7 Things That Could Go Wrong On Election Day

From this week’s TIME cover story, currently residing at a mailbox/supermarket/airport near you.

We can go to the moon, split atoms to power submarines, squeeze profits from a 99 cent hamburger and watch football highlights on cell phones. But the most successful democracy in human history has yet to figure out how to conduct a proper election. As it stands, the American voting system is a worrisome mess, a labyrinth of local, state and federal laws spotted with bewildered volunteers, harried public officials, partisan distortions, misdesigned forms, malfunctioning machines and polling-place confusion. Each time, problems pop up on the margins; if the election is close, these problems matter a great deal. Republicans and Democrats predict record turnouts, perhaps 130 million people, including millions who have never voted before. The vast majority will cast their votes without a hitch. But some voters will find themselves at the mercy of registration rolls that have been poorly maintained or, in some cases, improperly handled. Others will endure long lines, too few voting machines and observers who challenge their identities. Long a prerogative of local government, the patchwork of election rules often defies logic. A convicted felon can vote in Maine, but not in Virginia. A government-issued photo ID is required of all voters at the polls in Indiana, but not in New York. Voting lines are shorter in the suburbs, and the rules governing when provisional ballots count sometimes vary from state to state. As Americans cast their ballots on Nov. 4, here are some problems that threaten to throw this election to the courts again.

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    The Phony War: Obama and Romney Are Debating Character, Not Policy

    More than five months from Election Day, the back-and-forth about Mitt Romney’s record at Bain already feels played out. Unfortunately, there’s good reason to expect the campaign continues in this vein indefinitely. Neither Barack Obama nor Mitt Romney are terribly interested in dwelling on policy platforms. Romney’s plan to slash spending and keep taxes low on the wealthy isn’t especially popular, at least not at any level of detail beyond a blithe promise to shrink the deficit. Meanwhile, Obama’s signature first-term achievements, like health care, the stimulus and Wall Street reform, are all unpopular or tricky to sell. (The Dodd-Frank bill is the most popular of these, but hyping it means offending wealthy donors.) So what we’re getting instead is a superficial duel about character–and, worse, one that’s based on the largely false premise that the better man can better “manage” the economy back to health.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    A bill in Congress that would mandate paper records of all machines nationwide has gathered 216 co-sponsors, including 20 Republicans.

    This says, succinctly, what is never said explicitly. Every single barrier to people exercising their franchise can be laid at the door of the Republicans trying to limit ballot access. This is a key part of Republican electoral strategy, is being played out more brazenly than ever before in this cycle, and the result is…..

    A TIME story that raises the possibility of questionable results is the upshot.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    In the intervening months, the elderly sisters have all had a chance to get government identification.

    But did they? How did they? How much time and effort did it take?

    You decide, but don’t report.

  • trifecta

    High turnout has always been the enemy of Republican chances. Why do you think that is Michael?

  • michaelscherer

    jay, the line about the sisters getting id was edited out for space. What happened was the Indiana DMV sent a mobile ID service over to where the nuns live. All who want IDs now have them.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    Thanks, MS. I retract the complaint, and apologize.

  • gysgt213

    Space constraints on the internet’s? Get bigger tubes.

  • trifecta

    I am predicting 359 Obama 179 McCain. 252 Democratic house seats. 57 Senate seats. Anybody else wanna guess?

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    gunny–the article reprints the hard copy. I agree they should post a more complete, web only version that get linked to.

  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    MS:

    I know that people reflexively give you a hard time but there are two areas where I just want to thank you for your involvement. The first is of course the voting rights/disenfranchisment issue covered in the current article. The other is your attention to the right of protest and the difficulties with law-enforcment overreach. I may not agree with you about the relative dishonesty of the two campaigns. But I appreciate your attention to Civil Liberties.

  • gysgt213

    Sure it repeats the hard copy and there you do have space constraits. But I guess it takes editorial and publishing genius to understand when you can use your available tools to offer more.

  • trifecta

    I am trying hard to not reflexively flame MS. I just disagree with his take on things. MS tries to be honest. He does do good on civil liberties issues.

    I do think that perhaps he got too caught up with the campaign he is covering. People who are covering Obama probably fall into the same trap. Viva democracy.

  • andyfrommassachusetts

    Of course number 8 would be McCain/Palin wins.
    Good story MS

  • wvng

    Jay said: “This says, succinctly, what is never said explicitly. Every single barrier to people exercising their franchise can be laid at the door of the Republicans trying to limit ballot access. This is a key part of Republican electoral strategy, is being played out more brazenly than ever before in this cycle, and the result is…..”

    MS, you might consider that a challenge. It would be bracing to have a msm article with chattering class followup that laid out, specifically and quantitatively, how the approaches of Dems and Repugs impact the opportunity of American citizens to vote and have their votes counted. This is a particularly useful time to do this, as the Bush DOJ spent years trying to prove that actual voter fraud occurs and came up empty:

    — David Becker was a lawyer in the Bush Justice Department’s voting rights section, which was part of the administration’s aggressive anti-vote-fraud effort. “The Justice Department really made prosecution of voter fraud of this sort a big priority in the first half of this decade, and they really didn’t come up with anything. There’s no evidence that any of these invalid registrations lead to any invalid votes.”

    — Republican National Committee General Counsel Sean Cairncross has said he is unaware of a single improper vote cast because of bad cards submitted in the course of a voter-registration effort.

    — Republican campaign consultant Royal Masset says, “[I]n-person voter fraud is nonexistent. It doesn’t happen, and … makes no sense because who’s going to take the risk of going to jail on something so blatant that maybe changes one vote?”

    So, MS, what say you?

  • Ohg Rea Tone

    Ask Sarah Palin what could go wrong – she would suggest the communists interfered. ………..

    http://thefiresidepost.com/2008/10/26/plain-heading-to-communism/

  • andyfrommassachusetts

    Testing…why are all my comments being held?

  • Paul-no not that one

    Here is what the Democrats are up against in Minnesota.
    Our last Republican Sec of State is now involved in a voter suppression group called Minnesota Majority. They are “caging” which is against the law in Minnesota.
    And the republican candidate for the 3rd district has these instructions for their Designated Challengers -quoting directly- “your duties are 1) observe 2) deter 3) challenge.”
    .
    A lot of republicans dislike democracy.

  • dfh3

    Off Topic:
    AMC is begging for money over on her blog. How sad.
    http://anamariecox.typepad.com/ana_marie_cox/2008/10/rate-card.html

  • Paul-no not that one

    dfh3 that IS sad. I would almost be tempted is not for the contempt she has shown for her readership.
    I did laugh when I saw this at the end of that beg.
    “The comments to this entry are closed.”

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    The other is your attention to the right of protest and the difficulties with law-enforcment overreach. I may not agree with you about the relative dishonesty of the two campaigns. But I appreciate your attention to Civil Liberties.

    I second that emotion.

    And, on the coverage in TIME, this is not Michael’s problem as much as the media’s in general. There is deep resistance to calling the Republicans on the use of the Southern Strategy and on the use of voter suppression as a key tactic.

    This article is a perfect example. It could easily have been titled ” Republicans Bring All Methods to Bear to Lower Turnout” and written that way. ACORN could have been characterized as an attempt to delegitimize a voting bloc with the note that there is no plausible path for voter fraud stemming from this. The other six issues are all barriers of one sort or another erected by Republicans at either the federal or the state level.

    This is not a trivial framing of this issue; it’s central to functioning representative government that the franchise be exercised readily.

  • trifecta

    I will not bash AMC either. It’s a new vow. Nor will I bash Jay Carney. Only when they post something dumb will I mock them, no more bashing on general principle sake.

  • http://www.ghostnote.com Cookie Puss

    They still print the magazine?

  • trifecta

    Jay, it’s part of the flawed he said/she said reporting style. JNS wrote about the AP trying to break that mold this time. Of course Fournier messed things up with his unethical behavior. There is no way he should have covered this campaign bashing first Romney, then Clinton and Obama after he had months of discussions about joining team McCain.

    I do like the concept of the new model though.

  • wvng

    Hmmmmm. I don’t know if you all have noticed it. But obamish and texte and NoBraina et al have been notably missing since the onset of moderation.

    I wonder why oh why that could be?

  • stillcaseymorris

    We can go to the moon, split atoms to power submarines, squeeze profits from a 99 cent hamburger and watch football highlights on cell phones. But the most successful democracy in human history has yet to figure out how to conduct a proper election.

    I am not reflexively trying to dis MS here. I am purposefully doing it.

    The most successful democracy in human history knows damn well how to conduct a proper election. You misidentify the problem.

    The problem is that a certain portion of the participants in the most successful democracy in human history have a compelling interest in continuing in its misconduct of proper elections.

    Absent the proper deterrents, say multibillion dollar fines and mandatory twenty year prison terms, I imagine things will continue pretty much as they always have, don’t you, Mike?

  • 53_3

    As far as methods used by Republicans to disenfranchise voters, remember that they have done their best to impede early voting in many states.
    .
    And of course, the “Civil Rights” division of the DOJ was perverted to address only voter registration irregularies among minority voters.
    .
    The Repubs are the biggest single obstacle to democracy in this country. I’m hoping that after Obama takes office, the Dems can bring charges against Carl Rove and Rush Limbaugh.
    .
    “There is deep resistance to calling the Republicans on the use of the Southern Strategy and on the use of voter suppression as a key tactic.
    .
    This is exactly true.

  • Paul-no not that one

    McCain on Meet the Press, responding to a question about Rush saying that the Powell endorsement was “all about race”, said he was proud to have the endorsement of 5 former Sec of State.
    .
    He started to tick them off and then couldn’t remember one. It’s more sad than anything at this point.

  • 53_3

    You know, there’s 8+ days left.
    .
    I’m going to be glad that the election in this nasty presidential race will finally be over.
    .
    And it’s going to be the ultimate irony that the one demographic that the GOP has turned up it’s nose at may be the one that puts an end to the GOP as a party.
    .
    Now that would be icing on the cake!

  • rose83

    Did anyone see the CNN report on voting machines yesterday? It’s very disturbing. I’m confident (Okay, not confident. Optimistic) that Obama’s lead will be too big for malfunctioning machines to play a role, but this is a long-term problem. A Princeton Professor in NJ was able to hack into a voting machine in 7 minutes, and yes, there are many unattended voting machines. The worst thing though is that the voting people tried to suppress the tape of the Princeton Professor, and only released it when a NJ court ordered them to.
    Again, I don’t think this will cause problems this year. But it could be problematic in the next 2000-like election. Changing the voting systems has to be one of the main priorities for Obama in the WH.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Election? Can’t we just agree in advance to whatever the final Zogby poll is?

  • wvng

    Did you all notice that Palin’s home state paper endorsed Obama:

    “Yet despite her formidable gifts, few who have worked closely with the governor would argue she is truly ready to assume command of the most important, powerful nation on earth. To step in and juggle the demands of an economic meltdown, two deadly wars and a deteriorating climate crisis would stretch the governor beyond her range. Like picking Sen. McCain for president, putting her one 72-year-old heartbeat from the leadership of the free world is just too risky at this time.”
    http://www.adn.com/opinion/story/567867.html

    Contrast that to Obama’s home town paper:

    “We have known Obama since he entered politics a dozen years ago. We have watched him, worked with him, argued with him as he rose from an effective state senator to an inspiring U.S. senator to the Democratic Party’s nominee for president. We have tremendous confidence in his intellectual rigor, his moral compass and his ability to make sound, thoughtful, careful decisions. He is ready.
    . . .
    Obama has risen with his honor, grace and civility intact. He has the intelligence to understand the grave economic and national security risks that face us, to listen to good advice and make careful decisions.”
    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/chi-chicago-tribune-endorsement,0,1371034.story

    Anyone notice a difference?

  • wvng

    Pleased to see that two of my comments are awaiting moderation. One at 10:01, the other at 11:05. I understand the need, but it does make timely participation in conversations difficult.

  • lynnanne

    It seems odd we continue to live with a third-world voting system, especially after the 2000 debacle, but I kind of think some of the resistance to a unified, streamlined, high-tech system (other than cost) is fear of tampering. It kind of generates a Luddite-like impulse in me; I mean, sure, hanging chads are ridiculous and absurd, but the thought of Diebold tampering on a nationwide basis is downright terrifying. I’ve simply chosen not to believe reports from W. Va. about votes on computerized screens being automatically switched to McCain. “Just user error — a slip of the finger,” I tell myself, or otherwise I will go insane.

    On a completely different topic, do you have any insight, Michael, as to why McCain is focused so heavily on Pennsylvania? It would seem he is much close in other states, so why Pa.? Does his internal polling show something different? Is it because Pa. doesn’t have early voting (and, thus, he thinks he still has a chance?)

  • lynnanne

    wait, AMC is soliciting funds to follow McCain on the trail? Is this because Radar folded? will Time not pay her way? So confusing, but, really, AMC (I mean, Red), I’m sure Team McCain will waive the fees for you.

  • gysgt213

    lynnanne,

    I went over and threw AMC a couple of bones. It is because Radar folded and I thinks she just blogs here at Time now and is not on staff. According to her twitter from yesterday she was over 75% of the way to being there on election night.

  • ivb3016

    lynnanne, living in PA I am curious as to why McCain has focused here because Nate Silver has PA as safe Dem and shows no current polls with McCain in the lead. From what I have read it the lack of early voting is one reason. The other is that they think they have a chance with the women in the Phila suburbs (which they must win big in order to win) where there was a lot of Hillary support. I have received several mailings from a Republican group that are very nasty toward Obama. I think they are misjudging the antipathy women have for Palin.
    .
    They may also be assuming that they will be able to sway the white voters in the west who voted for Hillary, but the only case they are making is Not Obama and I think that hurts in this economic climate.

  • ivb3016

    One comment at 11:53 in moderation. Have no idea why. This is really inhibiting discussion.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Suggestion: Assume it will take a day or two to get moderation and other tweaks fixed.

  • cfukara

    MS:
    ” .. But the most successful democracy in human history ..”
    Reading MS’s pieces can be a chore.
    For instance, what are we to make of the tag “most successful”?
    And would I, Cheney, Kissinger and a Mother Teresa concur on what it means?

    More kids, women, men dead in Iraq and Afghanistan overnight. That is democracy in action.
    What would MS mean by “democracy”?

  • Ohg Rea Tone

    No matter what happens at the polls, the Republican Party is in decline. They have forgotten the virtues of the GOP. ………………..

    http://thefiresidepost.com/2008/10/26/republicans-intellectual-or-joe-six-pack/

  • wvng

    FYI, my two comments awaiting moderation were on: 1) (10:01) suggesting that MS do a truly quantitative exploration of the impact of each party’s approach to expanding/inhibiting voting, which included quotes from repubs; and 2) (11:05) contrasting home town endorsements for Palin and Obama, which included two links.

  • kathy

    trifecta – I’ll be happy to go with your guess. (I think that is just about Nate Silver’s. he has 349 in the summary, but 375 or so is the most frequent simulation result.) I’d love at least 1 more in the senate, but don’t see it happening.

  • cfukara

    dfh3 Says:
    ” Off Topic: AMC is begging for money over on her blog. How sad. ”
    Why do you hate capitalism?
    Sen bama w3ants your $10. Before you know it he is on his way to a billion dollars.
    [Call it the "principle of aggregation"(TM). And the fabulously wealthy Vatican has been very successful at it over the years - by steadily and persistently taking away dimes from millions of frail, sick old grandmas who are scared of their impending death (and re-incarnation?).]

  • rose83

    Did anyone see Elizabeth Hasselback with Palin in Florida? The McCain campaign is parodying itself. Although to be fair, Palin actually did look uncomfortable. It’s the first time I’ve seen her look embarrassed by her own campaign.

  • kathy

    wvng – I haven’t seen any pattern at all to the comments that have been put in moderation. Totaly innocuous comments have landed there.

  • rose83

    kathy and wvng, yes I’m in moderation right now for absolutely no reason.

  • jennofark

    We can go to the moon, split atoms to power submarines, squeeze profits from a 99 cent hamburger and watch football highlights on cell phones. But the most successful democracy in human history has yet to figure out how to conduct a proper election.

    You might follow this up by mentioning that it’s because we have one party, the one that’s been in control of everything for most of the decade, that doesn’t want us to be able to conduct proper elections. Because when we do, they lose. The simple fact is that the biggest issues with the current system could be resolved by going back to the simple paper ballot. It would eliminate hacking, long lines for voting machines, etc etc etc – plus it has the added bonus of being inexpensive. Many of those of us in states where electronic machines are being used have already figured out how to get around the hacking issue – by voting absentee on a good old-fashioned paper ballot. Sometimes, the old ways are best.

  • cfukara

    rose83 Says:
    ” .. kathy and wvng, yes I’m in moderation right now for absolutely no reason. “

    “Weep not child”

  • ivb3016

    lynnanne, my comment in moderation gives my point of view about McCain in PA. Right now I’m listening to This American Life on NPR which is all about PA and interviewing people on the ground. You can listen to it by going to http://www.thisamericanlife.org/

  • wvng

    “Weep not child.”

    I do not weep. But perhaps we should start a new blog to carry on discussions that we would like to carry on here but cannot because we are in moderation limbo.

    We could call it “In Moderation.”

    I do understand that the High Sheriffs are working their way through this process, and I do truly appreciate the fact that they finally took this step. May I humbly suggest that such a step requires, perhaps, a dedicated moderator?

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Sad Shark must have comments in moderation, too. He’s so sad.

  • wvng

    Hmmm. And ivb3016′s post indicates that the presence of a hyperlink is not a factor in and of itself.

    For someone with unlimited time on their hands and no life, this could be, like, a game.

  • dfh3

    Gunny, did you give enough money to get Ana to as John McCain your question?

  • gysgt213

    dfh3,

    No but, I gave enough she can’t say we slugs here don’t give a crap about her.

  • wvng

    Hmmmm. And gunny’s latest indicates that words that wouldn’t pass muster before make it through.

  • gysgt213

    Via Scully’s
    .
    A McCain insider told The Post that relations between Palin and some of the campaign aides with her have soured. “She’s lost faith with the staff. She knows the $150,000 wardrobe story damaged her,” the insider said. But the novice vice-presidential candidate is partly to blame, the campaign official sniped.
    .
    “She’s an adult. She didn’t ask questions about where the clothes came from?” the source said. “She’s now positioning herself for her own future. Of course, this is bad for John. It looks like no one is in charge.”

    http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/10/palin-vs-mcca-1.html

  • incandenzah

    In Scherer’s article, he writes: “Yet the problem of registration fraud is age-old…. The problem is that a small fraction of those new voters don’t exist.”

    I’m still trying to figure out why fraudulent voter registrations are any threat to elections or voting or democracy at all. If this age-old “problem” results in a “small fraction” of nonexistent voters, I’m not really sure I see a “problem” here at all?

    What am I missing?

  • rose83

    gysgt213, apparently the RNC didn’t have to specifically cite/label the clothing expenses. Which raises some questions about why exactly the information was released. Maybe it was just incompetence, or maybe they actually want to make her look bad. It also makes her actions more understandable – why not take the free clothes if there are no consequences?

  • kathy

    incandenzah – silly, you’re not missing anything. The Republicans just take any opportunity at all to raise the specter of fear that Democrats are going to win.

  • kathy

    This is an opinion piece worth reading- in the anchorage daily news- about SP and witchcraft.

    http://www.adn.com/opinion/story/567096.html

  • cfukara

    gysgt213 Says:
    “She’s an adult. She didn’t ask questions about where the clothes came from?” ..”
    Sen Ted Stevens of Alaska didn’t ask the same question about the gifts and favors. Alaskans do not look a gift horse in the mouth. Stevens is being maligned by jealous bad socialists who pal around with bad people who don’t love America. Those giving Stevens and Palin gifts and favors are good Americans who love this country.

    Palin wants to clean up Washington of waste, cronyism, bribery and corruption. But she has to get there first.
    Those complaining about her clothes (fit for a frugal hockey-mom) are the jealous communist people who would love to have the same.
    ——off topic, maybe
    Joe Lieberman tells us that a presidential candidate’s past associations, however tangential, helps us to know who he/she “will listen to when they get into office”.
    Joe, do you remember McCain’s association with a stripper called “Marie, the Flame of Florida”? Maybe you don’t want to know the extent of McCain’s shady associations that he would bring into the policy-making institutions.
    How about Hagee, Parsley and Fallwell?
    Rick Renzi? Do you remember McCain’s financial guru – the foreign agent/lobbyist called Phil Graham of the “Americans are hallucinating about a recession” fame?
    And do you remember McCain’s years of close association with communists?

  • dfh3

    Kathy,
    Palin’s nomination as VP is the culmination of a strategy by the religious right that began 30 years ago. Fawell et al encouraged a bottom up strategy. They started with taking over school boards and local city counsels. Than state assemblies and state houses. That is exactly how Palin’s political career was launched.

  • ivb3016

    kathy, thanks for the link to that opinion piece. I wasn’t aware of a lot of that. I also clicked on another link on that page and read the paper’s endorsement of Obama. Hope that makes an impact.

  • ivb3016

    Michael, are you aware that comments go into moderation for no apparent reason and you need to liberate them? A nuisance that we are hoping the sheriffs will be able to fix soon.

  • cfukara

    cfukara Says: Your comment is awaiting moderation.
    October 26th, 2008 at 2:24 pm
    ” .. Joe Lieberman tells us that a presidential candidate’s past associations, however tangential, helps us to know who he/she will listen to when they get into office. …. And do you remember McCain’s years of close association with communists? ”
    Perhaps Joe Lieberman should enlighten us regarding which category of associations we should be afraid of – and whether the indictment applies to all candidates across the board.

  • deeincolumbiamd

    gysgt213, apparently the RNC didn’t have to specifically cite/label the clothing expenses.

    Well when you consider the other story that was being promoted that day and that it got trounced in favor of fashiongate, it may have very well been a deliberate attempt to prevent the Republican engendered systematic voter suppression story from taking off.

  • kathy

    ivb – mudflats has had a lot more information about SP’s complicated religious affiliations. I think they’re the principal reason McCain’s not bringing up Wright. And since SP doesn’t think there’s anything to take exception to in her religious background, she thinks it’s important to go after Obama’s religious experience.

  • kathy

    There’s a breaking story that US helicopters have gone into a Syrian village and killed 8 people (confirmed on Israeli television). Do we really need another reminder of how dangerous it would be to have McCain in charge of the US military? Let’s start another war.

  • kathy

    Jim from the Chicago Trib (forgot his name) is saying this could give McCain an edge because he could remind people he’s the one with experience. I don’t see it. “I’m the one with experience, so if we invade another country 9 days before the election you better put me in charge of the situation.”

  • kathy

    Jim Warren. bad brain day.

  • wvng

    Kathy, are you perhaps referring to a post of yours that is still in moderation? Otherwise, I’m not sure what “this could give McCain an edge” refers to.

    And maybe this question will go into moderation as well.

  • kathy

    wvng – referring to the comment before that one, the story about US helicopters raiding a Syrian village.

    McCain, by the way, “guaranteed a victory” on MTP today. Some polls have him tightening. It’s going to be a long 9 days. Thank God for the votes that are already in the bank.

  • incandenzah

    Michael, I read over your voter registration “fraud” section again and still can’t see how it affects voting, except for the fact that the Republicans pretend it’s a big deal and institute draconian ID measures to counteract (?) fear of “fake” people voting in large enough numbers to swing an election. I mean have you actually seen or heard of this happening? Have there been any successful prosecutions of even small-scale plots to affect the election through false registration? I submit that it’s just GOP pretense (as Kathy also suggests, above). If you have evidence otherwise, I’d love to see it. But for now, it seems to me that you’ve included a non-issue in your list of election-day problems.

  • kathy

    Oh drat – I didn’t notice it was in moderation. I hate how it shows your comment to you even when it’s disappeared. We’ve apparently offed 8 people in Syria. israel confirmed.

  • cfukara

    Kathy:
    ” .. more information about SP’s complicated religious affiliations. I think they’re the principal reason McCain’s not bringing up Wright. ..”
    McCain also has his cross to bear – the Rev Hagee, Rev Parsley and Rev Falwell.
    Indeed, McCain and his band of anti-social radicals cannot be held to civilized standards of “reason”.
    My suspicion is that they will spring that (and other hate allegations that they have not hurled at us so far but have probably been tested for ‘fear factor’ in focus groups) as a “3AM surprise” during the final hours of the campaign – leaving the Obama camp without adequate time to respond.
    [I hope that the Obama camp has contingency measures and ads in place ..]

  • wvng

    kathy: “McCain, by the way, “guaranteed a victory” on MTP today.”

    True. He also continues to gush about Palin. This, after any number of serious Republican individuals and organizations have endorsed Obama because, in no small part, he chose Palin. Including Palin’s home state paper.

    The word “delusional” comes to mind.

    Noe we will see if this gets past the moderator.

  • wvng

    Well, the word delusional makes it past the moderator.

    At least it did last time.

    So, here is a question. When comments come out of moderation, assuming they do, are they inserted at the location where they were posted. Or at the end. For example, on my screen post 24 is one of mine held in moderation. But there are no numbering gaps from 1 to 61, and I know others are in moderation as we try to talk.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    But perhaps we should start a new blog to carry on discussions that we would like to carry on here but cannot because we are in moderation limbo.

    We’ve done that. http://www.politicallagoon.blogspot.com

  • Paul-no not that one

    jay, maybe I’m the last to know, but how long have you, Dirks, and Stu had that blog up?

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    On electronic voting machines, bad idea. For that matter, optical scans are a bad idea.

    Electronic voting is an especially bad idea because the systems can never be properly tested. The environment they operate in only exists on election day, and cannot be simulated effectively. It’s not like electronic slots or ATMs that are heavily used all the time. It’s also a complicated application that has to be implemented different at the lowest level of voting–that is, somebody knowledgeable has to enter the proper data for each race, supervised by the equivalent of pollwatchers. I’m pretty sure that doesn’t happen. This is inherently not secure.

    The voters see the machines too infrequently to be trusted to know how to use them. This means both slow voting and too frequent intervention on the part of pollworkers, which could change votes.

    All of these problems, plus increased expense, gets introduced for no real benefit. All the machines do that traditional hand tabulation at the precinct level, run by non-partisan pollworkers, observed by partisan pollwatchers from both sides, don’t do is produce the result faster.

    Speed of result is not an important feature in voting systems. There are long delays between elections and inaugurations. There is no benefit to knowing the result even a day earlier than alternative methods that provide a more accurate and auditable result.

    Paper ballots and purple fingers provide a much better system than any touch screen voting system. the only plausible reason for the introduction of these systems is incompetence and graft on the part of people who run the election systems.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    NNTO–

    Just before I left for Vermont in Sept, say the 15th or so.

    Casey Morris suggested it, one weekend with little content being posted. I met with Stuart here in the City. He and I worked out the details.

    If people had known about it, it would have helped during this outage. KT put up a post with a link to one her time.com articles….

  • wvng

    well, jay, i tried posting at your bypass site but can’t seem to get the wordpress sign in to work. Sigh.

  • anon76

    EV prediction: 397 Obama (74% of all EVs)
    Popular vote predictions: 53% Obama, 46%
    Senate seats: 60 dems (counting Lieberman + Vermont- 60% of all seats)
    House seats: 257 dems (59% of all seats)
    Governorships: 29 dems (58% of all)

  • wvng

    And now my question to jay on signing in at his alternate site is awaiting moderation.

    Perhaps this one will too.

  • Paul-no not that one

    Very cool jay. And nice job having a KT link.
    That I wasn’t aware suggest your blog(bad word that would get this comment moderated) needs work though!
    I will be checking it out.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    PoliticalLagoon probably requires a logon to blogger in order to comment.

  • andyfrommassachusetts

    good post

  • wvng

    Sad thing is that MS put up a post that would have generated excellent conversation if it was actually possible to have a conversation with a “Moderatron random post kickout machine” in place.

    I suggest that the high sheriffs might look into this process a bit more, and let us know when the process is actually, really, truly working.

    If this makes it past moderation.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    well, jay, i tried posting at your bypass site but can’t seem to get the wordpress sign in to work. Sigh

    Nothing to do with WordPress or TIME.

    This moderation feature is especially bad for discussion because it interpolates the comments when they are released. And, of course, it iwll be natural for people to refer to post numbers, which are not stable in this system. For this moderation system to work, moderation will require a full time resource.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    : “Yet the problem of registration fraud is age-old…. The problem is that a small fraction of those new voters don’t exist.”

    Yes, and because of those problems, there is a non-partisan government agency at the local level that confirms that registrations are valid. This is a solved problem. And it’s inaccurate to call them “voters.” It makes it sound like someone can show up, say “I am Mickey Mouse” and cast a ballot. First, Mickey won’t be on the roll. Second, the partisan pollwatchers are gonna notice. Third, you can’t do this in bulk.

    You can if you control enough precincts in a machine city. bank people who have died (leave them on the roll), and vote absentee on their behalf. But that won’t work forever, is illegal, and is not registration fraud. There are other ways to falsify valid voters. But they have to be done en masse, by someone who controls the putatively nonpartisan process of processing valid voters. Banking dead voters means somehow circumventing the process of mailing absentee ballots to the voter, and requires an entirely corrupt local election office. That’s not to say it hasn’t happened. But it is not a modern problem and has nothing to do with ACORN or any other entity, filing registration forms for non-existent citizens.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    I realized that the post before this one may have been too succinct. The way this is working now is that a post released from moderation does not get a timestamp equal to the time released, but to the time posted. So a comment that is new to everyone except the poster doesn’t appear at the bottom of the list of posts, but in the middle somewhere. The presumption, when you see “87″ replace “67″ is that you will find 20 new posts appended since you last refreshed. Having the last post be the same one you saw at the previous refresh, at the end of a longer list of comments is just, um, wrong. If this methodology is required, some way of indicating that a post is new and unread would necessary.

    An unthreaded interface like this one (which I’m fine with) can’t stick comments new to the reader in the middle of the comment stream.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    Darnitall. Last two in moderation.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    They’ll work on it tomorrow and get it all fixed. It’s the weekend.

  • ivb3016

    Jayackroyd pointed out at 5:41 the thing that is the real problem. I can adjust to the new interface, but that is going to make it very messy.
    .
    The comments have been released from moderation, but the one that I wrote at 10:53 won’t be seen by lynnanne to whom it was addressed because she won’t know she should go back and look. When I realized it was held, I said essentially the same thing to her in a later comment, but the example is what makes it really hard. We saw the same thing when Kathy made reference to a comment she didn’t realize was held and none of us knew what she was talking about.

  • gysgt213
  • anon76

    Rough problem- its now nearly impossible to interact, yet we no longer have to scroll by the troll posts. I’ve given up freedom in order to avoid the nutsos. Very meta for a political blog.

    On the upside, I like having the numbers next to the posts.

  • jcapan

    Testing…

  • archimedesncarlsbad

    sorry to be so slow to the commenter tradition at swampland.
    .
    i have been reading comments for some time and was prepared to respond late last week, when, swampland went down.
    .
    that said, i just barely read the post at commentary from klein’s extremis post. i haven’t read commentary since college–before the internet i’m afraid.
    .
    it’s gone downhill

  • jcapan

    Am I in moderation? Am I blacklisted? It seems that I’m in a land of really small people (image: Bill Murray on an elevator), and they’re all speaking Japanese for some reason). Is this what you do to those of us who get nasty with Mikey?

    Finger raised–moderate this f-ers!

  • jcapan

    And if I ever do get out of exile/moderation, I 2nd Rose’s contention above, that Obama gains a mandate despite myriad anti-democratic electoral games.

    And I also 2nd anon76 re: the numbers; however, use bold for name or shift them to the left too.

  • pirate wench (demwoman)

    Geez – I’m going to wait another day or two until this moderation thing gets worked out! In addition to being frustrating for posters, it’s frustrating to read about a comment being stuck in moderation after it’s already been posted. It’s like the twilight zone in here :) .

    Maybe tomorrow, when the sheriffs come back from their weekend of bacchanalia, they’ll fix this up?

  • mapguy23

    OT and apropos of maybe nothing, but out here in suddenly interesting flyover country (Rocky Mountain West), it is not hard to see the writing on the wall.

    McCain visits Albuquerque on 10/25, and draws 1,400.
    Obama visits Albuquerque on 10/25 and draws 45,000.

    McCain visits Denver on 10/24 and draws 4,000.
    Obama visits Denver on 10/26 and draws well in excess of 100,000.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Watching Meet The Press re-broadcast. Tom Brokaw makes me sleepy.

  • newfloridian

    Changed name folks, new set up wouldn’t recognize my last password. Hate the new format, need to go back to the old format. Apparently they need to end moderation, there is a great deal of communications between the parties here on Swampland and that is getting in the way.

    By the way gysgt213, my computer with ME finally died when the computer starts making clocking sounds it is about over. I guess now no one in America is on Microsoft ME. Anyway will be on XP shortly after I get the new computer.

    Do like the absence of trolls.

    Thought Brokaw was really hard on McCain for a change. Once I thought McCain was going to blow a gasket in response to Brokaw’s probing questions. The smile is just horrible!!

  • kathy

    mapguy – I knew Obama’s numbers, hadn’t seen McCain’s. That’s an incredible difference. There seem to be two streams out there in MSM land. Those who say it’s all over, there’s no way McCain can do this, and those talking about how much support SP has in Pennsylvania, and how the lead is tightening. Thank God for Nate Silver.

  • kathy

    Hadn’t noticed my comment came out of moderation. This is so weird, because you have to read the whole thread over, guessing at what wasn’t there before, while it isn’t in juxtaposition to other comments it was designed to respond to. We’re lost in the fog. Jayack: Political Lagoon is going to prove the most apt name for a blog. But we’ll hope the High Sheriffs make progress tomorrow. Though as I noted elsewhere, the host has this problem over at Mudflats too, and it requires her spending a lot of time reading comments and releasing them. must be a wordpress specific problem, so I’m not sure the sheriffs will be able to solve it as long as we stay with this format.

  • rose83

    I don’t want to sound paranoid but…
    I have become a little less confident about the election after spending some time researching voting machine problems. Obama needs to keep up his margins in the swing states.
    OTOH, Obama is an expert on voting rights and I’m optimistic that his campaign is aware of all the possible problems.

    Having an election without a paper trail is like flying a 747 without a co-pilot. It’s an unnecessary risk, and an embarrassment to a wealthy democracy.

  • gysgt213

    This funny. Check out the lady behind McCain in this video. Have they already replaced Sarah?

    http://wonkette.com/403831/lady-at-mccain-rally-thinks-she-is-sarah-palin

  • Paul-no not that one

    Ha Gunny, I was going to say Bachmann until she acknowledged “her” applause.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    Ah. WVNG has implemented a good idea. What you may want to do with a comment in moderation is copy and paste it to the PoliticalLagoon blog, until they get this fixed, especially if it’s a response to another comment. And then c&p back to here if it seems worthwhile.

    Cumbersome, I know, but until the thread is set by pub time rather than post time, it allows the conversation to limp along. Or they find some other solution to the current fragmentation.

    I do want to repeat that there is no point in stamping feet and calling names about these problems. I’m sure they know about them, I’m sure they care, and I’m sure they are trying to fix them as quickly, as solidly and cheaply as they can (as we say in the business, you get to pick two of those three.) And if you’re gonna complain about “cheap” being in the equation, do note that the only price you’re paying to be here is setting your browser to block popups, and occasionally mistakingly scrolling over the ad that top.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    There is also an irritating posting delay, probably also caused by the moderation feature scanning the post for offensive content. Not a showstopper, but without a preview feature, one does like to double check following a post.

    (Suggestion: have the tech guys put up a complaint about the interface thread, or set up a complaint mail-to to increase the siganl to noise ratio in threads.)

  • jarais

    Gunny, thanks for the link. She looks like she has her Halloween costume picked out already. I know three people who have decided to dress up as Sarah Palin this year – two women and a dude. As for me, I haven’t decided.

  • gysgt213

    Paul,

    If was Bachmann she would have been trying to get some tongue from McCain.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    OTOH, maybe my post that closed with a really nice, be patient with the tech folks paragrap, I’m sure they are doing the best they can and so on….ended up in moderation. It hasn’t shown up. But it was long.

  • lynnanne

    Hi, IVB — I am back, just saw your comment & thanks for the link; I will listen. (I am in downtown Philly, and suppose I need to get out to the suburbs or something to canvass.) Gunny – generous of you to send AMC some funds. Perhaps I should do the same, but I think maybe I’ll wait to send her on a different mission. Anywhere BUT the McCain plane, in other words. She needs to break her McCain addiction.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    I know three people who have decided to dress up as Sarah Palin this year – two women and a dude.

    A local, free broadsheet fishwrap (“Metro”) had two pages of ads for Halloween costumes, several Palin variations.

    Myself, I prefer the Diabelli variations.

  • Ohg Rea Tone

    What else could go wrong. We live in Punkin Center, Mo. and things is wrong enough. We listened to that McCain fella on the radio and it sounds like there is two birds in that Bush. We may be country rednecks but we is voting for Obama. ………………

    http://thefiresidepost.com/2008/10/26/missourians-for-obama/

  • lynnanne

    Hmmm. Now MY comment is awaiting moderation.

  • http://www.inworldstudios.com jayackroyd

    lynnanne, I had something to say to you earlier about technology and voting, but I gave up. Tomorrow?

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Barack Obama wants to take the very best comments submitted for moderation by the best commenters and approve them on behalf of the lamest commenters.

  • gysgt213

    FORT COLLINS — Barack Obama took the stage at Colorado State University to the applause of thousands of screaming supporters.
    .
    “Thank you CSU! This is pretty out here. I should’ve gone to school here,” he said to the sea of people.
    .
    Security officials had to stop screening those in line as the line stretched for 21/2 miles through the campus. About 15 minutes before the event was to begin, they decided to just let the crowds in. It’s not unprecedented for security to let crowds in when the line grows too long, but they keep the unscreened supporters farther back, Obama’s campaign said.
    .
    Obama took the stage at 3:30 p.m., urging the crowd to vote early.
    .
    “It’s easy. It’s fun. You will feel morally superior while those lazy procrastinators wait until Nov. 4,” he said.
    .
    http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_10822456

  • jarais

    Funny, pourmecoffee. I guess John McCain wants to renew the system in which the best commenters are unrestricted in their ability to make the best comments. These awesome comments will, in theory, trickle down to the lamest commenters. In reality? Probably not.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Sarah Palin wants only the “Real Commenters” from good hard working IP Addresses (172.xx.xxx.xx through 185.xx.xxx.xx) to be approved.

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Bob Barr opposes any form of moderation. Ralph Nader wants to ban all “.com” and allow only “.org” domains.

  • jarais

    But what about Cynthia McKinney?

  • http://pourmecoffee.blogspot.com pourmecoffee

    Hmmm … McKinney … McKinney demands reparations for previously submitted and rejected comments?

  • http://www.ghostnote.com Cookie Puss

    Does the moderation really work? Penis wrinkle.

  • carotexas1

    Our small town changed to computer voting two years ago.
    I was overjoyed as my husband a Republican always cancelled my vote, I knew I had won the war. He is computer illiterate.

  • wvng

    And the msm wants comments to be carefully balanced and washed of all objective meaning. Balance means, of course, that anything a Republican says is acceptable, and centrist journalists count for liberals. No actual liberals allowed.

  • jcapan

    W … T … F!?

    I don’t even get any awaiting moderation nonsense. Am I banished?

  • newfloridian

    This is addressed to the moderator, this is no longer America this is not freedom of speech! This is political control of web site comments. Apparently only Republicans or milk toast comments from mthe iddle of the road types are allowed to comment on this blog site now. I will be cancelling my subscription to Time magazine.

  • http://phd9.blogspot.com Paul Dirks

    The moderator is a robot.
    Consider it a fine example of what happens when you trust a computer to do a human’s job and then consider again how much safer we are thanks to NSA datamining.

  • newfloridian

    First comment got wiped out by moderator, just telling gysgt213 I no longer have the old computer as it developed a strange clicking sound which is the sound of a hard drive going down. No longer the last person running Microsoft ME.

    Lets see if this gets by the moderator… Joe Lieberman is down here in Tampa telling lies. Claiming John McCain is the only candidate ready to be President. If I did not have a morning meeting I would love to show up at Alessi’s Bakery in the morning and ask him if John McCain dies on day one, is Sarah Palin ready to be President?

  • newfloridian

    I think the moderator has been turned off folks, two immediate posts.

  • jcapan

    spank my arse and call me judy?

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