Republicans are scum, but that’s not correct.
    .
    Daimler paid $650 million to get away from Chrysler (and the supposed $18 billion they were going to eventually owe in pensions). The merger was regarded as the worst ever to occur in the industry. That’s viable?
    .
    60 percent of GM’s sales were global in ’07, a new record. And they still lost $40 billion that year. This is due in large part to no one here buying their cars. Even now, they are still desperate to dump brands like Hummer, and no one’s buying. I should dig up the TIME story on this site about the reporter in the Hummer getting flipped off repeatedly here in Silverlake, Los Angeles. ’07 was to be their turn-around year after decades of bad performance, btw. So much for that idea.
    .
    Even Ford fell behind Volkswagon. Volks-freaking-wagon.
    .
    It’s true all automakers (pretty much every industry, almost) are not doing well because of the recession. But the Big 3′s performance has been for quite some time fake, borrowed, and a model of wretched excess, and nothing more, like most everything in this era. It was about deluding the public into believing that a cost-inefficient, gas-guzzling, accident-prone, high-maintenance truck/SUV was the only car that is worth anything, then pursuing the short-term profit and corporate perks while slashing manufacturing here in the States.
    .
    They already have a terrible reputation and some of them decades of poor performance. And now a bailout? Sorry, no one is going to buy their cars. I don’t care how much you pound your fists in anger along with Keith Olbermann and rant about Republicans. And if no one buys the cars, you will not save the jobs, short term or long.
    .
    This assumes a depression won’t hit regardless of what happens, which is sure to be if China calls in its debt. Which in turn is likely if the exports in China continue to drop, causing the peasants over there to finally start revolting over their lost jobs.
    .
    What we should do is take the money and revolutionize transportation again, as did Eisenhower with the Interstate Highway. Something beyond the automobile, an invention that a few sociologists contend, and I agree, has been pretty horrible with respect towards urban planning, environment and social fabric (urban sprawl, smog, gridlock, vehicular crime, class warfare, unfair or discriminatory car loans, etc.) I personally can’t believe it’s 2008 and I’m still puttering around in LA traffic. If you had told the 6-year old version of me back in the ’80s, he wouldn’t have believed it.
    .
    So instead we are p!ssing the money away towards a mob of corporations that are notoriously incompetent and ruthless. The Ford Pinto. GM killing mass transit in Los Angeles. Bob Lutz calling global warming a “crock of ****”. Ruthless job cuts and outsourcing. The same commentators outraged about Lieberman walking free want to bailout these villains. Pretty funny.
    .
    And screw that union too. They aren’t the victims/heroes Rachel and Keith make them out to be. Sure, they made tough concessions….on the backs of the young workers entering the job pool. The seniors, as always in this country, walk off with the real loot while the young truly pays and sacrifices. F’em.
    .
    I love ya guys, but what’s this really about to you? Fighting it out with Republicans over unions? Nodding your heads to whatever Keith, Rachel, and “insert lefty blogger” says? Are there at least any principles of your own here?
    .
    End rant. Thanks for reading.

  • viciousmaniac

    Heh, and speaking of the bailout, looks like your friends, the Republicans, won this round:

    http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/12/11/auto.bailout/index.html

  • bobcn1

    In the next six weeks we will spend another $15 billion in Iraq. That money could have been spent to save millions of American jobs.
    .
    The GOPers have no problem opposing a bailout of the American auto industry during the financial crisis. You won’t hear a peep from them about wasting the same amount of money in Iraq, however.
    .
    It’s very revealing that the GOPers insist on capping UAW workers wages to the amount earned by Americans working in non-union Japanese owned American auto plants. I’m ok with that condition, given the circumstances. But why not cap the executive salaries as well? Class warfare maybe? Or merely an attack on unions? For example: Wagoner (GM CEO) was scheduled to earn over $8 million. By contrast, Toyota’s CEO will make $900 thousand.

  • kathy

    bob – good point. I am so freaking outraged at this. Republican senators from the south are engaged in a trade war with Detroit, and their states subsidize their foreign owned car factories.
    .
    Apparently today’s workers have to pay for the pension costs of all past Big 3 workers in order to bring the cost down per worker.
    .
    I hope this kills the Republican party if they let the big 3 go down. Here’s news for them. Their states may be the only ones building cars, but there won’t be any customers with money to buy them.
    .
    My local news is saying the deal went down when the workers refused to take “pay cuts.” aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh

  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    Am I the only one who sees something inherently wrong with attacking the pensions of people who are already retired? It’s not like their in a position to address any sudden drops in income.

  • newfloridian

    Does anyone out there realize that if the Republicans succeed in killing GM, Ford and Chrysler that their action also kills off NASCAR? Isn’t the base of the Republican party the good ol’ boy NASCAR vote? Having followed and attended many Daytona 500′s and 400′s, I can tell you the Chevy vans are absolutely rabid fans. They live and breathe Chevy and Earnhardt, etc. To kill off Chevy will absolutely light up these fans. When the Senator from North Carolina says there will be riots he’s right, only it’s going to be his former supporters looking for Republicans.

    The Republican Party mishandled the Hispanic vote by going anti-Hispanic and they will destroy the last base of their support the NASCAR fan if GM fails.

  • sgwhiteinfla

    Paul Dirks
    .
    To your point, not only will the Big 3 going down affect their workers and the parts suppliers and on down the line, its also going to affect the retirees because of their health care dissappearing and the pensions being slashed or eliminated. So imagine for a minute that half of all the fired current workers get into trouble with their mortgage, what about the retirees who are beyond going out and getting a job to replace their pensions? What do you think is going to happen to their mortgages? And what is the underlying cause of the financial crisis in the country? Say it with me folks.
    .
    The housing crisis.
    .
    If this country makes it through the depression that the Republicans have just tried to push us in, I don’t think they will win another election ever. That is of course IF people aren’t convinced that it was the Democrats fault since Harry Reid didn’t force a filibuster.

  • newfloridian

    One of the great things about viciousmaniac is that he doen’t care about anyone except himself.

  • wvng

    sgw, note what kathy said above: My local news is saying the deal went down when the workers refused to take “pay cuts.” Perhaps they even said they made $73/hr. The repugs will do everything they can to put this on the backs of the unions.
    .
    viscious makes a lot of good points up above, that many would probably agree with if the consequences of the big 3 failing in this economic environment weren’t so severe.
    .
    To show it is not just Repugs in this country, from AmericaBlog: There’s an extraordinary — and extraordinarily depressing — interview in Newsweek with Peer Steinbrueck, the Germany finance minister. The world economy is in a terrifying nosedive, visible everywhere. Yet Mr. Steinbrueck is standing firm against any extraordinary fiscal measures, and denounces Gordon Brown for his “crass Keynesianism.”

  • wvng

    The vote was 52-35, with 10 repubs voting for. That means 10 Dems either voted against or abstained. Who are they? Baucus, McCaskill? Who else?

  • wvng

    In the interest of lowering blood pressure a bit, from Sully’s place,

  • shepherdwong

    “They already have a terrible reputation and some of them decades of poor performance. And now a bailout? Sorry, no one is going to buy their cars. I don’t care how much you pound your fists in anger along with Keith Olbermann and rant about Republicans.”
    .
    Well that depends on what they make, doesn’t it? GM and Chrysler alone sold 12 million vehicles in 2005 (many of those “cost-inefficient, gas-guzzling, accident-prone, high-maintenance truck/SUV[s]“) for a total revenue of $250billion. “Viable” means capable of surviving and the big three have every chance to do that if they survive this credit crisis and recession, restructure some things and start building cars that fit our energy future, no matter how much you pound you fists and rant about what Keith Olberman said (fixate much?).
    .
    And, please, don’t make me defend the American automakers ever again.

  • shepherdwong

    Oh, and it would become exponentially easier for them to survive if we were to take the worker healthcare obligation off their backs like every other industrialized nation on earth.

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